Some perspective on Dhoni's captaincy

[The Outsider]

Let's face it - it's one of the toughest jobs in the world. Dhoni has to contend with a mediocre bowling line up where Zaheer is the only world class bowler. Sreesanth and Ishant are still in their formative years and Harbhajan has been a huge disappointment as far as taking over the mantle of the leader of the attack. It creates bad habits ; try to strangulate sides, rather than pick wicket ; put in out fields to stop runs and get wickets ; at times miss the fact that his bowlers are actually bowling superb spells. There is no way to defend Dhoni's tactics on day 4, once Kallis started reverse sweeping and Boucher mounted a counter attack. However, there is still room to justify his choices. Ever since he took over the mantle, most of our wins have been scripted on an awesome batting performance. And Dhoni is well entitled to believe that even the best batting line up in the world cannot chase more than 250-270 on a tricky pitch. But at the end of the day, he has delivered results. Has not lost a test series yet, and every series he has captained has had better results than his predecessors. He has lost Ganguly - India is still struggling to find a number 6 batsman. He has lost one of our most potent bowling options in Kumble. So the argument that he is doing it just because he has a great team does not fly. There are many moments where I find him too defensive, but put yourself in Dhoni's shoes. Will you ask your line up to go for a 4 RPO target on a last day pitch like Cape Town? He has had his brain farts like setting NZ 600 to win. But all in all he has had more positives than negatives. The public criticism of Sreesanth can be added to the list, but for someone who has followed Indian cricket for a long, long time, he is one of the best we've put up there as a skipper.

[kumble_rocks]

India is still struggling to find a number 6 batsman only on overseas tours wherein pitch has bounce and pace. We are fine in subcontinent. I really don't see anything special from Dhoni which is different from his predecessor Kumble. We got cheated in the Aussies tour when Kumble was captaining. In my humble opinion , one would have the same results in Tests even if VVS was selected as the test captain after kumble.

[rkt.india]

India is still struggling to find a number 6 batsman only on overseas tours wherein pitch has bounce and pace. We are fine in subcontinent. I really don't see anything special from Dhoni which is different from his predecessor Kumble. We got cheated in the Aussies tour when Kumble was captaining. In my humble opinion ' date=' one would have the same results in Tests even if VVS was selected as the test captain after kumble.[/quote'] If you do not want to see the difference than its other thing but you can certainly see it in 2008 against Australia...Kumble captained 2 tests and we could draw that and in one of them we got out jail by the help of Zak and Bhajji...and Dhoni captained 2 tests with same team and won both....it shows you the difference...especially his tactics in Nagpur test really surprised Aussies when they were in very strong position....I have never seen that kind of tactics used by an Indian captain before that was superb planning to choke Aussies.....

[ZodiaC]

It has never been easy for any captain, so I don't agree with anyone who says Dhoni has just to walk in there and he gets all results. Though tactically weak he's a fine captain and more importantly got good results. But one thing you got to accept that we have the most settled team now. Yes, we don't have kumble and ganguly, but we have a terrific strike bowler and two decent support bowlers to back him up. Batting lineup despite the absense of ganguly is still good with a settled opening pair, one of the best middle orders and worlds leading wicket taker. Overall not a terrible team, IMO.

[vaibhav_delhi]

good analysis. Think there is a prevelent misconception tht india will struggle without certain players. Dhoni has shown tht we can win without laxman, zaheer, gambhir etc. Most important thing is to have a strong captain, who believes in fighting it out, rather than cribbing abt things like tosses, conditions and injuries to key players. Dhoni likes to get on with the job. Clearly the best thing to have happened to indian cricket since sachin's debut.

[jf1gp_1]

highlight for me has been how humble he is with every win, you never hear any big talks from Dhoni or team India both before or after winning any series . Lets look at it this way whenever he is given a team which is expected to do well, he does well. All series where team India went in as fav we won most of them, look at IPL or even champions cup look at how consistent chennai have been under dhoni Also i think his criticiziam of sreesanth in public was no more than a stunt to keep SA quiet .

[Guest Hiten.]

Good points, Prof. After some thoughts, I do feel that India's approach on the last day was more prudent than say going "all out" to get the target or at least compile runs in the range of 250-275. Even the best batting line up that Aussies boasted during their superpower years, couldn't have chased 340ish in 90 overs. And what would have we achieved had we scored 250-275 runs ? I mean it would've still been a draw, a draw probably earned by putting our safety on line. India, for sure squandered their chances on day 4 and it was that day where we lost all our hopes of winning that 3rd test. About our bowling woes, each and everyone who is involved with Indian cricket is responsible for that (from selectors to captain/coach to bowlers themselves). We carried a very potent attack in the year 07/08, and soon lost that attack because our players wore out due to insufficient breaks. Kris' words still ring in my ear about "having a pool of players so we could rotate them". This never happened and one-by-one we started losing our players to injury and when we had them back in the line up they were never the same. This is where I blame the players, sure you were out because of a injury but it is up to you how you manage yourself during these days to regain your fitness and repertoire. As a professional, you simply cannot expect to be spoon fed so that you can last a 10-12 overs spell in a test match. Hit the bloody gym or participate in extra net sessions! To me, RSD has passed his saturation point and needs to be replaced. It's sad that he won't be getting a farewell series but that's life! We need to start grooming potentials who could take up the notorious #3 slot and try to fit in the big shoes that RSD will leave behind. If we continue with our ad-hoc solutions as we are doing for our bowling department, then there are high chances of our team crumbling to pieces, once our stalwarts start hanging their boots up.

[Shehezaada]

Dhoni's greatest strength is his calmness. He never seems frustrated, never seems too over the top. This seems a little out of character from the usual Indian captain, who either seem to be too nervous (Ganguly, Azza) , or seem to be a little too intense (Tendulkar, Dravid) Having said that, he needs to seriously work on his captaincy when he is bowling to tailenders. Too often we'll see a single immediately being given to the "set" batsmen, and all out attack on the tailender. This might work with an extreme bunny like Martin, but even for players that can barelly hold a bat this isn't a good option. The set batsmen isn't going to get out, and is free to milk singles and/or smash boundaries on the 5th/6th balls of the over. The tailender can either hang in there or take the attack to the opposition. Why not try to attack at both ends ? Also his use of Harbhajan isn't the greatest. Sure he hasn't bowled too well over the past couple of years, but he hasn't been used in an attacking way either. Long on with SA 62/4 and having 4 wickets down? Third man boundary rider if Kallis reverse sweeps a couple of times? Dhoni has a hand in this as well, just as much as Bhajji does for not telling his skipper exactly what he wants. Dhoni is inspiste of all this, to repeat Professorji's post, a fantastic skipper. I couldn't be more happier with this team over the past 2 years, and Dhoni has a major hand to play in it. But he has room to improve, and we wish he does.

[Pak_Forever]

Good calls on Dhoni here. His attitude and humbleness after victories and losses are great to see. I rate his captaincy as the biggest factor for India reaching #1 ranking. The guy also has limited stroke play and technically is not great, but you can see how well he applies himself while batting and how he values his wicket. Got nothing but admiration for him. :hatsoff: to this guy.

[Bumper]

Good thread. Too much is being made of how great this team is, implying that it is a no brainer to lead this team. India has had pretty much the same team for the last 5 years. But the results of late have been dramatically different. Dhoni certainly has a lot to do with it. As for the teams, SRT of today and Dravid of Ganguly's era have swapped roles. #6 batsman continues to be the weak link. The team lacks an all rounder & the attack is led by one bowler (Zaheer now, vs Kumble back then). Pretty much other bowlers are role players. Then why is India #1 ? IMHO, several things have happened simultaneously, that has made India ascend to the #1 spot & stay there: 1) Other teams have become relatively weaker. Aussies, Pakistanis, Lankans (minus Vaas, Murali), NZ (minus Bond, Styris, Oram) have all become significantly weaker. 2) No dominant team to challenge & overthrow us from the #1 spot. 3) Sehwag, SRT, Laxman have attained form simultaneously. The last time Indian batsmen were in such form together was back in 2004 (during Aussie/Pak tour). These guys have kept their form for over a year now 4) Zaheer Khan's revival that has helped us bowl sides out. 5) Dhoni's shrewd captaincy. In the past, some of these factors (such as batsmen's form) have helped us rise as a test nation for transitory periods. But our results were inconsistent. Because all these events are happening simultaneously now, our success has been sustainable. That said, I really believe Dhoni plays a significant role in handling our senior players. Michael Clarke has hardly captained a test (he is 29) and there are already talks about how he will feel uncomfortable with Punter in the dressing room. On field tactics are grossly overrated. There is simply no captain that i have seen who looks brilliant consistently over time. Dhoni's tactics are predominantly good most of the time. One or two bad outings wont change my opinion of him.

[yoda]

Excellent post Bumper. Agree with all of what you have said. :nice:

[Ranjha]

A captain is as good as his team as Australia is finding out.

[Chandan]

There is no way to defend Dhoni's tactics on day 4, once Kallis started reverse sweeping and Boucher mounted a counter attack. However, there is still room to justify his choices.

Why did Dhoni tightened the noose? Why did he release the pressure instead of mounting more to get one wicket? Easy answer is, Did you see how the bowlers were bowling then? Zaheer was bowling at 112-115 ks gentle pace which Kallis and Boucher could face and slaughter even with their eyes closeed! Sree lost focus, was a bit unlucky too and then became wayward. Ishant was unbelievably poor on that particular day when he had no inspiration, no energy to run in hard and give it his all for one final time in the series! Harbhajan did what he could. You don't expect miracles from him abroad with a kookaburra and this was the best he could with a soft ball and with no pressure from the other end. How could Dhoni have attacked with these bowlers having gone so flat that day?

[ZodiaC]

Harbhajan did what he could. You don't expect miracles from him abroad with a kookaburra and this was the best he could with a soft ball and with no pressure from the other end. How could Dhoni have attacked with these bowlers having gone so flat that day?

When he took the man to the boundary for that reverse sweep (which was always a risky shot and could've earned bhajji a wicket), Kallis was with either AB or Prince. You can't expect your seamers to bowl exceptionally well on the 4th day, it's the spinners task to do well on a turning and misbehaving wicket and Bhajji did well. We were in a position to attack atleast at Bhajji's end.

[Chandan]

When he took the man to the boundary for that reverse sweep (which was always a risky shot and could've earned bhajji a wicket)' date=' Kallis was with either AB or Prince. You can't expect your seamers to bowl exceptionally well on the 4th day, it's the spinners task to do well on a turning and misbehaving wicket and Bhajji did well. We were in a position to attack atleast at Bhajji's end.[/quote'] Don't you think Bhajji would've realised his limitation there that he couldn't get more purchase from a soft kookaburra ball? He couldn't make it bounce and jump any more as he could in the 1st session?

[ZodiaC]

Don't you think Bhajji would've realised his limitation there that he couldn't get more purchase from a soft kookaburra ball? He couldn't make it bounce and jump any more as he could in the 1st session?

57.4 Harbhajan Singh to Boucher, no run, 79.9 kph, big turn for Harbhajan, Boucher looks to defend off the front foot, but the ball misses the bat by several inches, was spinning so much that it was going well down so the lbw appeal is muted

And we were off to defensive fields way way before. Ball being Kookaburra or SG had hardly anything to do with it IMO.

[maniac]

Dhoni is better at being a diplomat than a leader.

[maniac]

A captain is as good as his team as Australia is finding out.

Disagree with that as Fleming and Arjuna Ranatunga debunked the theory before.They made fighters and winners out of a very ordinary team.

[The Outsider]

Why did Dhoni tightened the noose? Why did he release the pressure instead of mounting more to get one wicket? Easy answer is, Did you see how the bowlers were bowling then? Zaheer was bowling at 112-115 ks gentle pace which Kallis and Boucher could face and slaughter even with their eyes closeed! Sree lost focus, was a bit unlucky too and then became wayward. Ishant was unbelievably poor on that particular day when he had no inspiration, no energy to run in hard and give it his all for one final time in the series! Harbhajan did what he could. You don't expect miracles from him abroad with a kookaburra and this was the best he could with a soft ball and with no pressure from the other end. How could Dhoni have attacked with these bowlers having gone so flat that day?

Agree with the circumstances you've described above, but I feel we lost track of the situation of the match. Dhoni should have realized that even in the worst case scenario South Africa are not going to declare at anything less than a 3.5 RPO target, which effectively meant that in that situation we would have had 380 to chase in around 100 overs if everything went wrong. You've got to back this batting line up to bat out 100 overs where the primary threat is the new ball, and the opposition does not have a spinner to speak of. The up side of it would have been that we could have been chasing 250 or even much less. But I completely understand why Dhoni did that - we are out of the era of captains making a contest sporting. The stakes have become so high in the game that safety is always the prime goal of every captain. And can you really blame the captains after the way Smith was lambasted for his declaration at Sydney 5 years back. In modern cricket you can essentially forget about declarations which leave the opposition a target of anything less than 3.5 RPO in the last innings.

[Homerus_Unus]

They made fighters and winners out of a very ordinary team.

I don't think teams with Jayasuriya, Murali, Vaas, De Silva, etc. or Cairns, Astle, McMillan, Vettori etc., can be termed ordinary. Underrated, would be more like it. The NZ were a gritty bunch with good talent (not superlative, but good) and as for the Lankan team- the world basically was caught unaware to the juggernaut that swept them in 1996 and has commanded a respectable standing since.