singhvivek141 Posted April 3 Posted April 3 36 minutes ago, bsriharsha said: With all due respect to him. Any SAM on a naval warships are likely to be taken out really quickly. The Airforce needs to step up to ensure that there is a sufficient missile defense system around the warships They all travel in pairs..IMO Destroyers, Frigates, Corvettes forming the inner circle while Unmanned NGV and missile boats the outer ring. Air Craft Carrier will sit in the nucleus lf inner circle... P8Is, Romeo, Seaguardian and Mig29k will provide the air cover fire.
Lone Wolf Posted April 3 Posted April 3 1 hour ago, bsriharsha said: With all due respect to him. Any SAM on a naval warships are likely to be taken out really quickly. The Airforce needs to step up to ensure that there is a sufficient missile defense system around the warships Who will take it out?? They are part of a carrier battle group when in strike formation. Drones are nowadays biggest threat to these assets. There is a reason more VLS cells are reserved for SAM in every destroyer or a smaller frigate. Though Nilgiri are huge and designers could have pushed for extra cells as there was more than enough space. G_B_ 1
Lone Wolf Posted April 3 Posted April 3 1 hour ago, singhvivek141 said: SSBNs are secret IMO. Hence Arihant and Arighat release with regards to zero fanfare. However, it seems MoD has decided to shun off all tje secrecy..taal thonk ke bolenge haan hai hamare pass SSBN...BC . S4* will join either this year end or next year. Once BARC completes 200 MW Nuclear Reactor even S5 class will gain speed. I mean world already knows we have a functioning nuclear triad since 2016. Today it goes more robust with a 3rd and bigger SSBN. Chinese were spooked with K4 SLBM testing on a possible S4 SSBN and sent numerous spying vessels in IoR few months back. India kept delaying the NOTAM and trolled them. The secrecy might be coz they are not directly under Indian Naval command but rather fall under Nuclear strategic command. The SSNs though would be under Indian Naval control when they come. singhvivek141 1
singhvivek141 Posted April 3 Posted April 3 5 minutes ago, Lone Wolf said: Who will take it out?? They are part of a carrier battle group when in strike formation. Drones are nowadays biggest threat to these assets. There is a reason more VLS cells are reserved for SAM in every destroyer or a smaller frigate. Though Nilgiri are huge and designers could have pushed for extra cells as there was more than enough space. P17A has 76mm guns, not sure if they're suffice for Drones. P17B will have 100mm+ guns, they'll definitely can take care of Kamikaze drones like Shahed.
singhvivek141 Posted April 4 Posted April 4 If Keel ceremony will happen only in 2028 and in the same Shipyard where currently SSBNs are under construction. It means the S5 SSBNs will end the construction by 2027 and undergo sea trials. G_B_ 1
singhvivek141 Posted April 4 Posted April 4 K9 Vajra, built initially with foreign partnership is now moving fastly towards indigenious components. Army is operating 100 units in deserts of Rajasthan...100 more is currently under production for mountains, and maybe 100 more orders will be given soon, as they keep the operators safe from welling in comparison to M777 Howitzer or even Dhanush Artillwry guns L&T Drives K9 Vajra Artillery Program to 82% Local Content, Strengthening Domestic Supply Chains https://defence.in/threads/l-t-drives-k9-vajra-artillery-program-to-82-local-content-strengthening-domestic-supply-chains.17362/
ravishingravi Posted April 4 Posted April 4 (edited) @Lone Wolf @G_B_ @singhvivek141 Edited April 4 by ravishingravi Lone Wolf 1
bsriharsha Posted April 4 Posted April 4 The original model for the shahed was based on an American drone which was recovered and reverse engineered by the Iranians. One more way in which America continues to inflict its self goals
Lone Wolf Posted April 4 Posted April 4 1 hour ago, bsriharsha said: The original model for the shahed was based on an American drone which was recovered and reverse engineered by the Iranians. One more way in which America continues to inflict its self goals Americans also captured one and made an exact replica. Cost effective
Lone Wolf Posted April 4 Posted April 4 2 hours ago, ravishingravi said: @Lone Wolf @G_B_ @singhvivek141 Details are emerging from Op Sindoor.. apparently Vishnu Som's book is also coming up. The P8I saga has already started. ravishingravi 1
Lone Wolf Posted April 4 Posted April 4 5 hours ago, singhvivek141 said: If Keel ceremony will happen only in 2028 and in the same Shipyard where currently SSBNs are under construction. It means the S5 SSBNs will end the construction by 2027 and undergo sea trials. SSN program is I guess under PMO like SSBN so it will be heavily funded and timelines would be strict. Expecting first SSN by 2036 at least. The SSK program is a complete mess otoh singhvivek141 1
ravishingravi Posted April 4 Posted April 4 (edited) Expecting action in coming 2-3 months. So is Pakistan. They have already published in all their outlets possible false flag operation by India. Edited April 4 by ravishingravi
singhvivek141 Posted April 4 Posted April 4 (edited) 1 hour ago, Lone Wolf said: SSN program is I guess under PMO like SSBN so it will be heavily funded and timelines would be strict. Expecting first SSN by 2036 at least. The SSK program is a complete mess otoh Don't think SSK is a total mess, we are just slow. Probably due to the fact that our first priority (and to some extent rightfully) is Army, so Navy requirements always took a backseat. Scorpenes, even without AIP are pretty capable, silent and have fantastic SONAR capabilities with minimal blind spots. I've one dissatisfaction though, as these are small submarines, we should have ordered a dozen of them at the start itself instead of buying half a dozen and then pivoting towards German Submarines. The steel used by French submarines are quite different than German submarines, hence MDL has to use different tech for the steel cutting. Even with the P76 and P77 submarines, going with just 6 is too low....India should invest on a dozen submarines of each category. I hope we bounce up our defence budget to atleast 2.5-2.7% of GDP. Majority of our amount goes in the pensions and salaries with very little to spend on modernization. Being a democracy, govt. also can't cut too much from infra and social welfare programs as then they'll be thrown out of power. Edited April 4 by singhvivek141
singhvivek141 Posted April 4 Posted April 4 4 hours ago, ravishingravi said: @Lone Wolf @G_B_ @singhvivek141 I haven't read the book by Vishnu Som, but I read the book by KJ Dhillon on Op Sindoor. Neither talks about what all we did....Nur Khan, Kirana Hills, usage of Rampage, SCALP, Brahmos, Hammer there was no clarity in terms of what all we used. All they mention about is the extreme coordination which all 3 wings of Defence forces, along with the ground police of respective states, to ensure we thwart every attempt of Pakistan, while giving them a reply which hit them so bad that they were literally on their knees by the 4th day. It also talks highly about the EW jamming of Rafales and how it protected Su30MKI from Pakistani A2A missiles. Rafale is cursed in a way that it's usability is always gauged in terms of it's price, and also as Congress party was reluctant to sign the deal. It has inadvertently became the battle ground between the two parties.
Lone Wolf Posted April 4 Posted April 4 31 minutes ago, singhvivek141 said: Don't think SSK is a total mess, we are just slow. Probably due to the fact that our first priority (and to some extent rightfully) is Army, so Navy requirements always took a backseat. Scorpenes, even without AIP are pretty capable, silent and have fantastic SONAR capabilities with minimal blind spots. I've one dissatisfaction though, as these are small submarines, we should have ordered a dozen of them at the start itself instead of buying half a dozen and then pivoting towards German Submarines. The steel used by French submarines are quite different than German submarines, hence MDL has to use different tech for the steel cutting. Even with the P76 and P77 submarines, going with just 6 is too low....India should invest on a dozen submarines of each category. I hope we bounce up our defence budget to atleast 2.5-2.7% of GDP. Majority of our amount goes in the pensions and salaries with very little to spend on modernization. Being a democracy, govt. also can't cut too much from infra and social welfare programs as then they'll be thrown out of power. Scorpene induction was very slow... We messed up badly. ToT wasn't utilised or we simply lacked technical know how. It was botched and French sabotaged us every step of the way as per Ex Naval chief Though in recent MILAN exercise Filipino Naval frigate actually managed to detect a Indian scorpene class submarine which made headlines in Phillipines which indicates that stealth is what matters more underwater. AIP powered subs will always be a threat to surface vessels. We are hoping that Hangor Class Subs to Pookistan Navy turns out to be lesser stealthy otherwise they will be a Pain in the @** to deal with in Future. Current 3 operational AIP powered Agosta 90b are pretty advanced as well and our ASW game need to be on point against them. P75I has been a doomed project in limbo for nearly two decades now. Parrikar would have managed to get it done before 2020 and we would have seen the boats arriving by now. Ninda turtle deserves a lot of criticism as well. He has only woken up in last couple of years If all had went to plan P76 and P77 would have been primed for next decade.
singhvivek141 Posted April 4 Posted April 4 14 minutes ago, Lone Wolf said: Scorpene induction was very slow... We messed up badly. ToT wasn't utilised or we simply lacked technical know how. It was botched and French sabotaged us every step of the way as per Ex Naval chief Though in recent MILAN exercise Filipino Naval frigate actually managed to detect a Indian scorpene class submarine which made headlines in Phillipines which indicates that stealth is what matters more underwater. AIP powered subs will always be a threat to surface vessels. We are hoping that Hangor Class Subs to Pookistan Navy turns out to be lesser stealthy otherwise they will be a Pain in the @** to deal with in Future. Current 3 operational AIP powered Agosta 90b are pretty advanced as well and our ASW game need to be on point against them. P75I has been a doomed project in limbo for nearly two decades now. Parrikar would have managed to get it done before 2020 and we would have seen the boats arriving by now. Ninda turtle deserves a lot of criticism as well. He has only woken up in last couple of years If all had went to plan P76 and P77 would have been primed for next decade. Rajnath Singh isnt bad, but he is more of a politician suited for civilian departments. His prime focus is on indigenization and that will show its benefit Parrikar was legendary, him and George Fernandes deserve all the credit for Indian defence enhancements. Maybe we need more defence ministers from the region of Konkan only. Lone Wolf 1
Lone Wolf Posted April 4 Posted April 4 22 minutes ago, singhvivek141 said: Rajnath Singh isnt bad, but he is more of a politician suited for civilian departments. His prime focus is on indigenization and that will show its benefit Parrikar was legendary, him and George Fernandes deserve all the credit for Indian defence enhancements. Maybe we need more defence ministers from the region of Konkan only. Meanwhile first S5 will be ready by 2030 so sea trials and induction by late 2031 or early 2032. Their displacement would be close to American Ohio class. Maybe it will be equipped with K5 SLBM which is under development.
G_B_ Posted April 4 Posted April 4 9 hours ago, singhvivek141 said: K9 Vajra, built initially with foreign partnership is now moving fastly towards indigenious components. Army is operating 100 units in deserts of Rajasthan...100 more is currently under production for mountains, and maybe 100 more orders will be given soon, as they keep the operators safe from welling in comparison to M777 Howitzer or even Dhanush Artillwry guns L&T Drives K9 Vajra Artillery Program to 82% Local Content, Strengthening Domestic Supply Chains https://defence.in/threads/l-t-drives-k9-vajra-artillery-program-to-82-local-content-strengthening-domestic-supply-chains.17362/ India needs 500 of these.
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