Dravid, Kumble fail to find place in dream team

[King]

Rahul Dravid with the highest batting average (57.46) and Anil Kumble with by far the highest number of Test wickets (552) for India do not figure in the all-time great Indian XI chosen by an elite panel to mark 75 years of Indian Test cricket. More... Dravid, Kumble fail to find place in dream team PTI BANGALORE, July 1: Rahul Dravid with the highest batting average (57.46) and Anil Kumble with by far the highest number of Test wickets (552) for India do not figure in the all-time great Indian XI chosen by an elite panel to mark 75 years of Indian Test cricket. Elegant left-hander Sourav Ganguly, spinners B S Chandrasekhar and Bishen Singh Bedi also do not make it to the team selected by eight former Indian captains and a panel chaired by great off-spinner E A S Prasanna. To mark 75 years since India played its first cricket match against England in 1932, eight former Indian captains - G R Vishwanath, Dilip Vengsarkar, S Venkataraghavan, K Srikkanth, Ajit Wadekar, Nari Contractor, Syed Kirmani and Abbas Ali Baig - were requested to pick their all-time India best Test XI. From the selections made by the eight ex-captains, a panel consisting of Prasanna, well-known sports journalist Rajan Bala and PTI Editors came up with the all-time great XI. Former India captain Mohammed Azharuddin, who left the game under a cloud, did not figure in any of the teams chosen by the ex-captains but the panel included him with Prasanna explaining that the Hyderabad player was the most elegant batsman who fitted in both conventional and unconventional cricket besides being one of the greatest fielders. All time best Test team (in batting order): Sunil Gavaskar (captain), Vinoo Mankad, Vijay Hazare (vice-captain), Sachin Tendulkar, Mohammed Azharuddin, G R Vishwanath, Kapil Dev, Syed Kirmani (wk), Javagal Srinath, EAS Prasanna, Subash Gupte. 12th Man: Vijay Manjrekar. Reserves: Mohammed Nissar, B S Chandrasekhar, Rahul Dravid. Explaining the selection, Prasanna said on Sunday that the panel had taken note of the players' record, nature of opposition, talent and the balance of the side while finalising the team. "It's a well-balanced team in any given conditions. The XI which we have picked will perform. It is an objective oriented team. What I have considered is a bowling combination capable of taking 20 wickets in a Test match under any given conditions with least number of runs conceded. When least number of runs are conceded in each innings, the side has a chance of winning the match." Bala said the team would play well against all the teams in history, except probably against Don Bradman's 1948 Australian team which he rated as the greatest side ever. "Apart from that, this team has everything. This team can play well in whatever conditions they are confronted with." On the choice of Gavaskar as captain, Prasanna said "he is a very intelligent captain. Gavaskar is such an excellent student of the game. He is such a good CEO, like of any organisation, who does not hesitate to express his view however senior one might be." "This man (Gavaskar) has got capabilities in addition to his own quality as a batsman. I admire this fellow." Prasanna said Vinoo Mankad and Kapil Dev were the two columns of the team. "In my opinion, the whole thing revolves around Kapil Dev and Mankad." Prasanna said we had picked Vijay Hazare as the vice-captain though he deserved to be captain. "If you see the composition of the team there are many youngsters than players of his own era. Therefore, it becomes a lop-sided sort of an affair if he is picked as captain. Generational gap of an environment and ambience will be there." He paid glowing tributes to Sachin Tendulkar, who along with Gavaskar and Kapil Dev, figure in all the teams picked by the former captains. "In the present and past era I don't think any cricketer would have matched his talent. I cannot recollect a player who has dominated the game like Tendulkar." Prasanna also singled out leg-spinner Subash Gupte for special praise. "I don't think cricket will ever see a bowler like Gupte. You may see Prasanna, Bedi, Chandrasekhar, Venkataraghavan and Shane Warne." Explaining the inclusion of Javagal Srinath, Bala said, "He was outstanding. His bad luck was many of his outstanding performances were in a losing cause." Following are the all-time best Indian Test teams picked by the former captains: S Venkataraghavan's XI K Srikkanth's XI: 1 Sunil Gavaskar 1 Sunil Gavaskar 2 Vijay Merchant 2 Vinoo Mankad 3 Sachin Tendulkar 3 Sachin Tendulkar 4 Vijay Hazare 4 G R Vishwanath 5 G R Vishwanath/C K Nayudu 5 Rahul Dravid/Vengsarkar 6 Polly Umrigar 6 Polly Umrigar 7 Vinoo Mankad 7 Kapil Dev 8 Kapil Dev 8 Syed Kirmani 9 Syed Kirmani 9 Bishan Singh Bedi 10 Mohd Nissar 10 Mohd Nissar 11 Subhash Gupte 11 E A S Prasanna/Chandra D Vengsarkar's XI (post-1975) Ajit Wadekar's XI: 1 Sunil Gavaskar 1 Sunil Gavaskar 2 Sourav Ganguly 2 Vijay Merchant 3 Rahul Dravid 3 Sachin Tendulkar 4 G R Vishwanath 4 Rahul Dravid 5 Sachin Tendulkar 5 Vijay Hazare 6 Kapil Dev 6 Kapil Dev 7 Syed Kirmani 7 Mohd Nissar 8 Zaheer Khan 8 Ramakant Desai 9 Javagal Srinath 9 Anil Kumble 10 Anil Kumble 10 E A S Prasanna 11 E A S Prasanna 11 Bishan Singh Bedi 12th man: Ravi Shastri. Abbas Ali Baig's XI Syed Kirmani's XI: 1 Sunil Gavaskar 1 Sunil Gavaskar 2 Vijay Merchant 2 Vijay Hazare 3 Rahul Dravid (captain) 3 Mushtaq Ali 4 Sachin Tendulkar 4 C K Nayudu 5 Vijay Hazare 5 Sachin Tendulkar 6 Vinoo Mankad 6 Vinoo Mankad 7 Kapil Dev 7 Kapil Dev 8 Naren Tamhane (wk) 8 Syed Kirmani 9 E A S Prasanna 9 E A S Prasanna 10 Subhash Gupte 10 B S Chandrasekhar 11 Mohd Nissar 11 Mohd Nissar G R Vishwanath's XI Nari Contractor's XI: 1 Sunil Gavaskar 1. Vijay Merchant (capt) 2 Vijay Merchant 2. Sunil Gavaskar 3 Sachin Tendulkar 3. Sachin Tendulkar 4 Vijay Manjrekar 4. Vijay Hazare 5 MAK Pataudi 5. Rahul Dravid 6 Vinoo Mankad 6. Vinoo Mankad 7 Kapil Dev 7. Kapil Dev 8 Syed Kirmani 8. Dattu Phadkar 9 E A S Prasanna 9. Farokh Engineer 10 B S Chandrasekhar 10. E A S Prasanna 11 Mohd Nissar 11. Subhash Gupte 12th man: Eknath Solkar.

[King]

Prasanna over Kumble and Azhar, GRV over Rahul Dravid :haha:

[Dhondy]

Absolute nonsense. I see that Prasanna very kindly included himself.

[King]

I've said this many times the Indian cricket system is way different. The coaches get excited if they see someone that is technically correct. No wonder you don't find chinaman type of bowlers in India. If a Chinaman bowler had played for India and took over 600 wickets while a Shane Warnie type bowler played for India and took 300 wickets, most X-Indian cricketers will choose Warnie type bowler as better simply because he spins the ball and chinaman type bowlers are considered unorthodox. Indian coaches at grass root levels are obessesed with technique more than results.

[King Tendulkar]

Azhar over Dravid:haha:Hilarious choice!

[yoda]

Absolute nonsense. I see that Prasanna very kindly included himself.

was thinking the same. :cantstop:

[kumble_rocks]

These old farts are jealous. Also, I fail to understand the SKC mentality of some of these Indians. Rajan Bala declaring 1948 Bradman team greatest side ever is akin to blasphemy.:whatchutalkingabout

[Predator_05]

Azhar over Dravid:haha:Hilarious choice!

Indeed...:haha: Anyone who leaves out Dravid and Kumble from an all-time Indian XI has no f*cking clue.

[CC1981]

Kumble i can understand...Dravid..now thats NUTS!

[beetle]

>>>>Explaining the selection, Prasanna said on Sunday that the panel had taken note of the players' record, nature of opposition, talent and the balance of the side while finalising the team. These oldies are so full of them selves.....They used to fight against fire spitting dragons......aaj kal to bachon se khelte hain....

[Gambit]

Lots of people who followed cricket in the 50s and 60s really rate Gupte, especially the West Indians, probably because he settled there after he retired. I have read a lot about Gupte and he was probably the most classical leg spinner we've ever produced. A leggie that appealed to the purist more than a Kumble which is probably why Gupte was selected over Kumble. Of course that and also the fact that people generally have a hard time accepting players from their times to be inferior to players from subsequent generations.

[King Tendulkar]

No excuse for exxlusion of dravid. renders the whole thing a nonsense

[theguyinallblue]

hahaha...what were they all smoking..?

[Mandrake]

No RD in an all time test team-what a joke!! The best test batsman we have produced(after Sachin and Gavaskar) should have been a no brainer.Vishwanath and Azhar rank way below RD in any comparison.

[SightForTheGods]

Azhar over Dravid:haha:Hilarious choice!

haha I agree. wtf ?

[Lurker]

All time best Test team (in batting order): Sunil Gavaskar (captain), Vinoo Mankad, Vijay Hazare (vice-captain), Sachin Tendulkar, Mohammed Azharuddin, G R Vishwanath, Kapil Dev, Syed Kirmani (wk), Javagal Srinath, EAS Prasanna, Subash Gupte. A seiously demented this team is. It is selection like this that ensures the current generation does not listen to the old timers. Vinoo Mankad as an opener is a good choice if you pick him as someone who can also bowl spin. When you already have 2 spinners in Prasanna and Gupte why have a third one? And if the panel thought Vinoo Mankad was a good batsman capable of being selected as India's all-timer opener for pure batting skills they are wrong. Azhar is a big suprise, nay shock. GRV has a 50-50 argument going for him, same with Srinath. Prasanna is a decent choice but hardly the best. All in all these XI looks a pretty crappy side. Would be beaten by most country XI's xx

[MundaPakistani]

One more time...No Dravid??

Lots of people who followed cricket in the 50s and 60s really rate Gupte' date=' especially the West Indians, probably because he settled there after he retired. I have read a lot about Gupte and he was probably the most classical leg spinner we've ever produced.[/quote'] Sobers called Gupte the greatest leg spinner that he has ever seen:whatchutalkingabout

[CC1981]

I can understand Mankad and i'd right now put Mankad as the opener ahead of Sehwag or V.Manjrekar(was he the opener ? cant remember). Mankad IMO was a seriously underrated allrounder- had some seriously 'Botham-esque' matches and IMO, he is one of the best SLA bowler the world has seen- after Bedi & Underwood, i'd put Mankad as the best ever slow left arm bowler. Also, the guy averaged 41 as opening and is one of the few (if not only) to bat in every single position in the test team in such a short career. So i can understand a low-ish batting average but for a spinner-allrounder, 31+ batting average & low 30-ish bowling average is seriously good. Mankad also bowled in an era when spinners didnt do a Murali-Warne...people blocked them a LOT more. A 41 average as opener in 40 out of 72 innings in test career, with 50+ average against England is seriously magnificient. Remember, this was the time when England had its best ever bowling attack and arguably the best in the world too after the 'invincibles' retired- Bill Bowes, Brian Statham, Fred Trueman, Jim Laker, Alec Bedser- thats better bowlers than ANY English bowlers in the last 30-40 years! And who can forget his performance in the 'Mankad test', where he singlehandedly fought a great English team ? Against players like Hutton, May, Compton & Graveney, he took 5 wickets in 1st innings and against bowlers like Bedser, Trueman & Laker, he topscored in both innings - 72 in the first (2nd highest was 69) & an incredible 184 in just over 4 hours (thats a session + 1 hr!) with the next highest score being 49. That too, opening the batting. A stroke-filled century against Miller-Lindwall-Johnston is no joke either, especially when the next highest score was 53. Or repeating that act against the same attack a few matches later- all in Australia too. No, i don't think Mankad's inclusion is worth laughing at - I can see Sehwag take his spot if Sehwag goes on to do a high 40s-50+ average after 80-90 tests AND India produces some class pacers- but till then, Mankad remains the more sensible choice. But lets not forget that Sehwag's batting (like most batters in the last six-seven years) is inflated too- i dont see him averaging more than 45 in 70s/80s/90s etc. Shewag maybe a bit better opener but he is no more consistent than Mankad is and Mankad could put his head down and stone-wall away as well as cut loose for stroke-filled batting. But Mankad indisputably, brings in excellent bowling options and i firmly believe that an alltime XI should have atleast 5 great/world-class bowlers.

[CC1981]

My alltime India XI: Gavaskar Mankad Dravid Tendulkar Hazare GRV Kapil Kirmani+ Amar Singh Prasanna Chandra 12th Man : Mohammed Azharuddin I think this team is a good & well balanced one- there is considerable batting depth- all the way to Amar Singh (as good a tailend batsman as any)- which is all the way to # 9. Batting features the 3 marathi musketeers- Sunny,Dravid & Tendy. There is the flashy & stroke-playing Mankad to open with Gavaskar, Vishy to do his typical 'ressurection act' when needed,Kapil with his match-altering batting, Hazare's classy batsmanship and Kiri's stikcyness. Bowling is pretty strong and very varied too- Two excellent fast-medium bowlers- both excellent at moving the ball and keeping it tight, one left arm spinner, one off spinner and one unconventional Kumble-esque fastish-leggie. All excellent in their disciplines too, making it an attack for all surfaces. Thats five fulltime bowlers- all capable of sustaining a quality probing attack over long periods of time ( 3 spinners and 2 pacers who could bear a workload) plus some highly underrated but capable change-bowling from Tendulkar and Hazare. A good catching team - with Gavaskar, Dravid, Kapil & Tendulkar being very capable & reliably safe hands. Kirmani was one of the best catcher-stumper i've seen- very quick & very very reliable. Mankad was quite the groundsfielder and so too was Kapil. Fielding, which is India's acchiles heel, cannot get much better without sacrificing too much on the batting front. Azhar would be an asset and frankly, i'd not grudge anyone for his inclusion- i just feel that between Hazare, Azhar & Vishy, Azhar's gotto take the bench but as 12th man, his brilliant ground-fielding can easily come in handy- especially if the not-so-capable fielders like GRV & Hazare take the seat. Yuvvy i dont think comes anywhere close to the test team as of now but the lad has talent and he may feature in it someday. This may not be as good a fielding unit as the alltime Aussie, Saffie & West Indies team but apart from them, this alltime fielding team is as good as any other nation's alltime list.

[Ram]

I have totally lost respect for some of our past intnl cricketers. I am sure a majority of the posters in this forum have better cricketing acumen than some of them.