Crookbond Posted April 10, 2012 Posted April 10, 2012 Winning is a team result. Isn't it ironic that so called ,"I care for Indian team and not individual records", neutral folks who come up with fancy terms like - bhakti, fanaticism etc. lead the search of heroes out of individuals, filtered based on team results - as long as the stat filters point to their heroes. All of the players mentioned in poll (and sometime others too), have been match winners on their days - more than once - but even those stellar performances would not have resulted in win - if not for contributions from other members of the team, however small. And we have seen counter examples too, losing matches despite potential match-winning performances. But, I guess an individual brilliant performance can change the complexion of a game. I believe that's what the poster is asking for.
Pagalpanti Posted April 10, 2012 Posted April 10, 2012 Without looking into stats, I feel we've managed to get results and chase decent total in 4th innings due to Sehwag, he sets it up for us nicely but only in Sub continent.
Ultimate_Game Posted April 10, 2012 Posted April 10, 2012 So 5 test in 20 years for greater than Bradman batsman. :haha::haha: Here is Tendulkar's list of failure against great bowlers in Asia. SA 1996= Epic fail SA 2000= Fail Aus 2004=fail Pak 2004=fail SL 2008=fail Pak 1999=fail So funny the greatest Indian batsman can't score against strong attack to save his life. Don't think SRT failed against Pakis in 99. SRT scored that wonderful 136 and nearly winning the test. Next 2 Tests he was struggling with bad back but he was doing reasonably well and in the Lokatta Test he was run out when Akhtar literally stood in front of him and the ball hit the stumps. Pity the Pakis didn't believe in "spirit of cricket" as much as indians do :winky:
zen Posted April 10, 2012 Posted April 10, 2012 For fun and since I had some time to kill (to distract myself from the actual work), I tried to come up with a math model to rank the match winners :P I employed a simple method of taking wkts/inng as 'match winner's index" (MWI). To standardize for batting, I divided runs in wins by the team batting average in wins for the corresponding period. Team batting avg in wins: 1990-2009 = 41.19 for Sachin, Dravid, Laxman and Sehwag 1970-1989 = 32.54 for Sunil Below is what I found: Player Score Inn MWI Bowlers Chandr 86.00 24.00 3.58 Kumble 248.00 70.00 3.54 KapilD 68.00 30.00 2.27 Srinath 49.00 24.00 2.04 Zaheer 94.00 47.00 2.00 Batsmen Sehwag 69.17 50.00 1.38 Dravid 98.88 76.00 1.30 Sachin 104.86 85.00 1.23 SunilG 51.35 42.00 1.22 Laxman 74.00 61.00 1.21 Bowlers topped as usually a couple of main bowlers do most of the damage and like many have said bowlers win tests. For batsmen, Sehwag and Dravid top. And ofc, this model is not perfect :D
Sehwag1830 Posted April 10, 2012 Author Posted April 10, 2012 Don't think SRT failed against Pakis in 99. SRT scored that wonderful 136 and nearly winning the test. Next 2 Tests he was struggling with bad back but he was doing reasonably well and in the Lokatta Test he was run out when Akhtar literally stood in front of him and the ball hit the stumps. Pity the Pakis didn't believe in "spirit of cricket" as much as indians do :winky: Well yes averaging 30 in a series is considered failure.:--D
Sehwag1830 Posted April 10, 2012 Author Posted April 10, 2012 Seriously? :omg: Well yes.Averaging 30 is failure. :winky:
master22 Posted April 10, 2012 Posted April 10, 2012 Sehwag who stuggles to score outside the subcontinent and has a crap 4th innings average is our best match winner really?:cantstop:
Sehwag1830 Posted April 10, 2012 Author Posted April 10, 2012 Sehwag who stuggles to score outside the subcontinent and has a crap 4th innings average is our best match winner really?:cantstop: Well if you score big in first innings , you don't need to bat second times.:--D And as for win outside SC , it is not that we have won 20 to 30 test last decade.:winky:
Sehwag1830 Posted April 10, 2012 Author Posted April 10, 2012 Stop changing topic people. Win at home = Win outside Sub-continent. So stop belittling others.
Andrew Peter Posted April 10, 2012 Posted April 10, 2012 And as for win outside SC , it is not that we have won 20 to 30 test last decade.:winky: True and how can we win anyways when our Greatest Match Winning Ballebaaz is a Chalta Firta Wicket outside SC ? Batsmen like Sehwag shouldnt even be part of playing 11 on oversear tours as can be seen from last three tours to Sa , Eng and Australia .
Sehwag1830 Posted April 10, 2012 Author Posted April 10, 2012 True and how can we win anyways when our Greatest Match Winning Ballebaaz is a Chalta Firta Wicket outside SC ? Batsmen like Sehwag shouldnt even be part of playing 11 on oversear tours as can be seen from last three tours to Sa , Eng and Australia . As if Sachin scored loads of run in those tour.:haha: We won 1 test in that 3 tours and Sehwag outscored Sachin in that very test match.:hysterical:
Marut Posted April 10, 2012 Posted April 10, 2012 Sehwag who stuggles to score outside the subcontinent and has a crap 4th innings average is our best match winner really?:cantstop: The OP was not about match winning in home or overseas conditions. Sehwag is undoubtly the greatest match winner as a batsman due to his ability to score big 100s ( his 100s are often 150+) very rapidly at a SR of 80!! No other Indian batsman has come any where close to him in this respect.
zen Posted April 10, 2012 Posted April 10, 2012 Also, overall performance index (OPI) Player Score Inn OPI Bowlers Kumble 566.00 216.00 2.62 Chandr 242.00 97.00 2.49 Srinath 203.00 103.00 1.97 KapilD 430.00 223.00 1.93 Zaheer 236.00 124.00 1.90 Batsmen SunilG 301.97 214.00 1.41 Sehwag 212.84 155.00 1.37 Sachin 377.46 288.00 1.31 Dravid 322.32 261.00 1.23 Laxman 230.46 213.00 1.08 Batting avg 70-89 ----> 33.52 90-09 ----> 36.38 Taking overall performances in wins, losses and draws: Kumble and Sunil top bowlers and batsmen respectively :icflove:
Marut Posted April 10, 2012 Posted April 10, 2012 For batsman, calculate the batting average for wins. That should give a fair idea of how good the batsman is while winning. Apart from that identify important knocks ( like in the wisden 100) in which the player has contributed the most to the victory and also examine if this victory was acheived against heavy odds. ( Laxman's 281 was so unusually good in this respect)
zen Posted April 10, 2012 Posted April 10, 2012 finally: MWI vs OPI MWI Player Score Inn MWI Bowler Chandr 86.00 24.00 3.58 Kumble 248.00 70.00 3.54 KapilD 68.00 30.00 2.27 Srinat 49.00 24.00 2.04 Zaheer 94.00 47.00 2.00 Batsme Sehwag 69.17 50.00 1.38 Dravid 98.88 76.00 1.30 Sachin 104.86 85.00 1.23 SunilG 51.35 42.00 1.22 Laxman 74.00 61.00 1.21 OPI Player Score Inn OPI Bowler Kumble 566.00 216.00 2.62 Chandr 242.00 97.00 2.49 Srinat 203.00 103.00 1.97 KapilD 430.00 223.00 1.93 Zaheer 236.00 124.00 1.90 Batsme SunilG 301.97 214.00 1.41 Sehwag 212.84 155.00 1.37 Sachin 377.46 288.00 1.31 Dravid 322.32 261.00 1.23 Laxman 230.46 213.00 1.08 * Bowlers MWI > OPI, so it shows what we know. Bowlers need to do well to help win tests * Sehwag, Dravid and Laxman's MWI > OPI, esp. Lax's MWI goes up by 0.13.
vvvslaxman Posted April 10, 2012 Posted April 10, 2012 Excluding Bangladesh man of the match awards in victories
yoda Posted April 11, 2012 Posted April 11, 2012 Excluding Bangladesh man of the match awards in victories Number are not surprising. RD and AK on top having been involved in fewer total matches than a someone. :winky:
yoda Posted April 11, 2012 Posted April 11, 2012 MOMs in overseas wins excluding BD How is this even possible? RD leading the pack and the greatest ever clubbed with the rest of the pack at the bottom of the table. :nervous:
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