Selfish Hayden cost Australia '05 Ashes

[zubinpepsi]

phew this ranting of SRT and all these old farts comments and comments like other countries wudnt have sustained with such a player all turning out to b a big joke really.... all the legends have been persisted with inspite of their poor form jus because of their proven past performance..... and theres nothing wrong in giving SRT tht kinda leeway cuz everyone knows tht he has the ability to bounce back and he has done no of times... seriously only Indian fans have the temerity to call someone like SRT as an old fart.. says so much about his attitude..

[Gambit]

Gibbs from Jan 2005 till today: 23 tests 1009 runs@26 And this despite me being too tired to take out the minnows :hysterical: Seriously, what is this joker doing in the RSA team?

[bharat297]

This thread started off about Hayden, and still no one has actually responded to the question of why he wasnt dropped after the 4th test in England. His record then was worse than Sachin's since SRL 05. He was not injured, whereas Sachin had to deal with 2 injuries. He was the same age then as Sachin is now. Australia were losing. They were down 2-1 at the time. His century in the 5th test took up 2 days of batting, and pretty much cost Australia the Ashes. So why didnt they drop Hayden?

[Lurker]

Since they are world champs' date=' people think their standards are higher. But shown in this thread, Hayden avging [b']30 in 16 tests, Gilly avging 22 in 16 tests, Ponting 19 over 11 tests, were not dropped because they were proven performers and selectors allowed them time to get back into form. Same is happening in SRT's case. Nothing that hasn't happened in Australia before.

Thats selective amnaesia sorry :sad_smile: For starters SRT has been cr@pping not for 16 or 11 tests. His average in last 25 tests is 35 so thats point number 1. Point number 2. After that 16 tests Hayden responded with series of averages 89 and 53. After 11 tests Ponting responded with 83, 77, 85. And what has SRT responded with....Ghanta mera. By the way it is a little stupid to say Ponting averaged 19 in 11 tests when everyone knows that his average took a hit in India. Of the 11 mentioned test if you take away his series against India his average would be around 40 I reckon. xxx

[Guest BossBhai]

-- Removed on request of the user --

[Holysmoke]

He already has had that leeway. You are somehow suggesting that he is asked to retire after one series failure or two. Here let me remind you: http://www.indiancricketfans.com/showthread.php?t=61067&page=5 His performance in last few series. 2004/05 against Australia 9th in batting average :tomato: 2004/05 against SA 6th in batting average 2004/05 against Pakistan 4th in batting average 2005/06 against SL 5th in batting average 2005/06 against Pakistan 10th in batting average :tomato: 2006 England SRT 9th in batting averages :tomato: Seems pretty long leeway if you ask me!

Why dont you give stat's that are meaningful? for example, he was the 5th highest in batting averages in the recently concluded ind aus series.. surely thats pathetic. But if you look closely, he was the highest among Indian batsmen. That is whom we need to compare him with, if we are gonna drop him.....

[Guest BossBhai]

-- Removed on request of the user --

[Holysmoke]

So why didnt they drop Hayden?

Because they had faith in his ability, even when his performance took a hit. Sadly, people here doubt SRT's ability.

[Lurker]

Why dont you give stat's that are meaningful? for example, he was the 5th highest in batting averages in the recently concluded ind aus series.. surely thats pathetic. But if you look closely, he was the highest among Indian batsmen. That is whom we need to compare him with, if we are gonna drop him.....

Like what? Like this.

 
[B]Player            Runs    Inngs    No      Avg[/B]
 
R Dravid            878    25    4    41.81
SC Ganguly       871    25    2    37.87
VVS Laxman     865    25    5    43.25
MS Dhoni          780    25    1    32.50
W Jaffer            772    25    0    30.88
SR Tendulkar    762    25    1    31.75
V Sehwag         757    25    2    32.91
Yuvraj Singh       634    25    3    28.82
 
 

Yep man SRT sucks as good as that "Yuseless" Singh, I mean even Sehwag averages more darn!

[Lurker]

Are you willing to extend the same courtesey to SRT ? If not why ?

This has been responded already. 1) Compared to Ponting's 11 test SRT has been flopping for 25 and counting. 2) After 11 tests Ponting responded with 83, 77, 85, which series has SRT played like that recently?

[Holysmoke]

Like what? Like this.

 
[B]Player            Runs    Inngs    No      Avg[/B]
 
R Dravid            878    25    4    41.81
SC Ganguly       871    25    2    37.87
VVS Laxman     865    25    5    43.25
MS Dhoni          780    25    1    32.50
W Jaffer            772    25    0    30.88
SR Tendulkar    762    25    1    31.75
V Sehwag         757    25    2    32.91
Yuvraj Singh       634    25    3    28.82
 
 

Yep man SRT sucks as good as that "Yuseless" Singh, I mean even Sehwag averages more darn!

So you'd drop SRT and bring in Sehwag in his place?

[Lurker]

So you'd drop SRT and bring in Sehwag in his place?

Hmmm what kind of a lame rebuttal is that? You wanted stats, you got stats. Now do you find it within you to say okay maybe SRT sucks??? He is languishing as India's 6th best batsman(7th in average) for crying out aloud man.

[bharat297]

And counting? ... um he did ok in SAF in the 1st innings of each test, did well in England , and people are ignoring the Bangladesh series (which we didnt do when taking into account Gilly's stats). In fact the only stats people want to take into consideration are the stats in between his 2 injuries in 2005 and 2006. In any case, can u answer the question in my previous post? btw, all this crap about not caring about individual's performances if the team is winning is absolute rubbish. Does that mean Joginder Sharma gets a walk in to the T20 side for the next 10 games?

[Holysmoke]

Hmmm what kind of a lame rebuttal is that? You wanted stats' date=' you got stats. Now do you find it within you to say okay maybe SRT sucks??? He is languishing as India's 6th best batsman(7th in average) for crying out aloud man.[/quote'] Its not a rebuttal :S...I just want to know your line of thinking. I have never gone on proclaiming that he's been amazing in the last 2 years. I know he's not been up to the mark. But I wouldnt drop him from the test team, simply because I know what he's capable of, and I know he has the ability, the brains, the desire, and the work ethic to work on his game and come out better. Cant say that about Sehwag( brains, work ethic to iron out flaws in his game which are glaring), or Yuvraj..

[Ram]

What really really is amazing is that some people just keep harping on stats without context, blindly chanting the "Drop Sachin" Nama. The funny thing is, I wonder where these guys had disappeared to, when the recent English test series finished. Nobody was calling for Sachin to be dropped then. A few weeks later , someone had bought up his record in the last dozen tests and since he has averaged in the 30s , Eureka, they have all of a sudden found voice and ask him to be dropped. If you guys had maintained your calls for him to be axed after the Bangladesh tour, or even the English series, there will be some credibility in what you say, but harping on stats that you "discovered" quite late without knowing its context just smacks of duplicity. The fact of the matter is, not once in the last 2 years has Sachin has come close to being dropped from the test team, simply because that wasnt justifiable. And he is not this larger than life figure who can never be dropped. He was DROPPED from the one-day series in Bangladesh. All this talk of him averaging so and so is just opportunistic hindsight and nothing else. Quite unfortunate really.

[Yuvraj4Captaincy]

Tendulkars average is next to crap in the tests these days. I think he is in for the reputation but I think Pak and Aus series will be a big test for him.

[Ram]

Tendulkars average is next to crap in the tests these days. I think he is in for the reputation but I think Pak and Aus series will be a big test for him.

Its official : You know jack about cricket. Congratulations !

[Lurker]

Its not a rebuttal :S...I just want to know your line of thinking. I have never gone on proclaiming that he's been amazing in the last 2 years. I know he's not been up to the mark. But I wouldnt drop him from the test team' date= simply because I know what he's capable of, and I know he has the ability, the brains, the desire, and the work ethic to work on his game and come out better. Cant say that about Sehwag( brains, work ethic to iron out flaws in his game which are glaring), or Yuvraj..

And I suppose by the same token Dravid lacked every attribute you mentioned up above? Which is why you "understood" why he was dropped(from the LOI of course) ?

[Holysmoke]

And I suppose by the same token Dravid lacked every attribute you mentioned up above? Which is why you "understood" why he was dropped?

How many times will I mention this? ODI != Test. Now go read that thread again.

[Yuvraj4Captaincy]

Its official : You know jack about cricket. Congratulations !

Whats his average in last 15-20 tests?......emphasis on the word 'these days'. come again