Why Tendulkar must retire now

[Muloghonto]

Based on what are Lara and Sachin are a class above the rest? Is it based on hype and what certain ex-greats might have casually mentioned about these two. This is exactly where the subjectivity comes in.

It is based on the fact that these two are the ONLY batsmen of the 90s, along with Steve Waugh, to consistently average 50+ in a time when there were only 3-4 batsmen averaging 50+ in the world, when 300-350 in the first innings of a test was a 'very competetive total against anyone' and that they dominated the best attacks of their time, which are significantly better than the 'best attacks' of the 2000s.

Certainly when people consider all things in Tests, Chanders will be rated at a minimum equal or even higher than Lara when it comes to value as a batsman for his team and similarly RD and VVS for India. There is no such thing as 2nd league, in which Ponting or Kallis or Dravid will fall in. It is all a load of BS.

Err no. Only an alien with zero understanding or experience of cricket would rate Lara and Chanders in the same bracket, despite Chanders' excellent rearguard ability. The reason kallis & Ponting are not rated very highly (or atleast, as high as Tendy or Lara) is because they were never the 'sole backbone' of their batting order like Tendy or Lara were and that they did not consistently perform against great bowling attacks. They are the type to score 500 runs against Zaheer Khan and Agarkar, barely breaking 180 runs @ 30,00 against McWrne or the two Ws. Gimme a Lara or a Tendy, who will score 350-400 runs against mediocre attacks and 250-300 runs at 50-60 average against the likes of McWarne/Two Ws/Donald-Pollock or the two WI giants, than these overglorified minnow bashers who go MIA against top notch attacks.

[Vanarp22]

So you don't respect Kallis for making consistent fifties against Aus at the age of almost 35-40? And look at your name: SachinLara. lol:hysterical:

[harmuk]

Err no. Only an alien with zero understanding or experience of cricket would rate Lara and Chanders in the same bracket, despite Chanders' excellent rearguard ability.

The only such alien I know of here is you. Keeping that aside you or I, are not the authority to bracket players how we wish. Tiger Shiv over the years through hardwork, dedication and batsmanship, has earned the greatness to be picked if one wishes over Lara, without a doubt. It does not matter if you agree with it or not.

[harmuk]

So you don't respect Kallis for making consistent fifties against Aus at the age of almost 35-40? And look at your name: SachinLara. lol:hysterical:

And he/she wants people to take him/her seriously, with such an easy give away.

[harmuk]

It is based on the fact that these two are the ONLY batsmen of the 90s' date=' along with Steve Waugh, to consistently average 50+ in a time when there were only 3-4 batsmen averaging 50+ in the world, when 300-350 in the first innings of a test was a 'very competetive total against anyone' and that they dominated the best attacks of their time, which are [b']significantly better than the 'best attacks' of the 2000s.

Not true at all, in fact a load of BS. Even if that were to be true how come, Tendulkar/Lara despite playing well into the 2000's failed to feast on much inferior attacks. For example Tendulkar's mind-boggling average versus BD in 2000's (a true minnow), failed to match up against other teams and very much comparable to most of his other peers. I do not expect you to give me any convincing cricketing reasons, excepting more of the same class apart 90's, balderdash.

[Vanarp22]

i know.

[Muloghonto]

So you don't respect Kallis for making consistent fifties against Aus at the age of almost 35-40? And look at your name: SachinLara. lol:hysterical:

Kallis's 50s against Pattinson & Co is nowhere the callibre of scoring a 50 against OZ in the late 90s/early 2000s period. Check out par scores on those pictches back then and the quality of OZ attack. In the whole 95-2005 period, perhaps only a handful of batsmen have done well against the OZ. That is the peak of OZ bowling prowess (though they are shaping up to be a major force again in the next year or two) and that is where Kallis & Dravid fell flat. That is where the difference between Kallis/Dravid/Ponting/Miandad & the Lara/Tendy/Viv is : the latter did well against the best bowling attacks of their time and much better bowling attacks than the former. Ultimately, the better batsman is the one who succeeds against the best of bowling, not who makes more hay against the highschool team. In the latter aspect, Kallis is equal to, if not greater than Tendy (beating up on B level bowling). In the former aspect, the gulf between Tendy/Lara and the rest, atleast the ones who've debuted after 1990, is significant.

[Muloghonto]

Not true at all' date=' in fact a load of BS. [/quote'] 'saying its BS' doesnt make it BS. Its a statistical fact that pitches in the 90s yeilded less runs than those in the 2000s, its also a statistical fact that bowling averages in the 90s were lower than in the 2000s. I guess you are not a batsman/never batted seriously in your life ? The answer to such a question should be very obvious. Neither would you know, how adversely it affects your performance when you are asked to bat against McGrath and Gillespie at their peak on a deadly pitch, while your guys are tossing pies at them. I really don't know why would someone like you, with so little cricketing experience, argue so vociferously about the game- you don't even sound like you ever played cricket seriously, even for your school or tried to. Maybe just a little gilli-danda back-yard bashing that passes for cricket and watching tv is how you grew up playing cricket ?

[Muloghonto]

The only such alien I know of here is you. Keeping that aside you or I' date=' are not the authority to bracket players how we wish. Tiger Shiv over the years through hardwork, dedication and batsmanship, has earned the greatness to be picked if one wishes over Lara, without a doubt. It does not matter if you agree with it or not.[/quote'] Find me one expert who'd rate Lara or Chanders on the same level and i have a bridge to sell you. You kids who dont know the game and your statistical idiocy does not qualify.

[harmuk]

'saying its BS' doesnt make it BS. Its a statistical fact that pitches in the 90s yeilded less runs than those in the 2000s, its also a statistical fact that bowling averages in the 90s were lower than in the 2000s. I guess you are not a batsman/never batted seriously in your life ? The answer to such a question should be very obvious. Neither would you know, how adversely it affects your performance when you are asked to bat against McGrath and Gillespie at their peak on a deadly pitch, while your guys are tossing pies at them. I really don't know why would someone like you, with so little cricketing experience, argue so vociferously about the game- you don't even sound like you ever played cricket seriously, even for your school or tried to. Maybe just a little gilli-danda back-yard bashing that passes for cricket and watching tv is how you grew up playing cricket ?

As I said in my earlier posts, you will only have balderdash to retort to instead of cricketing reasonings, which you have duly obliged. Nice going.

[vamos_rafa]

Find me one expert who'd rate Lara or Chanders on the same level and i have a bridge to sell you. You kids who dont know the game and your statistical idiocy does not qualify.

I know one such expert. :hysterical::hysterical: He's on ICF by the name of harmuk.

[harmuk]

I know one such expert. :hysterical::hysterical: He's on ICF by the name of harmuk.

I think you need to invest more time into reading people's posts than chime in with meaningless smileys. Aren't you the guy who muttered something about Ganguly, without even following a Test series properly. http://www.indiancricketfans.com/showpost.php?p=2309300&postcount=62 http://www.indiancricketfans.com/showpost.php?p=2309710&postcount=78 At least get your facts right, if you were going to laugh at others.

[Crookbond]

They've really only choked thrice and that too, more the tailenders/management staff than their batsmen. A must win group game in league stage is just as high pressure as a semi final or final, its not a 'regular game'. Period. I fail to see how 'must win to stay alive in the tournament' is not a high pressure game. Care to explain ? I also fail to see how a semi final is less pressure than the final.

I subscribe to that theory but which "must win" game in the league stage did Tendulkar perform in? Just curious.

[Crookbond]

Lara and Chanderpaul on the same level - April Fools Day has indeed come early!

[rkt.india]

Lara and Chanderpaul on the same level - April Fools Day has indeed come early!

Lara is a significantly superior batsmen. It is very much an SRT-Dravid situation.

[Lord]

I subscribe to that theory but which "must win" game in the league stage did Tendulkar perform in? Just curious.

wasnt game against Pak in 2003,a must win for us?Just asking

[Raghav_12]

wasnt game against Pak in 2003' date='a must win for us?Just asking[/quote'] Sensing DM's intentions through tone of the post, I would believe it wasn't. Otherwise he wouldn't have asked this question.

[BeautifulGame]

wasnt game against Pak in 2003' date='a must win for us?Just asking[/quote'] Nope it wasnt.We had already qualified. I dont think it was a must win for Pak either.They still had a game against Zimbabwe (which was later rained out and ensured Pak was eliminated)

[harmuk]

Lara is a significantly superior batsmen. It is very much an SRT-Dravid situation.

More subjectivity. Only thing is which way does this coin flip. Dravid significantly superior or Tendulkar?

[Sidhoni]

The funny bit is Kallis is hyped up the same junta who like to talk about "clutch" players. Kallis played one of the most pathetic ODI innings in the '99 WC Semi Final. He completely choked up the run rate and got out after consuming so many deliveries. The 2007 SF was hilarious. King Kallis came out with intention to dominate, stepped out and stuck McGrath for a boundary, next ball McGrath clean bowled him trying to play the same stroke. And he did it again in the 2011 QF when South Africa was coasting along, King Kallis choked and deposited a long hop straight to mid wicket. What a "clutch" player. :adore:

That was a very good catch and Oram is a tall man. If there was any other fielder there, that would have been six.