India's number 7 for the world cup

[Manny_Pacquiao]

its been a long time since we had a poal and everything in india is decide with poll, so lets have one now. who should bat at 7 for india in the world cup? options: 1. jadeja. a better spinner than a batsman, can go through 10 overs in every game, takes a few wickets every now and then, has won a couple of man of the match awards for his bowing. his batting is shyte for a number 7. can rotate strike and build partnerships but cant slog. woeful runer between the wickets, can singlehandedly lose games for india with his batting. has a decent batting average of 34, but pathetic strike rate below 80 which makes him a misfit for number 7 2. yusuf pathan. the oposite of jadeja. better batsman than a bowler. spin bowling is pathetic, with no wicket taking ability and economy rate touching 6. shows promise with the bat sometimes but hasnt done anything in his 37 ODIs. 2 fifties and average of 22 is crap, a very pakistani performance. cant play seamers but can hit spinners for sixes at will. so maybe a better option for number 7 than jadeja 3. irfan pathan. my favourite. quality batsman, and can be a decent bowler. has beaten up good bowlers in the past, can build partnerships, rotate strike and slog, can be used as pinch hitter with high expectations. basically, the ideal number 7 batsman. only thing that lets him down is his bowling which went backwards. but he is still a better bowler than jadeja and can get through 10 overs with a wicket or two, even if he might be more expensive. india ODI team had such a nice balance when irfan was at number 7 - like in the CB series for example. 4. robin uthappa. specialist batsman with no bowling ability. might not be bad idea to play 7+4 in india. good batsman in the lower order, will always get runs at quick speed and handles pressure really well. u can have sehwag and some other fool do 5 overs each. 5. somebody else. nayar, ashwin, others. in other words, guys that havent played much cricket and i know fugg all about.

[Andy]

Utthappa IMO. But who cares? Atleast Dhoni doesnt. He will keep on playing his Partner Jaddu.

[Patriot_Nikhil]

2. yusuf pathan. the oposite of jadeja. better batsman than a bowler. spin bowling is pathetic, with no wicket taking ability and economy rate touching 6. shows promise with the bat sometimes but hasnt done anything in his 37 ODIs. 2 fifties and average of 22 is crap, a very pakistani performance. cant play seamers but can hit spinners for sixes at will. so maybe a better option for number 7 than jadeja

:hysterical::hysterical::hysterical:

[cowboysfan]

yusuf pathan's batting might hold up in india.we need to see where his form is at before the world cup.he needs to be in the lineup for the kiwi series.I am also hopeful that Ashwin shows something with the ball if he gets a chance.

[Patriot_Nikhil]

If the WC begins next week, No7 - I would prefer Uthappa and have Raina + Sehwag + Yuvi bowl the remaining 10 overs. I hope Irfan performs well in the domestic scene and takes this spot. Its not like he is someone who can be picked on the basis of his batting as yet.

[vvvslaxman]

They have far too many spinners in the squad. Sehwag, Yuvraj, Raina, Ojha, Harbhajan. Why do they need one more spinner in the form of crappy Jaddu and Yusuf pathan.

[Ram]

If only Kirsten & co. would let go of their obsession with 3 pacers, then we could easily fit in 6 batsmen + Dhoni + 2 specialist spinners + 2 pacers. The problem right now with the team is that 3 of the 4 bowling spots in the team is taken up by pacers no matter what, which means the 4th spot HAS to be taken by Bhajji and he isn’t good enough to play at no.7. So, in order to have a player who is a better batsmen than Bhajji but is also the 2nd spinner, the team has alternated b/w Yusuf and Jadeja. Yusuf’s essentially hit or miss. He has shown himself to be too unpredictable to be relied upon in pressure situations, which is what a no.7 has to face most of the times. Jadeja’s batting is woefully inadequate, even though his largely economical bowling and reliable fielding keeps him the team. But the no.7 spot is simply too important in the context of ODIs to keep letting proven failures to keep that place. Its time the team broke out their imagination and started experimenting with the prospect of going in with 2 pacera and 2 spinners + 6 specialist batsmen + Dhoni. Last year’s IPL showed that spinners can be extremely effective in curbing opening batsmen in T20s. There’s no reason why that shouldn’t be replicated in ODIs. Besides, our pacers at home have also been ridiculously expensive off late. There’s no harm going with Ashwin for a few matches and seeing how it works. I quite like the look of this line-up; Sachin Sehwag Gambhir Yuvraj Raina Dhoni Rohit/Uthappa/Karthik/Kohli Bhajji Ashwin Zaheer Khan Nehra/Praveen Kumar

[Sid]

Irfan should be the obvious choice but i never understand why team management expect irfan to take fiifers in each and every game,i bet if he plays he will give same amount of runs as given by zak or nehra,so why not try him ,he can bowl his cutters or slower bowls cleverly in the middle overs as he did in the t20 world cup 2007,but somehow i feel team management expects some extraordinary results from his bowling,which is never going to happen Out of the five choices,irfan and uthappa are two quality cricketers,uthappa will not fit into the squad becoz of the all rounder's need in the team,and of yusuf and jadeja ,indian cricket should not waste its time on these two ordinary cricketers,they both should be certainity in Rajasthan royals but keep them far from Team India,in case of yusuf ,team management has understood that but in case of jadeja ,they are unwilling to understand that:((

[Feed]

Who'll play at No.7 for India? A bits-and-pieces player policy tends to be fraught with danger because you run the risk of getting neither a bowler nor a batsman, and so India need to play to their strength, which on Indian pitches is batting . More... Who'll play at No.7 for India? Six months away from the World Cup, India are no closer to finding the elusive allrounder for a vital spot in the order Harsha Bhogle August 13, 2010 Ravindra Jadeja: hasn't quite lived up to Shane Warne's billing yet It's six months to go to the World Cup - a long time if you are preparing for the staging of the Commonwealth Games, not quite if you are looking at the best possible combination to put together for the biggest cricket event in the world. Coaches and selectors must be hoping to have at least 10 or 11 names finalised by now, and really should have a fair idea of who the other four or five will be. A wish list would be in every coach's back pocket. India's wish list is pretty obvious really, and a first reading will expose the biggest problem with it. Ideally this is what I suspect Kirsten and Dhoni and Srikkanth would be looking at the evening before the first game: SachinTendulkar, Virender Sehwag, Gautam Gambhir, Yuvraj Singh, Mahendra Singh Dhoni, Suresh Raina, Irfan Pathan, Harbhajan Singh, Praveen Kumar or Ashish Nehra, Zaheer Khan, Pragyan Ojha. Eleven of those 12 names look settled, but for India to be strong at the World Cup, No. 7 needs to be identified, and at the moment Irfan Pathan has gone underground. So if Pathan Jr is not on the radar, who bats after the batsmen and above the bowlers and gives you a few, if not 10, overs? India have tried Pathan Sr - and I suspect he is still an option - and currently are investing heavily in Ravindra Jadeja, who has so far given little indication of becoming the rock star Shane Warne thought he could be. "Could be" is the operative phrase here. Early in his career Jadeja seems to have stagnated, and I suspect people will start looking for returns on investment very shortly. I also suspect India's think tank will have started thinking seriously about a Plan B. They will need one because there is no No. 7 who answers to the job description anywhere in sight in India. You'd think the IPL would have thrown up a couple of names, but really, apart from R Ashwin, who seems better with the new ball than with the old at the moment, the canvas is blank. And so I suspect India might have to go the way they did during that very successful run from 2002 to 2004, when the selfless Rahul Dravid took the gloves and allowed India to play a seventh batsman. Straightaway you can see Rohit Sharma playing the role that Mohammad Kaif did then, with the license to bat freely in case the team is in a good situation, and instructed to douse the fires if there is a batting collapse. But what looks good in the mind and on paper need not necessarily be the same way on the field. So who bowls the other 10 overs? Or more if one of the bowlers has had a bad day? It's time, then, to ask the batsmen to start rolling their arms over. In home conditions that isn't such a daunting task. Sehwag is a very competent offspinner (remember Aravinda De Silva bowling 10 overs quite often in 1996?) and Yuvraj Singh is much underrated. But I think it is time to look even further afield and start throwing the ball to Suresh Raina, who seems to possess a pretty cool head when bowling in the 20-overs game. Or, for that matter, to Rohit Sharma, who can be good for a few overs. A bits-and-pieces player policy tends to be fraught with danger because you run the risk of getting neither a bowler nor a batsman, and so India need to play to their strength, which on Indian pitches is batting. Four players to generate 10 overs between them shouldn't be a huge issue. I am not sure that is the way the think tank is thinking at the moment, but if No. 7 remains elusive even after the Sri Lanka tri-series, it might be the right time to start asking the batsmen if they fancy six-over spells in limited-overs cricket. My gut feel is that they will jump at the opportunity. India have eight one-day games in home conditions before the World Cup. They must know what they want at the World Cup before those games begin.

[Ram]

The problem right now is, Dhoni is so paranoid about having a back-up seaming option in case one of his opening bowlers get hit in their his first spell, he has persisted with option of playing 3 seamers, even though all of our seamers have been carted all over the place in ODIs in India. Its not like we’re playing 3 seamers because our seaming attack is good, its because Dhoni is so insistent upon having the back-up insurance option. If he’s so sure that one of the seamers WILL get hit, its probably the best indication that he shouldn’t be playing 3 seaming options in the first place. Besides, the last time the world cup was held in India back in 96, Sri Lanka won the cup mainly due to their spinning options + Vaas. So its not like history is loaded in favor of playing a surplus of fast bowlers in the subcontinent. My biggest fear, if we continue playing such mediocre batsmen like Jadeja at no.7, come one of the knockout matches in the WC, the opposition team batting first would score 290+, we will start badly and end up being around 150/4 in 30 overs or 200/5 in 38 overs. And that’s exactly when the no.7 has to step up and deliver the goods. And jadeja is not even close to doing that. I cannot remember a single instance when he has come in with steep required RR and delivered. Either he comes in and plods around for a while and gets out, or the times he does manage to score, the match is already a lost cause. I also remember that back in 2007, Robin Uthappa was very effective against the Aussies, playing at the no.7 spot. We lost that series 2-4 at home, but he was one of the few Indian batsmen who took the fight to their quick bowlers. Karthik is not a bad option as well, since he has this uncanny knack of delivering in some high pressure chases. Unfortunately,Kohli might have to miss out, even though from an overall perspective, he’s a better bat than Uthappa or Karthik.

[Online]

very interesting post MM. Here is a question I have about the thought process though. Dhoni has played international cricket for a while and most people reckon he is an above average captain. Here is the part that I do not understand. How can we armchair fans have the audacity to comment that India's captain has got it wrong? Because for us to honestly believe that Dhoni is making a big mistake requires us to shed all modesty, assume the skipper is doing something wrong and smacks of arrogance. In other words, my question is more about the process than the issue. How can an ICF question the judgment of a cricketer who is obviously more experienced, knowledgeable about tactics, strategy and the ground situation than most of us? I do know that we have the freedom of speech to comment as we feel like - so if this issue is being raised to exercise the freedom of speech, then I do not have any confusion or objections. Please disregard this post. But if such comments (which make perfect logical sense to me) are to be taken seriously, does this mean that we do not have faith in our captain and/or our cricket team? Please understand that this is not a question of your analytical skills but about the audacity that we ICF display when it comes to accusing our cricket players of making tactical blunders. At the same time, I completely understand when an ICF criticizes a player for not demonstrating commitment or playing a horrible shot or bowling abysmally while in the middle of a game. Because those are due to physical limitations of a particular player. By questioning our skipper's judgement are we insinuating that we are smarter than him? that he has a strategy that is bound to fail? that we could be better skippers of the Indian cricket team given a chance?

[Ram]

^ I am completely & 100% lost and confused by that. :hmmmm2: If you're saying we, as fans, have no right to question the judgment or discuss the tactics employed by our national cricket team, then we might as well close down ICF and do something more worthwhile.

[cowboysfan]

i think the reason we play 3 pacers every time is more complex.As MM said none of them amount to anything and on a given day one of then will go for obscene amount of runs but the 20 overs of power plays means that on flat wickets in india the 2 pacer theory will not work or has a great danger of failing,spinners rarely work well in powerplay overs.

[Online]

^ I am completely & 100% lost and confused by that. :hmmmm2: If you're saying we, as fans, have no right to question the judgment or discuss the tactics employed by our national cricket team, then we might as well close down ICF and do something more worthwhile.

please don't take it negatively, I am on the same page as you sirji... Let me try to break my thought process down - so you can help point the fallacy in my argument and therefore help me fix my mistake. 1. I am an Indian Cricket Fan 2. I have faith in my captain and trust that he has better judgement than me 3. I may disagree with him about certain points and therefore express those points on this forum. However, I do still believe that he is better suited to do the job than myself. 4A: therefore, do I adopt a "disagree and commit" philosophy? and continue to use this forum to rant on the points on which we disagree or 4B: do I give in to the fact that there are some pieces of the puzzle that I am not aware of...there is something that Dhoni knows that I do not know which is why he is making the choices that he is making. and support him unconditionally. Hope I was able to make myself clear. Again, I write this message in peace. If any aspect of this post does not make sense, I will be happy to spend time and clarify. I appreciate your time and patience in reading and responding to this post.

[Jersey #10]

Either Mithun or Irfan! Jadeja seems like a very strong contender though.

[VRV Singh]

This call is very tough as I think every choice disrupts the balance of the side in one way or the other - there is no outstanding candidate for no.7 really. I would rule Yusuf Pathan out right away. He is just a poor cricketer, to be frank. We can't justify him being in the side if he just hits the occasional six! His bowling is nothing to write home about and I expect a batsman in the top 7 to at least be able to structure some sort of meaningful innings irrespective of the situation. It would then be hypocritical of me to promote Jaddu as the solution, even though I don't mind him...his batting performances don't justify it. No.7 is often a pressure position (team 5 down needing stability e.g.) and Jaddu doesn't handle it well - I suppose his tender years go against him here. I would have him in the XI, but at no.8 or lower. Irfan...would be ideal, for all the reasons stated in the OP. However he seems completely out in the cold due to his bowling, and unfortunately for good reason in my opinion. There's a fair chance he'll get carted. Uthappa - would be good up the order, but unless MSD's injured or something it's a bit of a waste to have him at 7. In my opinion. The other alternative would be Rohit I suppose. He is a fine batsman - despite what many say - but can't find a settled place up the order. His bowling is on a par with Yuseless's admittedly. But he CAN adapt to situations with the bat and is a good fielder. At this stage, in my opinion it is very difficult to say. We know who we'd ideally rule out, but can't really say who would actually play.

[Tendulkar_Bhai]

I think the reason we play 3 pacers is that the second spinner has in some games gone for easy runs and if your bringing in a change of bowling after 7/8 overs for whatever reason, you need to keep with a pace bowler with 50 overs . More i think about it more Irfan seems the obvious choice, but for some reason not popular among management. With him in the team you have your other pacer and can play 2 spinner which seems perfect. His batting has improved at the expense of his bowling, but this might not be a bad thing in terms of his place in the team, as it gives tht extra batting + bowling which Utappha doesnt. Not too much difference between the 2 batting wise imo. You could say have Utappha at 7, 3 pacers then Shewag provides the other decent spinning option, depends on the conditions. My team (so far) would be: God Sehwag Gambhir Raina Dhoni Yuvraj Irfan Pathan Bhajji Zaheer Khan Praveen Kumar Sreesanth/Munaf Utappha being first man in for any loss of form/injuries Others on the bence being, Kohli, Ishant + Nehra

[Tendulkar_Bhai]

I think the reason we play 3 pacers is that the second spinner has in some games gone for easy runs and if your bringing in a change of bowling after 7/8 overs for whatever reason, you need to keep with a pace bowler within 50 overs . More i think about it more Irfan seems the obvious choice, but for some reason not popular among management. With him in the team you have your other pacer and can play 2 spinner which seems perfect. His batting has improved at the expense of his bowling, but this might not be a bad thing in terms of his place in the team, as it gives tht extra batting + bowling which Utappha doesnt. Not too much difference between the 2 batting wise imo. You could say have Utappha at 7, 3 pacers then Shewag provides the other decent spinning option, depends on the conditions. My team (so far) would be: God Sehwag Gambhir Raina Dhoni Yuvraj Irfan Pathan Bhajji Zaheer Khan Praveen Kumar Sreesanth/Munaf Utappha being first man in for any loss of form/injuries Others on the bence being, Kohli, Ishant + Nehra

When i look at that team how much stronger would we be if Ganguly had just stayed on for another 18 months, id personally have him ahead of Raina/UV and even Dravid could still do a job for a final WC outing.

[Ram]

please don't take it negatively, I am on the same page as you sirji... Let me try to break my thought process down - so you can help point the fallacy in my argument and therefore help me fix my mistake. 1. I am an Indian Cricket Fan 2. I have faith in my captain and trust that he has better judgement than me 3. I may disagree with him about certain points and therefore express those points on this forum. However, I do still believe that he is better suited to do the job than myself. 4A: therefore, do I adopt a "disagree and commit" philosophy? and continue to use this forum to rant on the points on which we disagree or 4B: do I give in to the fact that there are some pieces of the puzzle that I am not aware of...there is something that Dhoni knows that I do not know which is why he is making the choices that he is making. and support him unconditionally. Hope I was able to make myself clear. Again, I write this message in peace. If any aspect of this post does not make sense, I will be happy to spend time and clarify. I appreciate your time and patience in reading and responding to this post.

Bhai mere, Just because they're Indian cricketers, does not mean they have to get their tactics right every single time. Remember, they're first picked for their cricketing abilities, not tactical acumen. Besides, you see so many of these ex-cricketers becoming 'expert' commentators. Be honest and tell me, how expert do you find, any of these so called 'experts'? And I truly dont understand what you mean by he boldeD PAR,

I may disagree with him about certain points and therefore express those points on this forum. However, I do still believe that he is better suited to do the job than myself.

I am just trying offer honest criticism bhai, not make a case for me to replace Dhoni as captain of team India. And just to clarify, irrespective of what tactics he follows, team India will have unconditional support, but that wont stop me from pointing out flaws (as i see it)

[Sir john]

y pathan need a chance.