Who is India's best pacer of all-time in Tests, ODIs and T20Is?

[zen]

Just now, Majestic said:

I didn't wrote anything against any player which is wrong. I am just saying facts.

 

Shami took a decade to reach the wickets tally that Kapil reached in 5 years. It will take Shami a decade more cricket to reach Kapil Dev 's wicket tally of 434. It's not like Kapil got to that mark at some terrible average. It was good considering the adversity in which he bowled.

 

First, do you know the title that you wrote - "Who is India's best pacer of all-time in Tests, ODIs and T20Is?" 

 

Today's top players tend to play 14-17 IPL games in just 2 months. 

 

No one cares about Kapil's tally. He did NOT deserve to play for so long in the first place. 

 

 

[Majestic]

11 minutes ago, zen said:

 

First, do you know the title that you wrote - "Who is India's best pacer of all-time in Tests, ODIs and T20Is?" 

 

Today's top players tend to play 14-17 IPL games in just 2 months. 

 

No one cares about Kapil's tally. He did NOT deserve to play for so long in the first place. 

 

 

Kapil bowled 56 overs over a period of 2 tests.

 

If there weren't that many bowling options, I am afraid their career would have been over by now.

 

Kapil's 5 years workload= Shami's 10 years workload. This is not to undermine Shami but Kapil was simply at another level and being a fast bowler, it is not easy to do so which is why he was the leading wicket taker.

[zen]

12 minutes ago, Majestic said:

Kapil bowled 56 overs over a period of 2 tests.

 

If there weren't that many bowling options, I am afraid their career would have been over by now.

 

Kapil's 5 years workload= Shami's 10 years workload. This is not to undermine Shami but Kapil was simply at another level and being a fast bowler, it is not easy to do so which is why he was the leading wicket taker.

Kapil Dev went through motions in many of the games. He took his place from granted. 

Bowling 56 overs over 2 tests means little in the context of big picture. 
 

No amount of cherry picking, running other players down, etc. will polish Kapil’s numbers. If Bhuvi played in that period for 100 tests, going through motions in many of them, he could have similar if not better numbers. 
 

At best, one can respect Kapil for being the key AR for India over the years. That does not translate to Ind’s best pacer (and when he was a trundler and even today ppl are circumspect with calling an Indian pacer fast. Many automatically assume that an Indian pacer would be a medium pacer / trundler). 
 

 

Edited June 9, 2023 by zen

[cricspirit]

1 hour ago, Majestic said:

Kapil bowled 56 overs over a period of 2 tests.

 

If there weren't that many bowling options, I am afraid their career would have been over by now.

 

Kapil's 5 years workload= Shami's 10 years workload. This is not to undermine Shami but Kapil was simply at another level and being a fast bowler, it is not easy to do so which is why he was the leading wicket taker.

 

Plus he was great on the field and batted more balls than other bowlers we are talking about. Meaning more workload.  Great fitness levels for the time without all the advantages many of these modern players have.

[zen]

Why Kapil is a better batsman than Vishwanath? Because Kapil bowled while Vishwanath did not. Kapil used to get tired while bowling and then come out to bat, while Vishwanath remained in relatively luxury to bat only. Additionally, Kapil was considered a better fielder so he ran more on the ground, while Vishwanath mainly remained inside the circle, grabbing on to catches that came straight to him. Therefore, Kapil spent 20% more energy on fielding. 

 

Based on Kapil bowling and fielding, along with higher fitness level, it is believed that Kapil was a better batsman than Vishwanath. 

[Vijy]

6 hours ago, zen said:

 

Quite a few bowlers even during Kapil's time such as Lillee, Marshall, Ambrose (debut 1988), Garner, Holding, Roberts, Walsh (debut 1984), Bishop (debut 1989), Hadlee, Imran, Akram (debut 1985), Waqar (debut 1989), ... 

 

PS Apart from the above, there used to be Craig McDermott, Bruce Reid, Merv Huges, Terry Alderman (destroyed Eng in Eng), etc. 

 

Btw, Bruce Reid if you remember:

 

 

yes, I remember bruce. I rate him as no. 3 best left-arm pacer of post-WW2 era. after davidson and akram (latter is placed a bit lower due to ball tampering and other "help" he received)

[Majestic]

Look at this game. Shami bowled well but barely has any success. He leaked 122 runs for just 2 wickets in first inning and no wicket in this inning.

 

Kapil often went through such periods because of no support and hence picking 400 wickets + is a great achievement by him.