bsriharsha Posted April 2 Posted April 2 3 hours ago, singhvivek141 said: Definition of done ? F414 deal isnt signed, just getting airframes ready isnt gonna cut. Weapon integration is another issue where HAL is laggard, havent been able to integrate weapons onto Tejas mk1a, hence IAF isnt ready to take it up. Pivot to the alternate engine supplier.
G_B_ Posted April 2 Posted April 2 4 hours ago, singhvivek141 said: P8I has large RCS, so its easily detectable by enemy radars. Its basically a commercial fighter plane. Hence, if Navy sent this to support IAF, every chance that it may have been locked in the range of P15 as its detectable by enemy radars even from a long range. We really need GaN based radars for Su30MKI, else it wont be able to see beyond 150-200 km for fighter jets. In that case even carrying a R37 or Astra mk3 will be of no use but a paper weight But p15 has range of 350km. Usually the paf will be sitting about 150km inside their border. Stand off. Can hit unto 200km inside border. A p8 will simply not fly that close. Fired on is one thing.
Lone Wolf Posted April 2 Posted April 2 4 hours ago, singhvivek141 said: Pretty sure Pooks must have fired P15 from its extended range, hence it must have lost the momentum by the time it reached near the P8I. While P8I cant maneuver, it can actually see an incoming missile from a much longer distance. It must have seen it incoming on its radar and have stepped back to increase the distance, and PL15 ran out of fuel. Yeah very risky strategy in a contested airspace as nobody these days goes near live battlefield with a large manned ISR craft, This is done by uavs which will be shot down by vshorads regularly in conflict. So you need cheaper male uavs as well. If it was locked on by enemy A2A/SAM it was surely operating close to their engagement zones. The gallantry award nausena winner might have saved close to 1000 crore alone
singhvivek141 Posted April 2 Posted April 2 29 minutes ago, G_B_ said: But p15 has range of 350km. Usually the paf will be sitting about 150km inside their border. Stand off. Can hit unto 200km inside border. A p8 will simply not fly that close. Fired on is one thing. Some channels are saying that it actually was close to Pooki borders.
G_B_ Posted April 2 Posted April 2 53 minutes ago, singhvivek141 said: Some channels are saying that it actually was close to Pooki borders. Then fair enough. Pretty lame paf could not hit it then lol. singhvivek141 1
G_B_ Posted April 2 Posted April 2 5 hours ago, singhvivek141 said: Pretty sure Pooks must have fired P15 from its extended range, hence it must have lost the momentum by the time it reached near the P8I. While P8I cant maneuver, it can actually see an incoming missile from a much longer distance. It must have seen it incoming on its radar and have stepped back to increase the distance, and PL15 ran out of fuel. Hmm p15 and a2a or hq9 missiles are mach 5 speeds. While it may have been able to see the missiles, i dont think given speed of boeing jets it was feasible to put much distance between. Mostly relied on dodging the missiles first + putting distance to ensure further missile attacks dont reach. singhvivek141 1
singhvivek141 Posted April 2 Posted April 2 (edited) BTW...Indian Navy is going to commission INS taragiri as well on 3rd April So after Dunagiri, Agray, Malwan, Sansodhak, now Taragiri will also join Indjan Waters. 5 Ships in this week. While IAF on the other hand is struggling with 1. Fuel Tankers 2. Squadron Strength 3. Cargo Jets 4. Engine delivery of F404 5. Weapon integration with Tejas fleet 6. Radar capacity of Su30MKI 7. AWACS Bloody hell, AirForce is in dire state now. Edited April 2 by singhvivek141 G_B_ 1
bsriharsha Posted April 2 Posted April 2 Everyone's been sleeping. At this point, load up on drones and SAM batteries
Lone Wolf Posted April 3 Posted April 3 (edited) Only program which has gone ahead smoothly thanks to it being priority level 1 of every government Wish Kaveri was also backed like SSBN program S4* of Arihant class was already cleared in 2012 and made sure production line was stable so we may get another one in few years. Edited April 3 by Lone Wolf singhvivek141 and mishra 2
Lone Wolf Posted April 3 Posted April 3 (edited) 25 minutes ago, singhvivek141 said: Indian Navy शं नो वरुणः Vishnu Som on point about our massive frigates lack enough VLS and SAM in its weight class. Nirbhay Subsonic cruise missile can double the firepower and free up more space perhaps. Edited April 3 by Lone Wolf
singhvivek141 Posted April 3 Posted April 3 32 minutes ago, Lone Wolf said: Vishnu Som on point about our massive frigates lack enough VLS and SAM in its weight class. Nirbhay Subsonic cruise missile can double the firepower and free up more space perhaps. Destroyers and Frigates are of different class, not sure what Mr. Mysavvytalk is comparing to. Chinese Type 54A Frigate carry 32 VLS and it's of 4400 Ton, Taragiri carries 40 (32 + 8 Brahmos) of 6600 Tonn. Brahmos is also way lethal than YJ-83 which Type 54 carries. Currently our Vizag Class destroyer is around 7.5k Ton and it has 48 VLS, Type 55 is of 13k ton hence it has 112 VLS. P18 Destroyers would be the right competitor with Type 55 as it will be around 13k Ton and will host close to 100 VLS.
Lone Wolf Posted April 3 Posted April 3 (edited) 1 hour ago, singhvivek141 said: Destroyers and Frigates are of different class, not sure what Mr. Mysavvytalk is comparing to. Chinese Type 54A Frigate carry 32 VLS and it's of 4400 Ton, Taragiri carries 40 (32 + 8 Brahmos) of 6600 Tonn. Brahmos is also way lethal than YJ-83 which Type 54 carries. Currently our Vizag Class destroyer is around 7.5k Ton and it has 48 VLS, Type 55 is of 13k ton hence it has 112 VLS. P18 Destroyers would be the right competitor with Type 55 as it will be around 13k Ton and will host close to 100 VLS. P18 destroyers will be active around 2038-2040 perhaps at current rate. PLAN will be at another stratosphere by then so let's leave them at that. Nobody will be able to match them The newer Type 54B frigate carries Yj 21 hypersonic missiles afaik. I guess the upcoming P17B frigates will have 48 VLS count so not much of an upgrade there. But as Indian Navy is designed to work close to its own shores so admirals think it's good enough and it's okay tbh. Vishnu Som seems to be concerned more about lack of SAM in the era of drone warfare. It's an evolving battle front when it comes to naval assets. Nirbhay will solve a lot of our problems I think. Edited April 3 by Lone Wolf
singhvivek141 Posted April 3 Posted April 3 (edited) 1 hour ago, Lone Wolf said: P18 destroyers will be active around 2038-2040 perhaps at current rate. PLAN will be at another stratosphere by then so let's leave them at that. Nobody will be able to match them The newer Type 54B frigate carries Yj 21 hypersonic missiles afaik. I guess the upcoming P17B frigates will have 48 VLS count so not much of an upgrade there. But as Indian Navy is designed to work close to its own shores so admirals think it's good enough and it's okay tbh. Vishnu Som seems to be concerned more about lack of SAM in the era of drone warfare. It's an evolving battle front when it comes to naval assets. Nirbhay will solve a lot of our problems I think. YJ21 is carried by 055 Class Destroyer. 054B carries YJ83J...it also has 32 VLS system and HQ 16 as their air defence. Our P17A is faster as well. https://nationalinterest.org/blog/buzz/chinas-new-type-054b-stealth-frigate-is-a-huge-problem-for-the-u-s-navy?hl=en-IN I think they are comparing 055 Destroyer to Vishakhapatnam class destroyer. Which is correct as our Vizag class is tiny in comparison to 055. P18 seems to be currently behind P28 & P17B. Focus is more on Corvettes and Frigates. P17B will have more VLS and more varied type of Air Defence. Edited April 3 by singhvivek141
Lone Wolf Posted April 3 Posted April 3 (edited) 30 minutes ago, singhvivek141 said: YJ21 is carried by 055 Class Destroyer. 054B carries YJ83J...it also has 32 VLS system and HQ 16 as their air defence. Our P17A is faster as well. https://nationalinterest.org/blog/buzz/chinas-new-type-054b-stealth-frigate-is-a-huge-problem-for-the-u-s-navy?hl=en-IN I think they are comparing 055 Destroyer to Vishakhapatnam class destroyer. As per global times and Chinese state media new Type 054B features Yj 21 as well The type 54A was specifically listed to carry YJ-83 + Yu-8 anti sub missile https://www.janes.com/osint-insights/defence-news/sea/china-reveals-enhanced-sensors-asw-role-for-type-054b-frigate https://www.news18.com/world/yj-21-missile-chinas-hypersonic-warship-killer-is-6x-the-speed-of-sound-ws-adkl-9548209.html And yes P17B will be an upgrade over P17A obviously including higher VLS count 48.. which is ideal tbh and a standard these days. Edited April 3 by Lone Wolf singhvivek141 1
Lone Wolf Posted April 3 Posted April 3 (edited) Ngl I'd have loved if Top ji decided to Aura farm like Macron did with his state of the art SSN. Missed opportunity.. noice edit this Edited April 3 by Lone Wolf
bsriharsha Posted April 3 Posted April 3 8 hours ago, Lone Wolf said: Vishnu Som on point about our massive frigates lack enough VLS and SAM in its weight class. Nirbhay Subsonic cruise missile can double the firepower and free up more space perhaps. With all due respect to him. Any SAM on a naval warships are likely to be taken out really quickly. The Airforce needs to step up to ensure that there is a sufficient missile defense system around the warships
singhvivek141 Posted April 3 Posted April 3 3 hours ago, Lone Wolf said: Ngl I'd have loved if Top ji decided to Aura farm like Macron did with his state of the art SSN. Missed opportunity.. noice edit this SSBNs are secret IMO. Hence Arihant and Arighat release with regards to zero fanfare. However, it seems MoD has decided to shun off all tje secrecy..taal thonk ke bolenge haan hai hamare pass SSBN...BC . S4* will join either this year end or next year. Once BARC completes 200 MW Nuclear Reactor even S5 class will gain speed. Lone Wolf 1
Recommended Posts