3 main selection head aches for Feb 19th

[criczero]

Going with two quickies only is a big gamble. Firstly, if batsman successfully goes after them, spinners may be exposed too early during powerplays. Secondly, and very likely, if one of them picks some injury, spinners may find it difficult to handle it during batting power plays.

[Sachin=GOD]

Going with two quickies only is a big gamble. Firstly, if batsman successfully goes after them, spinners may be exposed too early during powerplays. Secondly, and very likely, if one of them picks some injury, spinners may find it difficult to handle it during batting power plays.

but seeing the form of our pacers, the less the better :haha:

[Ultimate_Game]

If we go with 2 pacers then we need to go in with Ashwin as he can bowl during the power-play and at the death. Wouldn't want a leggie (Chawla) bowling with just 2-3 fielders at the boundary. This is where we are missing Irfan Pathan as he could be brought in as an all-rounder and his slow cutters can come in handy on sub-continent pitches.

[jf1gp_1]

why do people think that Yusuf is a given in the team over Yuvraj & Raina?

thats the first thing i thought after reading OP, its yusuf who will miss out not yuvi or raina

[Zap_Brannigan]

Although 3 decisions regarding the team composition are still up in the air, the choices have come down. 1. I think there is no use in going with a 3rd pacer over a 2nd spinner as Sree,Munaf and Nehra has been bad in recent times. So 2+2 is the best option. So it is Sree or munaf or nehra for the 2nd pacer option. I dont think its gonna matter much because all 3 are prone to inconsistencies. 2.The next 2 decisions are going to be really hard.Although Chawla has been good in the practice games, Ashwin is valuable during the powerplay and during death overs. So, i would go with Ashwin atleast for the 1st couple of games to test him. 3.Pathan and Kholi is a must for team balance. We cannot risk leaving out our 2 best ODI batsman in the last 2 series. So its between Raina Vs yuvi for the #6 spot. Without Chawla in the side, Yuvi's left arm will provide a good option. So yuvi over Raina.

[SachDan]

K449GCouDSI Now we know the playing X1 :)

[kabira]

Although 3 decisions regarding the team composition are still up in the air, the choices have come down. 1. I think there is no use in going with a 3rd pacer over a 2nd spinner as Sree,Munaf and Nehra has been bad in recent times. So 2+2 is the best option. So it is Sree or munaf or nehra for the 2nd pacer option. I dont think its gonna matter much because all 3 are prone to inconsistencies. 2.The next 2 decisions are going to be really hard.Although Chawla has been good in the practice games, Ashwin is valuable during the powerplay and during death overs. So, i would go with Ashwin atleast for the 1st couple of games to test him. 3.Pathan and Kholi is a must for team balance. We cannot risk leaving out our 2 best ODI batsman in the last 2 series. So its between Raina Vs yuvi for the #6 spot. Without Chawla in the side, Yuvi's left arm will provide a good option. So yuvi over Raina.

Totally agree here..Mirpur will be high scoring ground, we saw scores in Asia Cup (one before last), even 300 was chaseable there. Ashwin will be better than any seamer. Yuvi over Raina as of now. Both don't inspire much confidence in batting, but Yuvi's bowling form gets nod over Raina.

[zen]

Unless, we plan to get UV back in to form (by playing him in the first 2-3 games), I would go w/ 6+5 (3 seamers + 2 spinners) in the first few games, esp on flat surfaces against teams which are not likely to bowl Ind out cheaply. And if they do bowl Ind out cheaply, then you would need the extra bowler :winky:

[Sachinism]

We also need to assess the opposition, when playing a team with spinners Raina over Yuvi?

[achilles]

1. 3+1 would be good. 2. If two spinners are picked, it should be Bhajji and Chawla. 3. Yuvraj doesn't need to replace anyone. He is not a 19yr old kid playing his first world cup.

[Zap_Brannigan]

Unless' date=' we plan to get UV back in to form (by playing him in the first 2-3 games), I would go w/ 6+5 (3 seamers + 2 spinners) in the first few games, esp on flat surfaces against teams which are not likely to bowl Ind out cheaply. And if they do bowl Ind out cheaply, then you would need the extra bowler :winky:[/quote'] 5 bowlers is redundant. We have Pathan, Sehwag, Sachin, Yuvi/Raina to bowl too.

[zen]

5 bowlers is redundant. We have Pathan' date=' Sehwag, Sachin, Yuvi/Raina to bowl too.[/quote'] Everybody knows who can bowl and bat. You need to understand what the idea behind having the additional option of 10 overs from a specialist bowler. If you don't, then the 5th bowler is redundant because the "part-timers can" bowl too

[Ram]

Don’t know that the fuss is about. There's actually one, just one selection quandry left. Dhoni has essntially already picked the rest of the team. Its Sach Viru GG Virat Yuvi Dhoni Yusuf Bhajji Zak Ashwin/Sreesanth Nehra. And I am mildly amused at people suggesting Chawla should be picked ahead of Ashwin? Based on what, two warm up games?! Ashwin has been performing well since last year’s IPL and inspires a lot of confidence in MSD. If you guys remember, MSD even went as far as giving Ashwin the super-over in one of the matches. That is how much he backs him. Ashwin is probably THE most accomplished spinner in the team when it comes to bowling in power-plays, a skill that will be critical to our chances going forward in the tournament, as eve half-good teams will decent batting orders will invariably get off to a flying start (case in point, the previous game against NZ). Then, it will upto the spinners to reign the opposition in, like they did against NZ. Ashwin’s increased natural variation/guile, which partly stems from his action and height and no-brainer winners in this situation. Plus, he is probably the one spinner who has most experience bowling in power-play overs, which he did right through IPL 2010, yet managing to emerge the most economical Indian spinner in that tournament (a list, I might add, includes the names Chawla and Bhajji). In an age where spinners loathe bowling in the PP overs, Aswhin seems to relish and thrive in the challenge. Plus, I am not still entirely convinced about Chawla. I think once teams sort his googly out, he wont be half as menacing as he looked the other day against New Zealand. In fact, I am even surprised he looks as menacing as he done so far. Plus, wrist spinners are always under the constant threat of getting absolutely pummeled in an over (3, 4 sixes even) and generally have the tendency to bowl more loose balls. Who knows, Chawla might well emerge the surprise candidate/trump card going forward, but at least for now, he has no place in my team And any suggestion that Yuvraj’s place in the team is in jeopardy is laughable. During the last press conference, MSD was actually already mulling about promoting Yuvi to no.4 when he begins to score runs and the selection dilemas that will cause, because it will force Virat to move down the order, where he’s not as accomplished. In essence, the team management is already well on the way of planning for a bigger role for Yuvraj in the team as the tournament progresses. To say that his place is under debate, especially given his part-time bowling, is almost naïve to the point of being completely ignorant.

[The Outsider]

^ LOL! I love the way you always seem to have the pulse on the thinking and inner workings of the Indian team management. What happened to your bet that Kohli will not feature in the opening game of the WC? Chawla has bowled superbly. There is nothing like a leg spinner in form. You can have all your doosras, carom balls, and off spinners, but leg spinners can run through sides and win matches. I won't bring Warne into the discussion because he was in a class of his own, but the '92 WC final was won through attacking bowling of Akram and Mushtaq Ahmed. Chawla is looking in great form, look at how he turned the game around against Australia. A finger spinner, can never do that. Ashwin might get a nod ahead of him just because of the PP overs, but there is very little to choose between them and it won't surprise me if Chawla starts ahead of Ashwin against teams like England and South Africa.

[diegovegaz]

bd are good hitters of spin bowling we should go with 3 pacers in zak, sree, munna raina struck some form in the last game, but still kohli has the upper hand

[zen]

Don’t know that the fuss is about. There's actually one, just one selection quandry left. Dhoni has essntially already picked the rest of the team. Its Sach Viru GG Virat Yuvi Dhoni Yusuf Bhajji Zak Ashwin/Sreesanth Nehra. And I am mildly amused at people suggesting Chawla should be picked ahead of Ashwin? Based on what, two warm up games?! Ashwin has been performing well since last year’s IPL and inspires a lot of confidence in MSD. If you guys remember, MSD even went as far as giving Ashwin the super-over in one of the matches. That is how much he backs him. Ashwin is probably THE most accomplished spinner in the team when it comes to bowling in power-plays, a skill that will be critical to our chances going forward in the tournament, as eve half-good teams will decent batting orders will invariably get off to a flying start (case in point, the previous game against NZ). Then, it will upto the spinners to reign the opposition in, like they did against NZ. Ashwin’s increased natural variation/guile, which partly stems from his action and height and no-brainer winners in this situation. Plus, he is probably the one spinner who has most experience bowling in power-play overs, which he did right through IPL 2010, yet managing to emerge the most economical Indian spinner in that tournament (a list, I might add, includes the names Chawla and Bhajji). In an age where spinners loathe bowling in the PP overs, Aswhin seems to relish and thrive in the challenge. Plus, I am not still entirely convinced about Chawla. I think once teams sort his googly out, he wont be half as menacing as he looked the other day against New Zealand. In fact, I am even surprised he looks as menacing as he done so far. Plus, wrist spinners are always under the constant threat of getting absolutely pummeled in an over (3, 4 sixes even) and generally have the tendency to bowl more loose balls. Who knows, Chawla might well emerge the surprise candidate/trump card going forward, but at least for now, he has no place in my team And any suggestion that Yuvraj’s place in the team is in jeopardy is laughable. During the last press conference, MSD was actually already mulling about promoting Yuvi to no.4 when he begins to score runs and the selection dilemas that will cause, because it will force Virat to move down the order, where he’s not as accomplished. In essence, the team management is already well on the way of planning for a bigger role for Yuvraj in the team as the tournament progresses. To say that his place is under debate, especially given his part-time bowling, is almost naïve to the point of being completely ignorant.

My guess the no brainer cricinfo X :giggle: - SRT - VS - GG - VK (I have been saying this should be the top 4) :hehe: - Yuvi - Dhoni - YP / Raina (here the order would be flexable) - Bhajji - Zak - Nehra / Sree I wouldn't bother with writing essays on basic stuff which most are suppose to know :P

[Ranjha]

2 spinners Harbhajan and Chawla No ashwin PLEASE Drop Raina And the team looks solid.

[Ram]

^ LOL! I love the way you always seem to have the pulse on the thinking and inner workings of the Indian team management. What happened to your bet that Kohli will not feature in the opening game of the WC?

I said the decision to include Kohli for Raina was not as straightforward as people thought it was, especially given the utility of Kohli down the order. MSD pretty much echoed that sentiment, when he said if Yuvraj fires early in the tournament, they might have to promote him to no.4, which would mean he would Kohli would have to go down the order, where he wouldn’t be as effective and at that point, they might bring Raina in. So yea, I was actually thinking along the lines of the Indian team already there, probably before everybody else. :P Plus, I also went to concede in the same thread that the Indian team would find it very hard not to include Kohli in the middle order, given the form of some of the other guys and his affinity for chases, and that the decision wasn’t as black-and-white people thought it would be as it would affect the dynamics of the middle order. You poo-pooed me immediately after I bigged up Yusuf after the 100 against NZ and the IPL auction, saying the ‘IPL hype-machine is working overtime..’. Yusuf duly smashed two of the better innings you have seen played by an Indian batsmen ODIs. Back then, I already knew Yusuf was a shoo-in for the WC XI and told as much. I’d have actually loved if he hadnt played or completely failed in the Saffie series because then, when he does play in the opening game, I would have stood undoubtedly vindicated. Alas, that aint gonna happen now.

Chawla has bowled superbly. There is nothing like a leg spinner in form. You can have all your doosras, carom balls, and off spinners, but leg spinners can run through sides and win matches. I won't bring Warne into the discussion because he was in a class of his own, but the '92 WC final was won through attacking bowling of Akram and Mushtaq Ahmed. Chawla is looking in great form, look at how he turned the game around against Australia. A finger spinner, can never do that.

You really havent been watching much cricket of late, have you? Else, how could you possibly make this statement about Chawla? The dude has played 2, just 2 warm-ups, one of which was on an above-average spin-friendly track that you will probably never again encounter in this WC and you’re completely sold already? Before that, Chawla hadnt done anything of note and was actually the worst Indian spinners in the previous edition of IPL, which I think is an excellent benchmark to compare the run-restricting/wicket-taking skills of the spinners. (See below for stats). And that was why I was completely surprised by even his selection in the first place (thought Ojha should have been there..) Who knows, the selection committee might yet still vindicated and Chawla might still emerge as our trump card in key games, but I was speaking specifically with reference who would the team choose between Chawla and Aswhin and I clearly made my my choice and listed my reasons as to why I felt so. My argument here isnt that Chawla is a bad bowler, it is that this is why I think Aswhin will play ahead of Chawla, at least to start the tournament with. Stats from IPL 2010;

Bowler	Average	 Economy
Ashwin	22.5	6.1
Kumble	23.9	6.34
Karthik  28.16.48
Mishra	21.35	6.84		
Murali	22.9	6.85	
Powar	53.3	6.95
Bhajji	22.17	7.04
Yusuf	49.2	7.23	
Ojha	20.42	7.29
Chawla	30.5	7.48
J’riya	34	7.55
Murtaza	30.3	7.58
Warne	34.63	7.62
Jakati	22.3	7.65

[The Outsider]

I said the decision to include Kohli for Raina was not as straightforward as people thought it was, especially given the utility of Kohli down the order. MSD pretty much echoed that sentiment, when he said if Yuvraj fires early in the tournament, they might have to promote him to no.4, which would mean he would Kohli would have to go down the order, where he wouldn’t be as effective and at that point, they might bring Raina in. So yea, I was actually thinking along the lines of the Indian team already there, probably before everybody else. :P

Oh yeah? Here are a few of your quotes :

At least to start the WC, it will be Sachin+Viru at the top, Gambhir at no.3, Yuvraj at 4, MSD at 5, Raina at 6 and Yusuf at 7.

Given this, the only way to accommodate Kohli is to play 7 specialist batsmen and that isn’t going to happen because that will end-up short-changing our spin options.

I am willing to bet a $100 bucks and say and fitness permitting, we’re almost 100% certain to play the line-up I listed.

Yes, it is unfair that Kohli will be dropped, but that is almost 100% certain to happen.

And here is the best one :winky: :

And i’ll happily bump this thread when the line-up for the first match is announced and Kohli is missing from the line-up. :winky:

You poo-pooed me immediately after I bigged up Yusuf after the 100 against NZ and the IPL auction, saying the ‘IPL hype-machine is working overtime..’. Yusuf duly smashed two of the better innings you have seen played by an Indian batsmen ODIs. Back then, I already knew Yusuf was a shoo-in for the WC XI and told as much. I’d have actually loved if he hadnt played or completely failed in the Saffie series because then, when he does play in the opening game, I would have stood undoubtedly vindicated. Alas, that aint gonna happen now.

If you think Yusuf Pathan is a certainty in the line up because of that hundred against NZ and the confidence boost he has received from $2 million () then keep fooling yourself. Here is what I wrote and it has panned out exactly that ways, but I don't feel the need to go about bragging of having a hotline with the Indian management :

I don't believe he is a certainty at all. It depends on how Kohli, Yuvraj, and Yusuf perform over the next 4 ODIs.

I think they will play Yusuf on the slower pitches at Port Elizabeth, Centurion, and Cape Town and decide on that basis.

You really havent been watching much cricket of late, have you? Else, how could you possibly make this statement about Chawla? The dude has played 2, just 2 warm-ups, one of which was on an above-average spin-friendly track that you will probably never again encounter in this WC and you’re completely sold already? Before that, Chawla hadnt done anything of note and was actually the worst Indian spinners in the previous edition of IPL, which I think is an excellent benchmark to compare the run-restricting/wicket-taking skills of the spinners. (See below for stats). And that was why I was completely surprised by even his selection in the first place (thought Ojha should have been there..)

If by cricket you mean IPL, then no I haven't been watching much of it. Look, I don't care what these guys did a few months back or a year back and would gladly concede that Ashwin has done better. But this is not to decide who gets the spinner of the year award. Chawla, in these two matches, has looked superb and as I said a wrist spinner in form is infinitely more valuable than a finger spinner. Based on form, Chawla is the better choice but has the PP limitation and given the poor form of our pace bowlers they might not risk him.

[Ram]

Oh yeah? Here are a few of your quotes And here is the best one :winky: :

You don’t have to requote my old posts back to me. I exactly remember what I said. :winky: When everyone else was clamoring for Kohli instead of Raina, I was the one who said the decsion isnt straight-forward in the first place and that all things considered equal, Raina would have figured in the line-up ahead of Kohli, with the caveat being that the dodgy form of Dhoni and Yuvraj coming into the world is what that could potentially tip the scales in favor of Kohli. How hard is that to understand? :winky:

If you think Yusuf Pathan is a certainty in the line up because of that hundred against NZ and the confidence boost he has received from $2 million () then keep fooling yourself. Here is what I wrote and it has panned out exactly that ways, but I don't feel the need to go about bragging of having a hotline with the Indian management :

BS. If anything, Yusuf scoring the runs that he did in South Africa was actually your get-out-of-jail card. Even before his innings in the South African series, I was confident that he had it in him to succeed in Indian conditions, which is what is really important here. I’d love to know if you genuinely thought Yusuf had it in him to play the innings he did, in South Africa, against Steyn/Morkel? My premise was that he was always a confidence player whose fortunes rise and fall with his mindset and that, going into the world cup, his form/confidence was peaking at the right time. Your reply to that? – ‘ICF hype machinery was working overtime..’.

If by cricket you mean IPL, then no I haven't been watching much of it. Look, I don't care what these guys did a few months back or a year back and would gladly concede that Ashwin has done better. But this is not to decide who gets the spinner of the year award. Chawla, in these two matches, has looked superb and as I said a wrist spinner in form is infinitely more valuable than a finger spinner. Based on form, Chawla is the better choice but has the PP limitation and given the poor form of our pace bowlers they might not risk him.

What the heck! :hysterical: You’re willing to go by what happened in two warm up games but will completely dismiss what happened across 14 games (which is a significantly more reasonable time-frame to judge bowlers), only 10 months ago on the very same pitches on which a majority of the WC is going to be played? Irrespective of the actual utility of IPL, I think its one of the best avenues to judge how our spinners are faring against attacking batting on flat pitches, which is essentially what they will face in the WC and you’re saying what happened then is completely meaningless? Lol.. But hey, here’s where our opinions do converge – I too liked what I saw of Chawla in the warm-ups as well (pleasantlly surprised in fact..). But unlike you, good performances in two games isnt good enough to convince me. I’d would like to wait a little longer before deciding one way or the other on Chawla. I think he’s extremely dependent on his googly to fool the batsmen and that’s a potential pitfall you’ve completely ignored.