Ultimate_Game Posted May 20, 2012 Author Posted May 20, 2012 RCB not winning championship was due to choking. I will never agree CSK has a great bowling line up. Infact i would rank 6th or 7th in terms of bowling quality. Other teams had far supeior bowlers. But they managed to hide their weaknesses with extraordinary fielding and good batting. Basically batsmen and bowlers have to complement each other. Above all you have to learn to play as a team not a bunch of individuals. In that case I would say that a team with poor bowling tends to choke lot more. As for CSK they have a decent attack for their home games and most of the IPL venues. They made a mistake in letting Murali go which hurt them this season and that's why their bowling is not as strong which can be seen in their results this year. I am sure Dhoni understands it and will go for a good bowler next season. But in any case Chennai bowling attack was still way ahead of Bangalore's. B'lore don't have even one good bowler in their lineup - Zaheer is past it and as for others :hysterical:
Sehwag1830 Posted May 20, 2012 Posted May 20, 2012 LOL at you lot blaming Gayle. They should have chased 136 without him against an attack that has only Steyn as its world class bowler. On the topic, bowling is as important as batting in T20s. Case in point - Trinidad & Tobago. No, i am not blaming at all. I was just saying for the first time he started to go against the main bowlers of opposition team. And see the result. He should have stuck to 35 of 30 and then 80 of next 35.
vvvslaxman Posted May 20, 2012 Posted May 20, 2012 http://www.espncricinfo.com/ipl/engine/current/match/336040.html Royals final match vs chennai 2007 great bowling line up? http://www.espncricinfo.com/ipl2009/engine/current/match/392239.html DC vs RCB at Johansburg.. 2009 great bowling line up? http://www.espncricinfo.com/ipl2010/engine/current/match/419165.html MI vs CSK at Mumbai Honestly tell me which team got better bowling line up
Sehwag1830 Posted May 20, 2012 Posted May 20, 2012 LOL at you lot blaming Gayle. They should have chased 136 without him against an attack that has only Steyn as its world class bowler. On the topic, bowling is as important as batting in T20s. Case in point - Trinidad & Tobago. No, i am not blaming at all. I was just saying for the first time he started to go against the main bowlers of opposition team. And see the result. He should have stuck to 35 of 30 and then 80 of next 35.
Ultimate_Game Posted May 20, 2012 Author Posted May 20, 2012 RCB not winning championship was due to choking. I will never agree CSK has a great bowling line up. Infact i would rank 6th or 7th in terms of bowling quality. Other teams had far supeior bowlers. But they managed to hide their weaknesses with extraordinary fielding and good batting. Basically batsmen and bowlers have to complement each other. Above all you have to learn to play as a team not a bunch of individuals. In that case I would say that a team with poor bowling tends to choke lot more. As for CSK they have a decent attack for their home games and most of the IPL venues. They made a mistake in letting Murali go which hurt them this season and that's why their bowling is not as strong which can be seen in their results this year. I am sure Dhoni understands it and will go for a good bowler next season. But in any case Chennai bowling attack was still way ahead of Bangalore's. B'lore don't have even one good bowler in their lineup - Zaheer is past it and as for others :hysterical:
vvvslaxman Posted May 20, 2012 Posted May 20, 2012 In that case I would say that a team with poor bowling tends to choke lot more. As for CSK they have a decent attack for their home games and most of the IPL venues. They made a mistake in letting Murali go which hurt them this season and that's why their bowling is not as strong which can be seen in their results this year. I am sure Dhoni understands it and will go for a good bowler next season. But in any case Chennai bowling attack was still way ahead of Bangalore's. B'lore don't have even one good bowler in their lineup - Zaheer is past it and as for others :hysterical: Great bowling alone won't giurantee you win. Punjab bowling attack this season was far supieror to many sides. Where did they go wrong.. atleast in couple of matches their fielding let them down. All departments have to come together. This DC team failed to defend so many big totals htis season despite having Steyn. Especially in the business end of the tournament, there are so many factors that have to come together. Most important factor will be mental.
Sehwag1830 Posted May 20, 2012 Posted May 20, 2012 Great bowling alone won't giurantee you win. Punjab bowling attack this season was far supieror to many sides. Where did they go wrong.. atleast in couple of matches their fielding let them down. All departments have to come together. This DC team failed to defend so many big totals htis season despite having Steyn. Especially in the business end of the tournament' date=' there are so many factors that have to come together. Most important factor will be mental.[/quote'] A team with great bowling attack won't get molested like India 0-8.
Number Posted May 20, 2012 Posted May 20, 2012 VVVS I agree with you that team needs to be balanced. And Both departments along with fielding should be strong. But CSK bowling is fairly good because 1. They don't have Indian Trundler apart from a few games ,that alone makes them better than half the sides. :haha: 2. Ashwin is very good for the home track. Always there in best economy rates and bowls in powerplay too.
Ultimate_Game Posted May 20, 2012 Author Posted May 20, 2012 http://www.espncricinfo.com/ipl/engine/current/match/336040.html Royals final match vs chennai 2007 great bowling line up? http://www.espncricinfo.com/ipl2009/engine/current/match/392239.html DC vs RCB at Johansburg.. 2009 great bowling line up? http://www.espncricinfo.com/ipl2010/engine/current/match/419165.html MI vs CSK at Mumbai Honestly tell me which team got better bowling line up Let me put it differently. If we had to pick a side where I get to pick the bowlers I want and you had to pick a side with the batsmen of your choice I have no doubt my team would trump yours. For example for T20s my first 5 picks would be - Malinga, Naraine, Ajmal, Gul, Morkel/Steyn. I am sure I can pick any of the batsmen left and my team would do pretty well coz any team will have to score against this bowling attack. I would open with Malinga & Morkel/Steyn, in the middle overs Ajmal & Naraine can take over and in the end Gul & Malinga will take care of bowling yorkers at the death. Pretty sad that no Indian name shows up and this tells you why India has lost 6 straight super 6 matches over the last 2 T20 Cups :((
youngindia Posted May 20, 2012 Posted May 20, 2012 i am telling in very simple words if they saved atleast 10/15 runs we shouldnt have discussed with this thread.. the problem with your thinking is simple. Operations Strategy and tactics. Vision. this "atleast 15 runs" reflects thinking at the lowest level.-i. operations the point made is about the strategic aspect of the game.
Ultimate_Game Posted May 20, 2012 Author Posted May 20, 2012 Great bowling alone won't giurantee you win. Punjab bowling attack this season was far supieror to many sides. Where did they go wrong.. atleast in couple of matches their fielding let them down. All departments have to come together. This DC team failed to defend so many big totals htis season despite having Steyn. Especially in the business end of the tournament' date=' there are so many factors that have to come together. Most important factor will be mental.[/quote'] Agreed that bowling alone won't guarantees you a win. Hell even a team consisting of Bradman, Sobers, Richards & WI quicks won't guarantee you a win but it definitely does enhance the probablity of you succeeding. A team with a good bowling attack will be in almost every game. They may still lose as they may come across a batsman in sublime form but overall they will win more often than not. As for DC the drop-off between Steyn and others is so huge he hasn't been able to make a big difference. Also, if Mumbai were smarter they would have gone for another bowler to support Malinga. Mumbai go for a new dasher at the top every year (Jacobs, Levy etc.) when they would be much better served finding another top quality bowler to complement Malinga.
youngindia Posted May 20, 2012 Posted May 20, 2012 http://www.espncricinfo.com/ipl/engine/current/match/336040.html Royals final match vs chennai 2007 great bowling line up? the only point here is other sides didn't have great attacks. Against lesser attacks like australia and pakistan in 2011 ,india may be able to pull through despite glaring bowling weaknesses .Against lesser attacks, csk may be able to pull through. as the quality and penetrativenes of the attack increase, don't expect the same. Australia and SA , even Pak have shut down batting sides many a time even in the shorter formats with strong bowling attacks.
Zelig Posted May 20, 2012 Posted May 20, 2012 Let me put it differently. If we had to pick a side where I get to pick the bowlers I want and you had to pick a side with the batsmen of your choice I have no doubt my team would trump yours. For example for T20s my first 5 picks would be - Malinga' date= Naraine, Ajmal, Gul, Morkel/Steyn. I am sure I can pick any of the batsmen left and my team would do pretty well coz any team will have to score against this bowling attack. I would open with Malinga & Morkel/Steyn, in the middle overs Ajmal & Naraine can take over and in the end Gul & Malinga will take care of bowling yorkers at the death. Pretty sad that no Indian name shows up and this tells you why India has lost 6 straight super 6 matches over the last 2 T20 Cups :(( Interesting..let me put down the teams. Bowling Strong 1. Watson 2. Marsh 3. Travis Birt 4. Owais Shah 5. Hodge 6. Azhar Mahmood 7. Morne Morkel 8. Malinga 9. Ajmal 10. Gul 11. Narine Batting Strong 1. Sehwag 2. Gayle 3. Warner 4. Gambhir 5. KP 6. ABDV 7. Afridi 8. Vettori 9. Umesh Yadav 10. Bollinger 11. Murali Should be a fun game? :hmmm:
vvvslaxman Posted May 20, 2012 Posted May 20, 2012 Let me put it differently. If we had to pick a side where I get to pick the bowlers I want and you had to pick a side with the batsmen of your choice I have no doubt my team would trump yours. For example for T20s my first 5 picks would be - Malinga' date= Naraine, Ajmal, Gul, Morkel/Steyn. I am sure I can pick any of the batsmen left and my team would do pretty well coz any team will have to score against this bowling attack. I would open with Malinga & Morkel/Steyn, in the middle overs Ajmal & Naraine can take over and in the end Gul & Malinga will take care of bowling yorkers at the death. Pretty sad that no Indian name shows up and this tells you why India has lost 6 straight super 6 matches over the last 2 T20 Cups :(( But if you have batsmen like Chitnis, Tiwary, can you win it. that s the question you suggest as if you can with total noobs if you have great bowling line up. No you can't . You need half decent batsmen to put up a total. Ajmal and Gul played for the same team. Remember how Hussey manhandled Ajmal. Anyone can smash any bowler in this T20 format at the international level.May be in IPL it is different. Steyn himself lost couple of matches for his team bowling at the death. Morkel until this season was a very poor bowler. Malinga and Narine are exceptions.
Magneto Posted May 20, 2012 Posted May 20, 2012 RCB did not have a performing batting line-up. Gayle was one man, and ABDV was the other. Mayank did well in limited opportunities. Kohli, Tiwary, Dilshan have been epic :fail:
fineleg Posted May 20, 2012 Posted May 20, 2012 Exhibit #1 - Wordcup2011 in Bombay (well Final in Bombay, but take the entire WC tournament) Team with the crappiest bowling attack amongst all won it. Even some minnows had better bowling attack than India (and better fielding too!!)
Sehwag1830 Posted May 20, 2012 Posted May 20, 2012 Exhibit #1 - Wordcup2011 in Bombay (well Final in Bombay, but take the entire WC tournament) Team with the crappiest bowling attack amongst all won it. Do you know Zaheer was the highest wicket taker and Yuvraj took 15 wickets too ?
Zelig Posted May 20, 2012 Posted May 20, 2012 RCB did not have a performing batting line-up. Gayle was one man, and ABDV was the other. Mayank did well in limited opportunities. Kohli, Tiwary, Dilshan have been epic :fail: RCB at least had Gayle, CSK have none. Faf started off well but cooled off (got injured too) in the last few matches and eventually got the axe.
Executioner Posted May 20, 2012 Posted May 20, 2012 Exhibit #1 - Wordcup2011 in Bombay (well Final in Bombay, but take the entire WC tournament) Team with the crappiest bowling attack amongst all won it. Even some minnows had better bowling attack than India (and better fielding too!!) On dead tracks, places where bowlers were carted to all parts of the grounf even the bowling of England was unable to take out Ireland. Even and Ireland VS Dutch battle was high scoring. well ofcourse, the bowlers bowled well, Zaheer khan and UV specially. Now in T20 WC the hopes are so SLIM
youngindia Posted May 20, 2012 Posted May 20, 2012 Exhibit #1 - Wordcup2011 in Bombay (well Final in Bombay, but take the entire WC tournament) Team with the crappiest bowling attack amongst all won it. Even some minnows had better bowling attack than India (and better fielding too!!) the same point. other sides didn't have a great attack. lee,tait,johnson were one wicket away from victory. against mcgrath/lee/gillespie? countries with better pace record didn't field their strongest attacks in the edition in years.one cannot rely on others producing below their best.
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