Dial ‘M’ for Match-Fixing

[Vijay.Sharma]

Sorry mate. I'd have to disagree with you here. And since we're strictly NOT dealing with statements like "2003 and 2007 CWCs were fixed", I don't wish to comment on that. I'll comment on what I know. SI is run by journalists

Not true! SI is run by businessmen and the primary objective of any business/company is to continue its existence which in other words means to have a minimum revenue enough to cover their costs and hopefully more.

Journalists are not equipped to hang guilty players.

This has to be one of the greatest if not the greatest positive principle of our justice system

They are merely bringing you their version of the truth.

That is a fallacious assumption. The truth is yet to be discovered. What they have presented so far is a version of their belief. There is absolutely no justification to think their belief is based on any events related to player misbehavior. Their belief which is basically a conjecture, right now, seems based on incomplete, irrelevant, possibly inaccurate rants by a few pe0ple who claim to be bookies. SI's "belief" is blindingly obvious of its self-serving nature.

At the moment' date=' they're saying that their version of the [b']truth is:

Misleading statement, that is. The truth is yet to be established.

1) Some players are up to no good 2) They have recorded phone coversations proving this 3) The records will be passed on to the ICC and the BCCI 4) They wouldn't have run these stories if they had no faith in these recordings 5) They are staking their careers, their reputations, hell, their MAGAZINE on this story. The thing you want to do from here on is, pass the tapes on to investigating authorities. And let them work on uncovering more dirt on this matter. And then, let the truth come out.

Now you are making more sense. If only you held back your horses before declaring SI as some kinda organization made up of satya Harishchandras.

Till then' date=' I doubt neither of us is qualified to make a fair judgement on the quality of the story.Have you heard of 'arson'? With arson you have the entire fire at your disposal. You don't need to look out just for the smoke. I feel the SI story' date=' at this point in time, is arson than a detection of smoke. Although arson is a punishable crime it also requires a solid motivation to be established. The only way motivation can be established as far as proving that SI's rant is an arson is if SI had taken specific names. [b']Nothing stops SI from revealing the names openly except the fear of being charged for arson. Hence they smartly ignite the fire covering their bases and let gullible people provide the oxygen to keep the fire burning. Journalists are professional arsonists, metaphorically speaking - it is their livelihood, it is what puts food on the table for their families, it is what helps them survive, it is what helps them send their children to schools, it is what helps them to buy clothes, it is what helps them have shelter. Why does this look like an arson instead of smoke? A simple comparison with the "true" story by NOTW. Right from day 1 they named the player(s) involved. I am afraid our arsonists, SI, either don't have the balls to do that (you have to wonder why they are part of the fourth estate if they don't have the balls to reveal the truth!) or found a timely opportunity to engineer this arson for obvious self-serving interests. By the way does SI have no rights to cover the IPL...no free entry in stadiums? can't use photographs? can't interview IPL players? not invited to IPL parties? cannot cover IPL matches? etc?

I am least bothered about the "quality" of the story. I am bothered about its accuracy i.e. its truth value. And to evaluate whether the story is true or false is not rocket science. All it requires is common sense if the evidence is available (no need of a smoking gun like a video that shows the player accepting cash from someone to under perform...even solid circumstantial evidences (i.e. not just one but a few different events/artifacts) will do). Once they are available all of us here have the minimum ability to evaluate the truth value of the claim being made by SI.

[Raghav_12]

I'm sorry to say this sir, but there is no such thing as solid proof or a smoking gun in these matters. And even if someone had Cronje-like balls to admit a mistake, we will still distrust them and say, "He's just the fall guy; the real culprits will never be caught." So it goes. What was the solid proof that led to the bans on Azhar, Jadeja, Prabhakar and the likes? It was all circumstantial evidence; a matter of putting two and two together. Even the NOTW sting isn't solid proof. The ICC has been advised against revealing the details of their trial of the two Mohammads and Salman Butt. Because if they do, the case will fall flat on its face in a real court.

Please argue with correct facts. All hundreds of pages of the report on the detail of that trial were available for public. Report was blocked just in UK because of some legal things i guess. I myself have read through those pages.

[Zap_Brannigan]

Please argue with correct facts. All hundreds of pages of the report on the detail of that trial were available for public. Report was blocked just in UK because of some legal things i guess. I myself have read through those pages.

Facts?? whats that? I dont know why my post was deleted earlier but i wrote that its funny that the guy asking us not to jump on Prem and Dileep till we get more information has no problem is accusing players, BCCI and ICC of worse.

[Chandan]

Here is the link for SI story if anyone is interested: LINK Quite a long story I'd say. Would have been better had they written the conversation in Hindi. Reading the hindi conversation in English is too tedious.

[Raghav_12]

After going through all OP and the discussion that ensued, following my take on whole issue. SI did a lot of hard work to unearth something like what NOTW did in England. They contacted a lot of bookies and dealt with shaddy characters to find out something substantial. Though in this process they got to know about astonishing amount of money put in cricket betting or the kind of influential people involved in this betting, yet they could not find anything with direct involvement of players, something that NOTW did. They found out a lot of malpractices but not any fixing spot or match. However, after commiting so much effort and time, it was not possible for them to control urge of going out in public with whatever findings they gathered, even if they had nothing substantianl on fixing issue. But without sensantionization of issue, article was not going to create any ripples, so they just muddied water and published article with lot of open questions. They did something what Ravi Shastri would have spoken on air like "he misjudged the length of the ball but still went ahead with the shot". I am not gonna give much credence to all this until solid proofs are offered. Some statements from random bookies, boasting having spoken to a player, doesn't mean anything. Anybody having dealt with shaddy charachers even a bit would no how boastful ( "Fenku" in hindi) these characters in general are.. Some concrete proof should come from SI or this report will just show that even after so much of efforts journalists could not find anything wrong with Indian cricket :yay::yay:

[Zap_Brannigan]

So absolutely nothing...piece of sensationalist ****

[Prakat]

As expected.

[Karan114]

ICC to examine tapes on Indian bookies' network ESPNcricinfo staff May 10, 2011 The ICC is in the process of procuring tapes from Sports Illustrated India after the magazine published a story in its May edition on the illegal bookies network in India. The tapes include 400 minutes of conversations the magazine had with people involved in bookmaking - in some cases, the conversations are actually part of police operations. One of the main points of interest to cricket investigators is likely to be a conversation the magazine recorded with a bookie in which he alleges that he has taped conversations of him with an international player in which he is detailing a fix. He also claims to have another taped conversation with the same player after the arrangement fell through, which the magazine claims to have heard (but doesn't have access to). "Our official line is if anybody offers us evidence of any wrongdoing, we will of course look at it and evaluate it," an ICC official told ESPNcricinfo. The ACSU will then take over and study the tapes further. The BCCI said they cannot take any action unless there is "concrete evidence" at hand. "So far we have not received anything from them [sports Illustrated]. They are saying they will give us the tapes, but so far they haven't," BCCI vice-president Rajeev Shukla told Mail Today. "Unless there is concrete evidence, we can't take action in this issue." The main thrust of the magazine's investigation - which it said lasted six months - revolves around how easy it appears to be for bookies to have access to top players. In the magazine's own words there are no startling revelations of the kind cricket saw with the News of the World sting last summer. But the recorded conversations with police officers, officials and players offer a number of starting points for further investigations. Cricket is not alone. Football is currently tackling its own problem - possibly more severe and widespread - of match-fixing. FIFA, the world's governing body, on Monday launched a global initiative along with Interpol that will investigate the suspected manipulation of more than 300 matches in 20 European countries, including games in World Cup qualifying groups and the Champions and Europa Leagues. It has also pledged $20 million to Interpol over the next 10 years to spend on programmes intended to stop players, match officials and administrators being targeted by fixing rings. © ESPN EMEA Ltd. http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/content/story/514481.html

[asterix]

Some news for Pakis to cheer about..

[ganeshran]

After going through all OP and the discussion that ensued, following my take on whole issue. SI did a lot of hard work to unearth something like what NOTW did in England. They contacted a lot of bookies and dealt with shaddy characters to find out something substantial. Though in this process they got to know about astonishing amount of money put in cricket betting or the kind of influential people involved in this betting, yet they could not find anything with direct involvement of players, something that NOTW did. They found out a lot of malpractices but not any fixing spot or match. However, after commiting so much effort and time, it was not possible for them to control urge of going out in public with whatever findings they gathered, even if they had nothing substantianl on fixing issue. But without sensantionization of issue, article was not going to create any ripples, so they just muddied water and published article with lot of open questions. They did something what Ravi Shastri would have spoken on air like "he misjudged the length of the ball but still went ahead with the shot". I am not gonna give much credence to all this until solid proofs are offered. Some statements from random bookies, boasting having spoken to a player, doesn't mean anything. Anybody having dealt with shaddy charachers even a bit would no how boastful ( "Fenku" in hindi) these characters in general are.. Some concrete proof should come from SI or this report will just show that even after so much of efforts journalists could not find anything wrong with Indian cricket :yay::yay:

+1 This is what would have happened.

[Vijay.Sharma]

Raghav's post reminded me of this guy during my college days. He had opened a shop in the basement of the building opposite Aurora Towers in Pune (for ppl familiar with Pune). The guy's name was Mansoor and we used to call him Mansoor bhai. Kya lambe lambe door door ke phekneka woh. We would bunk college and go and sit there just to get entertained. The bugger is hardly an inch over 5 feet. One of his life stories went like this...imagine him speaking to us college guys..."arre chhote tereko kirket ke baare mein kya malum? Apne India mein selection aise ich nahi ho tha...mereko malum hai na". Then one of us gave him little chhavi "Mansoor bhai aap ko cricket selection ke baare mein bhi malum hai?" Then he said, "chhote, jab malum hona tha tab malum nahi tha pan ab sub malum hai apne ko. Vijay, tu idhar time waste mat kar...tu ja direct shivaji park mein....tu shivaji park se khelenga toh tu India team mein full sure hai...aur agar tu select nahi hua toh apan apna ghoda ich nikhal dalenge na...fir toh uska baap bhi tereko select karenga" Then one of us asked "pan Mansoor bhai yeh kya bolre the aap...jab malum hona chahiye tha tab malumn nahi tha....kya shot kya hai? kuch lafda hua tha kya?". Mansoor bhai dropped such a big bomb that all our IC's burst...server down! "Chhote, maal ke bina kuch kaam nahi hota. Main sabse best fast bowler tha...meri selection ho ich gaya tha pan last minute mein Kapil Dev aaya aur ek 'peti' rakh dala selectors ke table pe...fir toh usko ich select karenge na? mere paas kahan se aayenga ek peti? Aur chhote woh zamane mein ek peti aaj ka ek koke ke jitna tha." Finish...the moment he said that me and another friend excused ourselves to go buy a cigarette and ran away from there leaving another friend to keep Mansoor bhai company. Fuqq what an item man he was! For the uninitiated, ghoda (horse) = slang for gun, peti (case) = one lakh, and koka/koke = one crore

[vvvslaxman]

Some news for Pakis to cheer about..

Not really.. 3 pakistan names are involved

[Zap_Brannigan]

Not really.. 3 pakistan names are involved

But the information these guys have are from bookie of a bookie. It could easily be tall tales from some idiot to make himself look important in front of a girl.

[Holysmoke]

Raghav's post reminded me of this guy during my college days. He had opened a shop in the basement of the building opposite Aurora Towers in Pune (for ppl familiar with Pune). The guy's name was Mansoor and we used to call him Mansoor bhai. Kya lambe lambe door door ke phekneka woh. We would bunk college and go and sit there just to get entertained. The bugger is hardly an inch over 5 feet. One of his life stories went like this...imagine him speaking to us college guys..."arre chhote tereko kirket ke baare mein kya malum? Apne India mein selection aise ich nahi ho tha...mereko malum hai na". Then one of us gave him little chhavi "Mansoor bhai aap ko cricket selection ke baare mein bhi malum hai?" Then he said, "chhote, jab malum hona tha tab malum nahi tha pan ab sub malum hai apne ko. Vijay, tu idhar time waste mat kar...tu ja direct shivaji park mein....tu shivaji park se khelenga toh tu India team mein full sure hai...aur agar tu select nahi hua toh apan apna ghoda ich nikhal dalenge na...fir toh uska baap bhi tereko select karenga" Then one of us asked "pan Mansoor bhai yeh kya bolre the aap...jab malum hona chahiye tha tab malumn nahi tha....kya shot kya hai? kuch lafda hua tha kya?". Mansoor bhai dropped such a big bomb that all our IC's burst...server down! "Chhote, maal ke bina kuch kaam nahi hota. Main sabse best fast bowler tha...meri selection ho ich gaya tha pan last minute mein Kapil Dev aaya aur ek 'peti' rakh dala selectors ke table pe...fir toh usko ich select karenge na? mere paas kahan se aayenga ek peti? Aur chhote woh zamane mein ek peti aaj ka ek koke ke jitna tha." Finish...the moment he said that me and another friend excused ourselves to go buy a cigarette and ran away from there leaving another friend to keep Mansoor bhai company. Fuqq what an item man he was! For the uninitiated, ghoda (horse) = slang for gun, peti (case) = one lakh, and koka/koke = one crore

:hysterical::hysterical::hysterical:

[Andy]

Sports Illustrated report on fixing old wine in new bottle? New Delhi: Just when it seemed the dust was settling over the most explosive match-fixing expose in the history of cricket, Sports Illustrated (SI) India chose to continue digging to try and bring out some of the concealed truths through their undercover story. But have they succeeded or made any startling revelations? Or is it just another case of gnawing on what others have already lost their teeth over? A number of publications have printed excerpts of their conversation with bookies. But one of the many such conversations that SI have, raises serious question marks over the authenticity of the World Cup semifinal between India and Pakistan earlier this year. The excerpt suggests that Pakistan deliberately underperformed in the World Cup semifinal against India at Mohali this year. Here the magazine claims of a voice that told them about a politician from Bihar who had reportedly paid Rs. 200 crore for fixing the match. The voice also says that the politician sent them a text message saying, "This is the time to make money." SI further adds that the game was fixed by a group of six men (five property dealers and one politician of a national party running a scrapyard business in Mumbai) who suggested that while they had paid four Pakistani players to under-perform, skipper Shahid Afridi was absolutely clean. "He doesn't take the bait," one of the five property dealers, claims the magazine, remarked during a separate conversation. But SI's statement in the following paragraph casts serious doubts over the integrity of these conversations, which they claim are based on sources in security agencies or police reports. "While the tapes are authentic, some of the contents of these tapes are yet to be verified – it is still an ongoing operation," says the magazine. The publication has also put serious question marks over the second season of the Indian Premier League that was hosted by South Africa. SI says that the BCCI officials were very concerned about the free access to players during that season. The magazine further adds that one of the top BCCI official told them about warning a player who was being "watched carefully". "Several known shady characters based in the Middle East, but not seen in India, flew into South Africa and booked rooms in the players' hotels, both during last year's Champions League and the IPL's second season," an official told SI. Interestingly, sacked IPL Commissioner Lalit Modi, who was instrumental in taking the IPL to South Africa, backed SI's investigation in one of his tweets. "Some of the incidents described are factual. Quite an accurate story. Well researched I must say," Modi wrote on his Twitter page. So the information can't lack substance when backed by the man who himself is under the shadow of money-laundering charges and is wanted by the Indian government to investigate accusations of misappropriation of IPL funds. What match-fixing boils down to, claims SI, is 'easy access', which becomes apparent in two other incidents mentioned in the report. The magazine claims to have been informed by a group of journalists that well before the India-West Indies day/night World Cup match at Chennai, they were told that bookies have already declared that Chris Gayle won't play. And he didn't. Backing their finding that 'easy access' was pivotal in leakage of information, SI also makes mention of a conversation that centres around the alleged activities of an international umpire, who is the fast friend of a man reportedly controlling betting syndicates in and around New Delhi during the World Cup. SI has also very rightly pointed out that while most of the cricketers "are honest and wear the national colours with pride...the problem lies with the minuscule number who believe that this is the only time they can make the really big bucks before form or injury or age sees them permanently booted out of the team". The report should also be credited for outlining things that need to be done to curb this menace; for e.g., regulating players' agents, anti-corruption education, legalising gambling and enacting stringent laws. SI has also praised PCB's efforts in this regard after three of their top players were banned from international cricket. "While the BCCI seems to believe that if they ignore agents, they will go away, Pakistan has been proactive." However, if the involvement of Pakistani cricketers in fixing the World Cup semifinal is proved, PCB's anti-corruption measures will be like drawing a red herring. But what SI could have done without is giving details about how the betting market runs in sections like 'The Facts of the Matter' and 'Booking Lingo: The Jargons'. This could just be the information for wannabe punters and publications should be discouraged from doing so. Note: Sports Illustrated (India) has informally offered officials of both the ICC and the BCCI access to these recordings to take this further as they please. http://cricketnext.in.com/news/si-report-on-fixing-old-wine-in-new-bottle/57286-13.html