Are Indian fans applying a 'reverse Tebbit test'?

[1983-2011]

There's a minority of British-born India fans of Indian descent who give the England fans of Indian descent a hard time. They should pack it in and just watch the cricket, writes Rahul Tandon. It is more than 20 years since the Conservative politician Norman Tebbit proposed his infamous cricket test. If you have forgotten what it was or are too young to remember, here is a quick reminder. He suggested in an interview with the Los Angeles Times that Britons of South Asian origin should be asked which cricket team they supported. If they did not follow England and were fans of India or Pakistan, he felt that it showed that they had failed to integrate into British society. As a fanatical Indian fan I, like many others, was angry at his comments. He had failed to understand that many of us whose parents had come from South Asia to the UK have complex identities. We were proud to be British but also proud of our Indian roots. And cricket was where we could display that part of our identity. I remember my father, who forced us to watch the Queen's speech every Christmas, saying nobody is going to tell my family who they are going to support. So it would be interesting to see what Lord Tebbit would have made of the make-up of the crowd at Edgbaston for the Champions Trophy final on Sunday. The stadium was full of Indian fans, most of whom were young and had Birmingham or London accents. Many had Indian flags wrapped around them and were chanting "India zindabad" - long live India. During the rain, some played a game called spot-the-England-fan as it was hard to find supporters of the home side in some of the stands. But this match also showed me that maybe a new cricket test is emerging. The first signs of it came when England's Ravi Bopara came on to bowl. The 28-year-old was born in London. His parents settled in the capital after migrating from Punjab in India in the 1970s. For some Indian fans in the crowd, that meant that he should be playing for India. So as he ran in to bowl, a group of young Indian fans began a chant of "traitor, traitor, traitor". When he came out to bat there were pockets of fans booing and when he was dismissed there were huge celebrations in the ground. While I was standing in the queue to get a drink, an elderly England fan turned to me and asked: "Why are you giving Bopara such a hard time?" Before I could answer, a young Indian fan replied: "We hate him as he plays for England. He is a disgrace." He then quickly rushed off back to the match. I mumbled to the England fan that not all Indian fans felt like that, and in fact the majority of us thought that he was a great role model and that we wanted to see more British Asians turning out for England. Confused, the England fan just smiled and walked back to his seat. When I returned to mine, I noticed a Sikh fan wearing a turban a few rows ahead. He was not wearing an Indian top or carrying India's flag. He was proudly wearing an England shirt with the name of his favourite player, Monty Panesar, on the back. Every time England took a wicket he jumped up from his seat to cheer. That did not go down well with some of the Indian fans. About five moved to some seats closer to him and began chanting "spot the sell-out". Another shouted "coconut" - a derogatory term that means you are brown on the outside but white inside. On hearing the chants, the Sikh fan rushed angrily over to the Indian fans and started shouting at them. "How dare you describe me as a sell-out? I am proud of my culture and you have no right to have a go at me just because I am supporting England." At this stage a few stewards intervened and calmed the situation down. After the match I walked up to the Sikh fan and apologised for the behaviour of those Indian fans. Still angry he told me that they didn't know anything about their culture or India, "and [yet] they call me a sell-out". It reminded me of the anger I felt when Tebbit proposed his cricket test. Now more than 20 years on, a small minority of Indian fans seem to be trying to devise their own test. If you support England, in their eyes you have turned your back on your culture and heritage. My answer to them is simple. Just watch the cricket.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-23060582

[Captain of Bhangra]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-23060582

I saw that Sikh fan. Didn't see the incident though. Have to say each to their own. Also have to say there were a lot of plastic glory-hunters at these games. People who didn't know their **** from their off-stump, who were just jumping on the bandwagon because India are winning now. Idiots. Also have to say on the other hand, England fans of Indian descent I encountered were being similarly provocative. Like they had something extra to prove. The native English fans were a good laugh, had some decent banter with them...

[deathmonger]

The thing is about idols. Like you said - Watching SRT made you a Indian fan. In a few more generations with the likes of Panesar/Bopara Brit Indians will support England. Indian origin ppl in WI/SA support WI/SA as their immigration happened earlier and now they are fully integrated.

[Crookbond]

You can support who ever the hell you want irrespective of your nationality. It is a personal choice - it does not make you a traitor. This is a sport FFS.

[deathmonger]

You can support who ever the hell you want irrespective of your nationality. It is a personal choice - it does not make you a traitor. This is a sport FFS.

Hey, we have/had our own tebbit test in India - relating to muslims/Pakistan (although has died down a lot now) and it has led to lots of tension/bad blood.

[hassan_113]

I'm afraid that there are a lot of Pakistan and India "fans" who get tickets for these big games just to prove a point or fight. That's why the real fans don't end up getting tickets at times.

[Crookbond]

Hey' date=' we have/had our own tebbit test in India - relating to muslims/Pakistan (although has died down a lot now) and it has led to lots of tension/bad blood.[/quote'] I don't see the point there too. I would have a problem if they supported the Pakistani army over the Indian ones and then I could question his patriotism etc. For a sport - no way! I had a Muslim friend who ardently supported India (I know him since we were kids). One day a random dude from an opposite cricket team (university level) who were playing with us walks up to my friend and says Pakistani. It fired all of us up; particularly me. It got to our heads and he was targeted with bouncers continuously for the next 8 overs. He ended up with a fractured thumb from me, a hit on the back of the helmet from my co-fast bowler and a sever bruise below the knee from a 3rd bowler ( he bowled it so fast that it hit him through the pads). I hope that teaches him a lesson.

[flamy]

Coconut - :hysterical: EPIC!

[kubrickian]

Indians in UK should be free to support whoever they want but I have to say, booing the team which represents the country you live in should be discouraged. It doesnt look classy and reflects badly on Indians in general. I have seen this happening a few times when India played England in the past on tv and it made me feel awkward. I dont understand why some people do this. Am I missing something here ? Is it considered not a big deal in UK ? I would find it very rude if a bunch of English dudes boo Indian team all the time in an Ind Vs Eng game in India. I wouldnt mind them if they supported England though. In fact, crowds in India dont do this to oppositions AFAIK. Crowds in foreign countries are supposed to behave much better but it seems to be the opposite. Obviously, only a small section of people do this and we shouldnt generalize the whole crowd but I hope they behave much better in the future.

[deathmonger]

I don't see the point there too. I would have a problem if they supported the Pakistani army over the Indian ones and then I could question his patriotism etc. For a sport - no way! I had a Muslim friend who ardently supported India (I know him since we were kids). One day a random dude from an opposite cricket team (university level) who were playing with us walks up to my friend and says Pakistani. It fired all of us up; particularly me. It got to our heads and he was targeted with bouncers continuously for the next 8 overs. He ended up with a fractured thumb from me, a hit on the back of the helmet from my co-fast bowler and a sever bruise below the knee from a 3rd bowler ( he bowled it so fast that it hit him through the pads). I hope that teaches him a lesson.

Back in the day Pakistan was supposed to be this great Islamic hope, so many muslims had a soft corner for Pakistan (especially the older ones). This was usually in the northern parts of the country amongst the Urdu speaking ones. Southern Mallu/Tamil etc muslims never had this factor as they never were a part of the Pakistan movement etc etc. This was a big factor in the late 80s Sharjah matches where Sena-muslim clashes took place. It's non existent now. But the newer generation of muslims who were not a part of this Pakistan movement have no soft corner for Pakistan and support India like the other non-muslims do. Also what Pakistan has become (a place where muslims are killing each other off) has kind of removed the sheen of the great 'Islamic' hope. As for your friend, many people like to call Muslims Pakistanis as an insult and to hurt - for calling someone Pakistani is shorthand for saying - you don't belong here.

[deathmonger]

Indians in UK should be free to support whoever they want but I have to say, booing the team which represents the country you live in should be discouraged. It doesnt look classy and reflects badly on Indians in general. I have seen this happening a few times when India played England in the past on tv and it made me feel awkward. I dont understand why some people do this. Am I missing something here ? Is it considered not a big deal in UK ? I would find it very rude if a bunch of English dudes boo Indian team all the time in an Ind Vs Eng game in India. I wouldnt mind them if they supported England though. In fact, crowds in India dont do this to oppositions AFAIK. Crowds in foreign countries are supposed to behave much better but it seems to be the opposite. Obviously, only a small section of people do this and we shouldnt generalize the whole crowd but I hope they behave much better in the future.

With time they'll start supporting England. 20-30 years later.

[Captain of Bhangra]

On the flip-side, a BBC Asian Network Radio presenter, by the name of Dipps Bhamrah, angered many India fans during/after the final. He was telling British Indians they should support England like he was. The responses, whilst angry, weren't that he was a "coconut", they were more along the lines of "who are you to tell us who we should choose to support?"... (see comments on this pic) https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10152979631610381&set=a.276893845380.314551.21750735380&type=1&theater

[VRV Singh]

I sympathise with the Sikh England supporter but am not surprised about the treatment he got. Frankly there is a large section of idiots among the British Indian support that take the idea of support as an excuse to be yobbish. And they would have no decent answer to what he correctly says regarding culture. Tangential instance - seeing groups of British Indian youths chanting absolutely obscene verses about Pakistanis at games in this CT. It does not exactly relate to the article's point about a reverse Tebbit test but it gives you an idea of the mentality that unfortunately appears to permeate more and more and embarrass British Indian fans such as myself.

[G_B_]

support who you want. That should end the discussion. I dont know what booing achieves anyways. @deathmonger 3rd and 4th gen immigrants are still supporting India/Pakista/Bangladesh. It wont happen in another 20-30 years. Thats for sure. Every time India play in Durban south africa, i have noticed that India always edge out South africa in terms of support. Now sure how of the Indians in south africa support India. Hell they flocked to the IPL in large numbers.

[G_B_]

btw i am sure the likes of monty and bopara grew up supporting India anyways. Both have always claimed that sachin was their idol. for all we know ravi might be the one booing the england team.

[deathmonger]

support who you want. That should end the discussion. I dont know what booing achieves anyways. @deathmonger 3rd and 4th gen immigrants are still supporting India/Pakista/Bangladesh. It wont happen in another 20-30 years. Thats for sure. Every time India play in Durban south africa, i have noticed that India always edge out South africa in terms of support. Now sure how of the Indians in south africa support India. Hell they flocked to the IPL in large numbers.

Will take more time I guess. WI supporters of Indian origin support WI I'm guessing? Their immigration took place years ago. Maybe it has to do with icons? WI have had plenty of Indian origin players - Kallicharan, Chanderpaul, Rampaul, Sarwan, Narine etc. In SA are they ppl born in India or ppl born in SA? With ppl like Amla, Panesar etc prolly change will happen - will take time though. In 20-30 years the % supporting home teams will increase a lot though. I mean, if you look at it - even Australians are just Englishmen who migrated way back.

[deathmonger]

btw i am sure the likes of monty and bopara grew up supporting India anyways. Both have always claimed that sachin was their idol. for all we know ravi might be the one booing the england team.

This is for sure. But then again they can't play for the Indian team so they play for the England team. And if Ravi had not been a cricketer he may have turned up in the stands booing the Eng team.

[Captain of Bhangra]

btw i am sure the likes of monty and bopara grew up supporting India anyways. Both have always claimed that sachin was their idol. for all we know ravi might be the one booing the england team.

I remember they both seemed happy on Twitter when we won the World Cup, particularly Monty. Obviously not so much happiness for Ravi this time, and Monty also did well to keep quiet after 2011 when the English turned on him for "helping" Sachin practice...

[hhunaeh]

If there ever was a sport which both India and america played, would this happen with 2nd or 3rd generation american kids?I may be wrong, but i don't think this would happen in usa.

[Crookbond]

This is for sure. But then again they can't play for the Indian team so they play for the England team. And if Ravi had not been a cricketer he may have turned up in the stands booing the Eng team.

He might have been a very average supporter, much like the cricket player he is.