jairamesh Posted March 31, 2012 Posted March 31, 2012 The Darren Sammy conundrum and probably the most politically driven selection amongst Test teams is really hurting WIndies cricket and not to mention depriving fans (not just in the West Indies, but across the globe) of good Caribbean cricket. But my main quib is with their bowling selections. For all the upheavals in West Indies, one thing they currently do have is a decent set of bowlers. But ridiculous selection and the Darren Sammy paradox bars WIndies to select their best frontline attack from the likes of: Kemar Roach, Fidel Edwards, Ravi Rampaul, Jerome Taylor, Devandra Bishoo, Narine The West Indies Test XI should really look like this: Barath,Kirk Edwards, Darren Bravo, Marlon Samuels, Dwayne Smith, Dwayne Bravo, wkt (tbd), Bishoo/Narine, Fidel, Roach, Rampaul/Jerome Taylor. But picking Sammy really handicaps the West Indies. Because then Windies have to decide should they strengthen their batting or bowling? Extra Batsman Barath,Kirk Edwards, Darren Bravo, Marlon Samuels, Dwayne Smith, Dwayne Bravo, wkt (tbd), Sammy, Fidel, Roach, Bishoo. ---> Only three good bowlers. Extra Bowler Barath, Kirk Edwards, Darren Bravo, Marlon Samuels, Dwayne Bravo, wkt (tbd), Sammy, Fidel, Roach, Rampaul, Bishoo. --> Long Tail Here is thought as well, imagine a bowling line-up of Fidel, Roach, Rampaul, Bishoo on a nice juicy track. Another thought, remember how many times during India v WI Series in India, Fidel and Rampaul would build-up pressure only to be released when Sammy came on, this is where Test matches are won and lost! Good luck to the WIndies in the forthcoming Tests, I hope they take the risk and opt to go in with four proper bowlers.
Sachinism Posted March 31, 2012 Posted March 31, 2012 You're kidding me!! Sammy is awesome man. Can't believe this dude is still under-rated, such an effective cricketer. Everything he does looks crap, but its effective
saneindian Posted March 31, 2012 Posted March 31, 2012 What he brings to the table is lots of positive enthusiasm and a tremendous leadership quality. Watched the WI side in action at Kotla when they were in India, you won't believe the kind of respect he has from his players while on the field. They all look upto him for directions and he is the driving force behind this young team and their fighting spirit. No wonder the results have been good for WI, They ran us very close in the test and ODI series, should have won the ODIs vs Aus and have drawn the t20s. I wont be surprised if they end up upsetting Aussies in one of the tests.
Crookbond Posted March 31, 2012 Posted March 31, 2012 What he brings to the table is lots of positive enthusiasm and a tremendous leadership quality. Watched the WI side in action at Kotla when they were in India, you won't believe the kind of respect he has from his players while on the field. They all look upto him for directions and he is the driving force behind this young team and their fighting spirit. No wonder the results have been good for WI, They ran us very close in the test and ODI series, should have won the ODIs vs Aus and have drawn the t20s. I wont be surprised if they end up upsetting Aussies in one of the tests. Far fetched. The Aussies have a really strong team in the longer form of the game. WI would've to play out of their skins to defeat the Australia.
Stuge Posted March 31, 2012 Posted March 31, 2012 ^ there bowling is much superior than our trundler brigade .I'm sure WI is going to give a good fight at least .
saneindian Posted March 31, 2012 Posted March 31, 2012 Far fetched. The Aussies have a really strong team in the longer form of the game. WI would've to play out of their skins to defeat the Australia. A spinning track (like we had when we played or Pakistan played last year) with both Bishoo and Naraine playing could earn them a win. The Aussie bowling will not be as effective on these tracks due to lack of swing/seam, they may get bounce, but that alone will not trouble the Windies.
Karan114 Posted March 31, 2012 Posted March 31, 2012 Test match bowling records of the bowlers jairamesh mentions in the OP: Fidel Edwards 51 Tests, average 37.45 Ravi Rampaul 13, 34.71 Kemar Roach 14, 32.62 Devendra Bishoo 10, 36.23 Sunil Narine yet to play a Test Jerome Taylor 29, 35.64 (though considering he hasn't played any form of senior cricket, leave alone internationals in the last 11 months, shouldn't even be discussed) So how on earth Sammy (average of 30.05 from 21 Tests) weakens this bowling attack, I have no idea. Sure Sammy might look a medium pace trundler while the likes of Edwards bowl at 90mph, but as we have seen with Ishant Sharma, you can be an utter rubbish bowler at Test level even if you bowl quickly. Sammy is never going to be a world beater but in the current WI environment he is worth a Test spot. Ironically its in ODIs where his place is more questionable. But more than anything, his attitude is very important in WI cricket especially given wasters like Chris Gayle who despite their talent are more interested in making millions from circus T20 leagues rather than give it their best for the West Indian team.
Crookbond Posted March 31, 2012 Posted March 31, 2012 ^ there bowling is much superior than our trundler brigade .I'm sure WI is going to give a good fight at least . Sure they will but can they win, looks difficult. It will be a bigger upset than the ODIs.
Crookbond Posted March 31, 2012 Posted March 31, 2012 A spinning track (like we had when we played or Pakistan played last year) with both Bishoo and Naraine playing could earn them a win. The Aussie bowling will not be as effective on these tracks due to lack of swing/seam' date=' they may get bounce, but that alone will not trouble the Windies.[/quote'] Batting makes the difference on such tracks. Narine and Bishoo may not play in the same team to start with.
jairamesh Posted March 31, 2012 Author Posted March 31, 2012 Test match bowling records of the bowlers jairamesh mentions in the OP: Fidel Edwards 51 Tests, average 37.45 Ravi Rampaul 13, 34.71 Kemar Roach 14, 32.62 Devendra Bishoo 10, 36.23 Sunil Narine yet to play a Test Jerome Taylor 29, 35.64 (though considering he hasn't played any form of senior cricket, leave alone internationals in the last 11 months, shouldn't even be discussed) So how on earth Sammy (average of 30.05 from 21 Tests) weakens this bowling attack, I have no idea. Sure Sammy might look a medium pace trundler while the likes of Edwards bowl at 90mph, but as we have seen with Ishant Sharma, you can be an utter rubbish bowler at Test level even if you bowl quickly. Sammy is never going to be a world beater but in the current WI environment he is worth a Test spot. Ironically its in ODIs where his place is more questionable. But more than anything, his attitude is very important in WI cricket especially given wasters like Chris Gayle who despite their talent are more interested in making millions from circus T20 leagues rather than give it their best for the West Indian team. Do you follow West Indies cricket or even generally Test cricket for matter of fact? Sammy was always a fringe player until he got made captain and his record against the top batting sides is embarrassing to say the least, it's only against the Bangbros and Pakistan that he has picked up a bagful of wickets which is no surprise. Fidel Edwards, Kemar Roach, and Jerome Taylor have all been a handful for the world's leading batting teams. Ravi Rampaul since his comeback has been amazing. Sammy's default position is thanks to the current WICB chairman who is also from St. Lucia and is a less riskier bet than Dwayne Bravo, Andre Russell, or Chris Gayle who are more talented and hence likely to joined/join the T20 circus. And the less we speak about Ishant Sharma as 90mph bowler the better, this guy is hopeless case nowadays. But regardless I would still pick Ishant Sharma over Darren Sammy in Tests anyday.
Clarke Posted March 31, 2012 Posted March 31, 2012 Our hatred for local trundlers seems to make some of us despise this guy as well.
Sir john Posted March 31, 2012 Posted March 31, 2012 sammy my fav,he play with great passion always :hatsoff:
rkt.india Posted April 1, 2012 Posted April 1, 2012 Problem is he is neither a batsman nor a bowler and he blocks a genuine bowler's place. He is a good thinking captain though but a bowling trio of Edwards, Roach, Rampaul/taylor looks much better than having Sammy in place of one of them.
Zelig Posted April 1, 2012 Posted April 1, 2012 Castro, Rampaul, Narine, Bishoo/Roach, Russell - that's an impressive bowling lineup :hmmm:
rkt.india Posted April 1, 2012 Posted April 1, 2012 @Karan Edwards has 10 fifers to his name in test cricket and Roach and Rampaul are very early in their test careers. Dont just see average in stats here. Sammy takes less than 3 wickets per test match and he plays as a frontline bowler for them in tests. He releases the pressure which Fidel and Rampaul create and wicket taking in tests is all about pressure especially on flat tracks. We could see in India test series how indian batamen used to feel so relieved after fidel and Rampauls spell and facing Sammy. Regarding Ishant, he did fail overseas, but in tests in India if you leave WI test series, he has been our best fast bowler averaging 28. He has played big role im Indian test wins in India.
bajrang Posted April 1, 2012 Posted April 1, 2012 Castro' date=' Rampaul, Narine, Bishoo/Roach, Russell - that's an impressive bowling lineup :hmmm:[/quote'] it is, i would trust this lineup up to defend 289 eight out of ten times against any team, anywhere. against bangla, 10/10.
rkt.india Posted April 1, 2012 Posted April 1, 2012 it is' date=' i would trust this lineup up to defend 289 eight out of ten times against any team, anywhere. against bangla, 10/10.[/quote'] Add Jerome Taylor to it as well.
saneindian Posted April 1, 2012 Posted April 1, 2012 @Karan Edwards has 10 fifers to his name in test cricket and Roach and Rampaul are very early in their test careers. Dont just see average in stats here. Sammy takes less than 3 wickets per test match and he plays as a frontline bowler for them in tests. He releases the pressure which Fidel and Rampaul create and wicket taking in tests is all about pressure especially on flat tracks. We could see in India test series how indian batamen used to feel so relieved after fidel and Rampauls spell and facing Sammy. Regarding Ishant, he did fail overseas, but in tests in India if you leave WI test series, he has been our best fast bowler averaging 28. He has played big role im Indian test wins in India. How many 5-ers Sammy has? 4 in a 21 test career. Out of his 59 wickets, 44 wickets are of top 7 batsmen. 50 of those 59 batsmen he dismissed were for a score less than 50 showing he doesn't earn cheap wickets with the batsmen trying to attack him having got a 100 or 150. If you watched the Ind-WI series, he was getting the set batsmen out, always bowled tightly, created pressure and the batsmen were never comfortable against him. This despite him being in so much of pain due to a knee injury, kept bowling long spells , drying up runs and attacking from the other end. A perfect 3rd seamer to have in the side. Anyways, captain of WI team which has drawn a ODI and t20 series vs the Aussies recently deserves a lot more praise. Sammy is one of the reasons why the young WI side is doing well and playing with a lot of positive intent. Despite his limitations, as an overall package he works well for WI cricket and should continue to lead them.
rkt.india Posted April 1, 2012 Posted April 1, 2012 How many 5-ers Sammy has? 4 in a 21 test career. Out of his 59 wickets, 44 wickets are of top 7 batsmen. 50 of those 59 batsmen he dismissed were for a score less than 50 showing he doesn't earn cheap wickets with the batsmen trying to attack him having got a 100 or 150. If you watched the Ind-WI series, he was getting the set batsmen out, always bowled tightly, created pressure and the batsmen were never comfortable against him. This despite him being in so much of pain due to a knee injury, kept bowling long spells , drying up runs and attacking from the other end. A perfect 3rd seamer to have in the side. Anyways, captain of WI team which has drawn a ODI and t20 series vs the Aussies recently deserves a lot more praise. Sammy is one of the reasons why the young WI side is doing well and playing with a lot of positive intent. Despite his limitations, as an overall package he works well for WI cricket and should continue to lead them. I already said he is a very good enthusiastic captain, but for tests, he takes less than 3 wickets per test which is not what you want from a front line bowler. Team only plays 4 bowlers one is like Sammy. A good team want all four genuine bowlers. He is not a genuine bowler. How he is a perfect third seamer. You want a third seamer like Tremlett or Bresnan, or like Gillespie to McGrath and Lee or like Morkel to Steyn and Philender and it is not like WI do not have options. They have 4 four good genuine fast bowler if play together can bring better results for the team in tests, but they are bound to play Sammy as third seamer because he is captain. He can make an 11 in ODIs for WI, but not tests, especially after less than 3 wickets per test and with likes of Taylor and Roach sitting outside. Even Taylor is less than 3 wicket per test yet, but he bring X-factor with him and can win matches n his own bowling, same with Edwards who is getting better now who is a 5-fer man for WI with 11 5-fers in 51 tests and a fair SR of 56.
Old guy Posted April 1, 2012 Posted April 1, 2012 they need to play sammy as all rounder.. he is def not a frontline test bowler.
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now