Pakistan tour of New Zealand | 16th March - April 5th, 2025 | 5 T20Is, 3 ODIs

[Autonomous]

3 hours ago, singhvivek141 said:

You can't throw your youngsters in an unknown territory and then expect them to swim through. 

PCB need to be reasonable with the approach, if you want a team of youngsters then atleast give them and opportunity where they are most comfortable with i.e. in their own conditions or start with a weaker opposition.

 

But PCB being run by morons, don't have any knowledge or vision.

No. 

 

PCB is a moron for selecting these guys. They dont even have a decent domestic record

 

The only guy with decent domestic record is Agha. And his performance is there to see

[singhvivek141]

42 minutes ago, Autonomous said:

No. 

 

PCB is a moron for selecting these guys. They dont even have a decent domestic record

 

The only guy with decent domestic record is Agha. And his performance is there to see

I have heard the names of Haris, Jahsndad, Khushdil earlier as well. Some posters here were advocating for their inclusion. Shadab is trash but he comes back like a recycled bottle.

Who else could have replaced them ? please name a few.

 

Amongst bowlers, Shaheen is anyway untouchable, but I don't understand the fascination with Rauf.

Ali is mediocre but Jahandad has some skills based on the highlights.

[singhvivek141]

2 hours ago, CoverDrive said:

Already seeing pushback on selecting new guys from Babar fanbase. Actually babar is looking ok for few quick runs since his last break. He is struggling to build innings but with his better technique he could play a bit part in T20 and selectively get quick runs vs pace (similarly for Rizwan vs spin). But selfishness seem to run very deep and with not many alternatives (unlike here) coach and selectors cannot push them hard to change their approach. 

 

Therefore they need to keep faith with young guys and rotate some players to get a decent group. Abdul samad seems like someone who can hit big. Salman and few others like Saim are ok. 

 

Pak issue last few years has been lack of quality spin and hot and cold pacers

Pakistans entire batting generation is influenced badly due to Afridi.

Any batter who bats at a sedate pace with risk free cricket is called a tuk tuk and is blamed.

 

Babar has better SR than Williamson in both white ball formats. But Pak fans like the batters who can slog blindly in the cow corner and associate inability with "intent".

 

Just like Misbah, Younis were their best batsman 10 years back. Babar & Rizwan are now. But people fail to realize that.

[tapandrun]

talking of this series and this group only. most of these batters have sub 140 sr even at domestic levels and hardly few have more than 2-3 50 scores.

And they are playing as if they have done this before and are 160+ sr batters. Pak batters' most of the runs would have come on some of wkts where ball does not do much.

 

Trying to swing at everything seems to be mantra as if they are chasing 300 runs in t20s. 1st game was hard it was not a flat t20 wkt and the boundaries were big and batters are new so one can understand it but 2nd game small boundaries ball was not doing as much not able to maximize pp in 15 overs game, only good thing was they batted deep so able to get up 130+ even with wkts falling regularly.  

 

Some are suggesting to go back to babar -last time he was in nz it was the same case pak lost 4-1.  Nz got 200+ score 3 times (if recalling correctly) babar got some 3 50s back to back but in no stage of the game they were winning when babar was in there. he was playing for himself.

There are 3 ways to bat in modern day t20 cricket ::

• Be power hitters like Aus and Wi batters
• Play modern day shots -ramps, scoop, reverse ---largely able to manipulate the field
• Have a v.fast bat speed

Those are 3 ways to be a good batter if some1 have 2 of those they become v.good in t20s, do not think there is any place of classic copybook shots unless coupled with 1 of 3 ways.

 

 

 

 

Edited March 19, 2025 by tapandrun

[tapandrun]

6 hours ago, singhvivek141 said:

Pakistans entire batting generation is influenced badly due to Afridi.

Any batter who bats at a sedate pace with risk free cricket is called a tuk tuk and is blamed.

 

Babar has better SR than Williamson in both white ball formats. But Pak fans like the batters who can slog blindly in the cow corner and associate inability with "intent".

 

Just like Misbah, Younis were their best batsman 10 years back. Babar & Rizwan are now. But people fail to realize that.

The afridi influence was till sahzed and Umar akmal, after the it was Mishbha effect.

 

Younis was top test batter, v.unlike batters for sc he was not as technical good and copy book but found his own ways he could be top 3-4 best sweep shot players in the sc.

But no he was not a white ball player, when both misbah and him were on the crease they would get stuck and now score much , pak had a v.good bowling line-up at time of misbha specially for those pitches -ajmal +malik+hafeez was there afridi too. all 4 can spin the ball both ways can bat a bit.

 

Misbah was supposed to be the best batter in the line-up and yet he batter 5/6 never went up the order even when he was captain. He was playing for himself and was able to play the way he did because he hid bind it and kept on presenting as if he was doing for the team he had to play this way because by the time he was in 3-4 wkts were already down. And then score slow 40s, 60s.

 

He was the captain and supposed to be best batted at that time in the team why not come-up the order and save team from there, save team from collapse ???

This practice has creeped into pak batting now, batters are playing for themselves , yes most batters do that bat they have ability to up the scoring to which pak batters lacked and lacs till now.

 

Yes pak fans has a habit of overhyping any1 who can play some big shots, even 30-35 runs innings get too much hype and any1 who is out of the team is the best player in the cntry if not the wlrd.

 

but babar has huge following as well, only now they have realized that most of his runs have come against b/c/d sides playing on some low and slow wkts.

The only innings ppl can say that he played like a top batters are 100 vs nz in wc that was 125 ball 100 and needed quick scoring from other end by sohail 

The other is 150 wc chase vs Ind, game was already set up by the bowlers and they played steadily 

 

babar is technically good but his ways are out dated, he has issues with spin and high pace when asked to score quickly.

 

Him and rizwan have been opening for sometime now would you expect both of them nt to go bat in super-over in a wc match against an associate team which might be playing this kind of a team for the 1st. 

In Aus last t20i series when pak needed 80+ runs in 7-8 overs vs aus babar didnt come to open and the next match when score was sub 150 he went up again to open. 

    

 

Edited March 19, 2025 by tapandrun

[Strangering]

13 hours ago, tapandrun said:

this pak side looks like a club side it set-up itself, good thing is they bat deep.

• Openers have no clue how to face bounce, can not cut or pull
• lofted drives does not clear the circle and only shots batters know to play is towards legside
• ball hits the bat everywhere but the middle, like some club player the batter might be blaming the bat too after getting out. and saying opposition batters have better bats
• There is a leg-spinner in the team but he does not bowl.
• After 1 good over pacers have no clue how to bowl
• Pak fielding is anyways club level

This is a good approach to get a new core so that bad practices from previous group does not creep-in, but they need to get batter betters may be they are good but not getting good direction

 

 

The approach isn't terrible tbh. You're bound to lose a few series' if you are going to bank on fresh talent. They have to go through the motions to get better. SL has had to do that after Sanga/Jaya in ODIs and Tests. 

However, the worse they can do now is take the bad performance in this bi-lateral to remove the young talent for Babar/Riz etc. 

[tapandrun]

29 minutes ago, Strangering said:

The approach isn't terrible tbh. You're bound to lose a few series' if you are going to bank on fresh talent. They have to go through the motions to get better. SL has had to do that after Sanga/Jaya in ODIs and Tests. 

However, the worse they can do now is take the bad performance in this bi-lateral to remove the young talent for Babar/Riz etc. 

yes they took made dramatic chages, nt sure how bringing back babar and rizwan will be part of the plan but any thing can happen some are suggesting this is done just to cement that team needs them

[Autonomous]

10 hours ago, singhvivek141 said:

Pakistans entire batting generation is influenced badly due to Afridi.

Any batter who bats at a sedate pace with risk free cricket is called a tuk tuk and is blamed.

 

Babar has better SR than Williamson in both white ball formats. But Pak fans like the batters who can slog blindly in the cow corner and associate inability with "intent".

 

Just like Misbah, Younis were their best batsman 10 years back. Babar & Rizwan are now. But people fail to realize that.

I would give a consistent run to Saud Shakeel as opener.

 

Very decent bat and solid domestic numbers behind - stats don't lie. It is unfortunate to see him being treated like a second class citizen. 

 

He is dropped from ODIs despite being Pakistan's most convincing bat in last ODI he played.

 

Is this not enough to advocate that this selection was a joke?

Edited March 19, 2025 by Autonomous

[Lone Wolf]

38 minutes ago, Autonomous said:

I would give a consistent run to Saud Shakeel as opener.

 

Very decent bat and solid domestic numbers behind - stats don't lie. It is unfortunate to see him being treated like a second class citizen. 

 

He is dropped from ODIs despite being Pakistan's most convincing bat in last ODI he played.

 

Is this not enough to advocate that this selection was a joke?

Saud Shakeel is a disaster in T20 lol... 

I do agree he can be a solid ODI Top 3 for you guys. Plays spin well, sweeps too & rotates strikes. Plus a left hander.

Horrific call to drop him from ODIs

[singhvivek141]

9 hours ago, Autonomous said:

I would give a consistent run to Saud Shakeel as opener.

 

Very decent bat and solid domestic numbers behind - stats don't lie. It is unfortunate to see him being treated like a second class citizen. 

 

He is dropped from ODIs despite being Pakistan's most convincing bat in last ODI he played.

 

Is this not enough to advocate that this selection was a joke?

Saud can be looked for Tests and ODI's. But don't think he has the game for T20's. Power hitting is not his stronger suit.

 

In T20's you can have one or at max 2 anchors if you have strong & balanced power hitters to compensate for. 

 

Pakistans biggest problem at the moment though is its fast bowling. Shaheen is simply not at the leader level, Rauf I doubt if is even a bowler, while the third quickie (forgot his name) is too short, so lot of things have to fall in place for him to have an impact.

[Autonomous]

11 hours ago, Lone Wolf said:

Saud Shakeel is a disaster in T20 lol... 

I do agree he can be a solid ODI Top 3 for you guys. Plays spin well, sweeps too & rotates strikes. Plus a left hander.

Horrific call to drop him from ODIs

He is actually doing well in domestic T20s and has been decent in PSL as well. 

 

Average 27 @133 isn't that bad.

[Autonomous]

2 hours ago, singhvivek141 said:

Saud can be looked for Tests and ODI's. But don't think he has the game for T20's. Power hitting is not his stronger suit.

 

In T20's you can have one or at max 2 anchors if you have strong & balanced power hitters to compensate for. 

 

Pakistans biggest problem at the moment though is its fast bowling. Shaheen is simply not at the leader level, Rauf I doubt if is even a bowler, while the third quickie (forgot his name) is too short, so lot of things have to fall in place for him to have an impact.

Shaheen is shyt.

 

We need to find a good bowler with skills and right head. Shaheen is a brainless bowler

[deathmonger]

On 3/18/2025 at 11:43 AM, Strangering said:

Shaheen goes wicketless again. How did he become so washed up at the age of 24? 

 

How is he only 24...

KPK guys lie about age. Most underdeveloped area in the Indian subcontinent (behind even Bihar).

[deathmonger]

On 3/18/2025 at 12:07 PM, CoverDrive said:

NZ are now a team which is among the top ones consistently. They have a decent enough pool of players and they benefit a lot from playing small and big leagues in T20 globally. I don’t put too much on not winning a trophy. They won the WTC and are consistently good in all tournaments. They give their best and fall short. It feels like a matter of time they win something but even if they don’t they are good. Most team dont win world cups. 

 

Fin Allen is another top player who is not even in ODIs. They can stack up their team with spinners or spinners based on conditions. They have good plans and execute well. It was amazing seeing them kill the game in first 3 overs in the chase reaching 44 with 7 sixes. 

They do the little things well.

 

Don't know if they have the talent to overcome the best team of the tournament but should be perpetual semi contenders.

[Chaos]

 Im here

 

[crictime]

The strike rate of Babar Azam and Rizwan is absolutely pathetic and totally unaligned with the requirements of T20i format. That too even after playing many matches against low ranked teams and major teams fielding their B team.

 

Babar Azam 129

Rizwan. 125

 

In comparison below are the strike rates of specialist batsmen which shows that Azam and Rizwan are massive under performers in T20i cricket. Even all rounders like Abhishek Sharma, Hardik Pandya and Shivam Dubey who offer few overs are giving much better strike rate.

 

 

Abhishek Sharma 193

Tilak Varma 155

Sanju Samson 152

SKY 167

Rinku Singh 161

Hardik Pandya 141

Shivam Dube 140

 

Fillowing is strike rate of Indian batsmen who can't find a spot in India or are retired.

 

Rohit Sharma 139

Vorat Kohli 137

Shreyas Iyer 136

Rishabh Pant 127

 

Wonder how dire the lack of prooer T20i batsmen in Pakistan that the PCB selects Babar Azam and Rizwan who have horrible strike rate.

[Tillu]

6 minutes ago, crictime said:

The strike rate of Babar Azam and Rizwan is absolutely pathetic and totally unaligned with the requirements of T20i format. That too even after playing many matches against low ranked teams and major teams fielding their B team.

 

Babar Azam 129

Rizwan. 125

 

In comparison below are the strike rates of specialist batsmen which shows that Azam and Rizwan are massive under performers in T20i cricket. Even all rounders like Abhishek Sharma, Hardik Pandya and Shivam Dubey who offer few overs are giving much better strike rate.

 

 

Abhishek Sharma 193

Tilak Varma 155

Sanju Samson 152

SKY 167

Rinku Singh 161

Hardik Pandya 141

Shivam Dube 140

 

Fillowing is strike rate of Indian batsmen who can't find a spot in India or are retired.

 

Rohit Sharma 139

Vorat Kohli 137

Shreyas Iyer 136

Rishabh Pant 127

 

Wonder how dire the lack of prooer T20i batsmen in Pakistan that the PCB selects Babar Azam and Rizwan who have horrible strike rate.

 

Their strike rates were even worse in T20 world cups. They and their PR teams have mastered the art of deceiving their gullible fans into believing they are both T20 goat batsmen because of their Averages which is a useless metric.

[tapandrun]

10 hours ago, crictime said:

The strike rate of Babar Azam and Rizwan is absolutely pathetic and totally unaligned with the requirements of T20i format. That too even after playing many matches against low ranked teams and major teams fielding their B team.

 

Babar Azam 129

Rizwan. 125

 

In comparison below are the strike rates of specialist batsmen which shows that Azam and Rizwan are massive under performers in T20i cricket. Even all rounders like Abhishek Sharma, Hardik Pandya and Shivam Dubey who offer few overs are giving much better strike rate.

 

 

Abhishek Sharma 193

Tilak Varma 155

Sanju Samson 152

SKY 167

Rinku Singh 161

Hardik Pandya 141

Shivam Dube 140

 

Fillowing is strike rate of Indian batsmen who can't find a spot in India or are retired.

 

Rohit Sharma 139

Vorat Kohli 137

Shreyas Iyer 136

Rishabh Pant 127

 

Wonder how dire the lack of prooer T20i batsmen in Pakistan that the PCB selects Babar Azam and Rizwan who have horrible strike rate.

Babar is like the big star of pak cricket, draws sponsors, deals etc. top 4/5 pak players have worked massively on PR think there is a player management company too which manages mst of the player and ex-player who can influence selection.

 

After the failure there are voices asking for babar and rizwan to return no one is asking for saim or saying if saim returns then there both rizwan and babar can not open so one has to drop a place in the batting order are they capable of scoring at good sr outside pp, they even cannot not maximize pp how can they play at high sr if their entry point in outside pp.

 

can be wrong here but there was some stat that with rizwan and babar in the avg score pak team get is 150, without them is 160.

its been pak's bowling who has been taking the team home most  of the time and since shaheen went off the wheels pak bowling is in disarray.

because most of them does not have a large domestic cricket behind them they donot know how to bowl containing line and length when nothing goes their way, they mostly tries bowling that magic ball. the magic ball works when everything is going for you, right now all 3 bowler are down on pace and not bowling at same pace when they were in prime.

 

 

 

Edited March 20, 2025 by tapandrun

[Autonomous]

6 minutes ago, tapandrun said:

Babar is like the big star of pak cricket, draws sponsors, deals etc. top 4/5 pak players have worked massively on PR think there is a player management company too which manages mst of the player and ex-player who can influence selection.

 

After the failure there are voices asking for babar and rizwan to return no one is asking for saim or saying if saim returns then there both rizwan and babar can not open so one has to drop a place in the batting order are they capable of scoring at good sr outside pp, they even cannot not maximize pp how can they play at high sr if their entry point in outside pp.

 

 

 

Saim's fiery 30 is better than Bobzy's 60 in T20i.

[tapandrun]

2 minutes ago, Autonomous said:

Saim's fiery 30 is better than Bobzy's 60 in T20i.

Yes , you need impetus in t20s, sub continent teams does not get power hitter like wi and aus who can hit 6 of any kind of bowling anytime at any stadium. so can not rely on back overs. maximize pp, keep the tempo up then only teams can get to par+15runs score