Brainfade Posted May 2, 2011 Share Posted May 2, 2011 We had a lively discussion a while ago about waterboarding. This article adds some flavor to it: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/pakistan/8488436/WikiLeaks-Osama-bin-Laden-killed-after-tip-offs-from-Guantanamo.html Khalid Sheikh Mohammed (KSM), who was repeatedly subjected to methods including “waterboarding” and stress positions, provided the CIA with the name of bin Laden’s personal courier, according to US officials. A second source – also an al-Qaeda “leader” held at Guantanamo Bay – then confirmed the courier’s identity, sparking an intense manhunt that resulted in the dramatic final raid. Secret documents seen by The Daily Telegraph disclose that this second source – the terrorist operations chief, Abu Faraj al-Libi – played a key role in finding “safe havens” for bin Laden and lived in the military town where he was finally found. The killing of the world’s most wanted man as a direct result of information obtained from Guantanamo detainees such as KSM will reignite the debate over whether torture is a legitimate interrogation technique in the "war on terror". Both KSM and al-Libi were subjected to harsh techniques during their interrogations in CIA prisons. Amnesty International has already warned that the killing of bin Laden must not be used as evidence that torture is “justifiable”. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
king2be98 Posted May 2, 2011 Share Posted May 2, 2011 I'd like to see proof he's dead, so either we'll get it or more likely we won't get it and conspiracy theories open up across the world. Given that there are thousands of Americans who actually believe America is more at blame for 9/11 than any foreigners, it won't be a surprise if we see many more. But first we need proof of his death and not photoshopped nonsense. I recently saw a tutorial on photoshop and using rotobrush to mix faces, it seems anyone can do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yoda Posted May 2, 2011 Share Posted May 2, 2011 Here is an example, on SKY this morning, a reporter asked the High Commisioner of Pakistan the following question. "Why are Pakistan hiding terrorists?" Such a biased question. Whereas a lesser news channel asking a Pakistani member of the government in the UK asked in a fair way, "If Osama has been caught in Pakistan territory, is it possible that they are helping terrorists?" Just the way these questions are asked enough to sway the audience, it's disgusting and all media does it. So no point in listening or watching to it. Those are legitimate questions. You think it is biased cause it hurts the image of your country. Having a known terrorist living safely in your country means he is getting help from some inside your country. Now the question is who are those who helped him stay there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ram Posted May 2, 2011 Share Posted May 2, 2011 And for the purposes of objective analysis, just a couple of things that do not add up; News reports say that the intelligence first started tracking OBL in that compound sometime around last August (?).. That nearly 10 months since the time they suspected OBL was living there.. I am sorry, but you need to mind numbingly dumb to establish camp at a single location, that too a conspicuous mansion type house with 12 foot walls, barbed wires, security cameras on the perimeter and two layers of privacy doors for months on end, especially if you’re topmost of the world’s most wanted list. Surely, Bin Laden isn’t stupid enough to do that? I mean this, this is evasion 101! Then, this whole story about the American helicopter that mysterious developed technical problems and crash landed and was later burned down completely does not add up at all. If it developed mechanical issues and crash landed, why were there no American injured or casualties? Even if it so happened that they did manage to land the chopper, this whole story about it being burned down to remove traces of any intelligence.. I am sorry, even a 10 year old will not believe that story.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vvvslaxman Posted May 2, 2011 Share Posted May 2, 2011 I do not think lot of informations will be revealed. They will take it to their grave. They probably killed him long back and wanted to release it late for political gain. But i do not doubt one bit he was given protection by Pakistan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mamu Posted May 2, 2011 Share Posted May 2, 2011 Funny how the Indian media is responding to this, using the same biased reasoning that the americans are too. Indian media making up excuses as to why no pictures have been released. Why the body was buried at sea etc. America showed the world straight away Saddam and the world didn't have any conspiracy theories anymore, until Osama's pictures/video footage are shown, a lot of people will ask if he was really killed or not. I don't believe anything any media in the world comes out with. In fact I often find that life is easier if you don't bother with the news. You tend to have less biased views because you don't listen to the news. Here is an example, on SKY this morning, a reporter asked the High Commisioner of Pakistan the following question. "Why are Pakistan hiding terrorists?" Such a biased question. Whereas a lesser news channel asking a Pakistani member of the government in the UK asked in a fair way, "If Osama has been caught in Pakistan territory, is it possible that they are helping terrorists?" Just the way these questions are asked enough to sway the audience, it's disgusting and all media does it. So no point in listening or watching to it. How many Terrorists -- you want me to name that have been caught Hiding in Pakistan? Huh? HOw many Indian Terrorists are currently hiding in Pakistan? How many incidents of Terrorism all around the world you want me to name that have had some or the other link with Pakistan? What is so biased about it? The problem is with False Egos that you Pakis are living with. Dude get out of the sand pit you are living in -- with your head buried in -- Enough of this bull ****. Start thinking about what you and your fellow Paki Citizens can do to get that nation in dumps -- out of it, instead of getting hooked up on petty things on how media is portraying your nation, which is nothing but truth. Unfortunately truth about Pakistan is nothing but very very bitter. No matter how you look at it -- Pakistan is nothing but a Harborer of Terrorists, Abettor of Terrorism . There are no two F'ing ways about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
king2be98 Posted May 2, 2011 Share Posted May 2, 2011 Those are legitimate questions. You think it is biased cause it hurts the image of your country. Having a known terrorist living safely in your country means he is getting help from some inside your country. Now the question is who are those who helped him stay there. To you they seem ok questions because you probably feed off these news channels and news papers. You should actually read the books and journals of formers journalists and how they are forced to write in a certain way. One of the leading reporters for The Guardian (a newspaper in the UK) said that his editor and the board of directors had an indirect agenda to target Muslims. A white man kills a person the headline is "A man kills....." a muslim man kills headline reads "A muslim man kills...." Don't you see the double standards and the bias of the reporting? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ram Posted May 2, 2011 Share Posted May 2, 2011 The details of the operation have been sketchy so far, but I must say, for a mission that consumed arguably the most high profile target in the world since maybe Hitler, it seemed to have gone rather painlessly. First, they say there were no American casualties at all, which itself is weird. What is more weird is that the reports indicate that including OBL, the number of dead is 5. And of that, one was a women who was used a human shield? Really? A women as a human shield, his adult son and a couple of other guys were the total number of people commissioned to protect to OBL? While this may have sounded consistent had he been terminated in some hut in a village, but they say this was by far the biggest compound in that area, nearly 8 times the size of the average house there and there was all but 6 inhabitants, including OBL there? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Late Cut Posted May 2, 2011 Share Posted May 2, 2011 Funny how the Indian media is responding to this, using the same biased reasoning that the americans are too. Indian media making up excuses as to why no pictures have been released. Why the body was buried at sea etc. America showed the world straight away Saddam and the world didn't have any conspiracy theories anymore, until Osama's pictures/video footage are shown, a lot of people will ask if he was really killed or not. I don't believe anything any media in the world comes out with. In fact I often find that life is easier if you don't bother with the news. You tend to have less biased views because you don't listen to the news. Here is an example, on SKY this morning, a reporter asked the High Commisioner of Pakistan the following question. "Why are Pakistan hiding terrorists?" Such a biased question. Whereas a lesser news channel asking a Pakistani member of the government in the UK asked in a fair way, "If Osama has been caught in Pakistan territory, is it possible that they are helping terrorists?" Just the way these questions are asked enough to sway the audience, it's disgusting and all media does it. So no point in listening or watching to it. So wait, Pakistain is not hiding terrorists...hmmm...i guess the terrorists are hiding in pakistan? ( they obviously live there)? or why is pakistan training terrorists? or is that now, why do terrorists go to pakistan to train? why is Osama hiding in Pakistan? Wait, you want people to prove stuff to you now? Why? Isn't the weight of the events past, from all the terrorist attacks within your own country, from the fact that every terrorist trains in pakistan, to Osama living in Pakistan, to pakistanis martyring Osama and singing his praise (or are they "plants" and not Pakistanis), point to an endemic, system wide issue? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
king2be98 Posted May 2, 2011 Share Posted May 2, 2011 How many Terrorists -- you want me to name that have been caught Hiding in Pakistan? Huh? HOw many Indian Terrorists are currently hiding in Pakistan? What is so biased about it? The problem is with False Egos that you Pakis are living with. Dude get out of the sand pit you are living in -- with your head buried in -- Enough of this bull ****. Start thinking about what you and your fellow Paki Citizens can do to get that nation in dumps -- out of it, instead of getting hooked up on petty things on how media is portraying your nation, which is nothing but truth. Unfortunately truth about Pakistan is nothing but very very bitter. How about you go suck on your own balls you racist and ignorant fool. Your blind hatred for Pakistanis means not a word of what you say can be taken seriously. You are also a sad and miserable man, after Pakistan drew the test series against Australia in England last year instead of saying well done they played well, you started to ramble on about politics. Seriously **** off idiot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asterix Posted May 2, 2011 Share Posted May 2, 2011 Mashallah.. Hundreds join first Pakistan rally to honour bin Laden QUETTA: Hundreds took to the streets of Pakistan’s city of Quetta on Monday to pay homage to Osama bin Laden, chanting death to America and setting fire to a US flag, witnesses and organisers said. Angry participants belonging to a religious party in Quetta, the capital of southwestern province Baluchistan, were led by federal lawmaker Maulawi Asmatullah. They also torched a US flag before dispersing peacefully. It was the first rally in Pakistan after the United States announced that bin Laden had been killed in an overnight commando mission in Pakistan. Organisers said between 1,000 and 1,200 people attended the rally, but witnesses put the figure closer to 800. “Bin Laden was the hero of the Muslim world and after his martyrdom he has won the title of great mujahed (Muslim fighter),” Asmatullah said. http://www.dawn.com/2011/05/02/hundreds-join-first-pakistan-rally-to-honour-bin-laden.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
king2be98 Posted May 2, 2011 Share Posted May 2, 2011 You guys are really pathetic, the good thing is, in the real world at least Indians don't demonstrate such hatred. Most of the Indians I know are very friendly with us and we are back to them. It's a real shame that most of you come on here to display your true selves, which is completely racist. **** this *****y site and the gay ass members who post with such bias. Adios. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain of Bhangra Posted May 2, 2011 Share Posted May 2, 2011 BTW CIA (They were in charge of this operation) have stated that they've not released any photos of the body of Osama. They've all the photos and whichever photos is circulating on the web' date=' is fake..[/quote'] Now that would make sense, or it could be that they circulated these, realised how bad the photo-shopping is, and then released that story... Whoever up there made the crack about conspiracy theories, I'm entitled to my opinion, and while things may be clear-cut and rosey for those being bosom-fed in the States, my opinion is shared by many in the UK (who are subject to practically the same media). This means rather than look different/clever, I'm actually blending in with the crowd. The good news is though, he must be dead. Whether it happened now, or ages ago... Don't forget, Saddam was a lesser target, and they went to great extremes to prove his capture, kept him alive, made him answer to his crimes, then filmed his execution. Based on that, Osama wasn't just going to be shot and lobbed into the sea... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brainfade Posted May 2, 2011 Share Posted May 2, 2011 Now that would make sense, or it could be that they circulated these, realised how bad the photo-shopping is, and then released that story... Whoever up there made the crack about conspiracy theories, I'm entitled to my opinion, and while things may be clear-cut and rosey for those being bosom-fed in the States, my opinion is shared by many in the UK (who are subject to practically the same media). This means rather than look different/clever, I'm actually blending in with the crowd. The good news is though, he must be dead. Whether it happened now, or ages ago... Don't forget, Saddam was a lesser target, and they went to great extremes to prove his capture, kept him alive, made him answer to his crimes, then filmed his execution. Based on that, Osama wasn't just going to be shot and lobbed into the sea... Why now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asterix Posted May 2, 2011 Share Posted May 2, 2011 Why now? Because the Afghan "peace" process in at it's final stages..US wants to pull out of Afghanistan ASAP. It want to come out of it with some "honours". Pakistan wants to control Af-Pak situation and doesn't wants any Indian hegemony. Hence the "deal" to dump Osama finalised. USA gets what it wants, Pakistan gets what it wants.. The process speeded up after the Afghan peac meet between rival factions held recently in London. One of the requirements of Taliban to come into the "mainstream" is to "relenquish" the path of voilebce. In that case Pakistan will only have to follow the "peaceful" ways and means to control that region. Hence Pakistan want to remove India from that scenario and the assurance was given by NATO and Afghan govt. Bin Laden is part of that deal.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain of Bhangra Posted May 2, 2011 Share Posted May 2, 2011 Why now? Maybe it is only now that they received intelligence that made them 100% certain he was dead, OR, there could be something coming up that we're unaware of, that needs the kind of spin this produces for the US Govt... Either way, a LOT of people here are refusing to 100% believe it until they see convincing footage/photos, so hopfully the boys in the labs are putting the finishing touches to those soon... When Saddam's 2 sons were killed, their dead faces were on the cover of every British newspaper immediately... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
putrevus Posted May 2, 2011 Share Posted May 2, 2011 what more proof these Pakistani fools wants US never trusted Pakistanis in this issue and they need to show the world why was he living under their military's nose Mr Brennan adds that the Pakistani military did not know about the mission until after the US left Pakistan's air space. "We were watching and making sure our people were able to get out of their air space" before Pakistan's military arrived Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mamu Posted May 2, 2011 Share Posted May 2, 2011 How about you go suck on your own balls you racist and ignorant fool. Your blind hatred for Pakistanis means not a word of what you say can be taken seriously. You are also a sad and miserable man, after Pakistan drew the test series against Australia in England last year instead of saying well done they played well, you started to ramble on about politics. Seriously **** off idiot. Truth hurt my friend? I am the mirror where you are the seeeing your real image in. Now go back to the F'ing land u came back from and wait for the drone to hit you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mamu Posted May 2, 2011 Share Posted May 2, 2011 You guys are really pathetic, the good thing is, in the real world at least Indians don't demonstrate such hatred. Most of the Indians I know are very friendly with us and we are back to them. It's a real shame that most of you come on here to display your true selves, which is completely racist. **** this *****y site and the gay ass members who post with such bias. Adios. We will not miss Terrorists here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VRV Singh Posted May 2, 2011 Share Posted May 2, 2011 Mashallah.. So it begins... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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