MSD haters go and dive off in the indian ocean

[cricketfan28]

can't blame MSD for having such bowlers. even the new crop are uninspiring as of now

totally agreed ... indian fast bowlers are not good at this moment...

[Sir john]

msd :isalute:

[psrb4u]

I agree...

[Austin 3:!6]

can't blame MSD for having such bowlers. even the new crop are uninspiring as of now

This. Yeh baat MTC aur KT ko sunao. When your kids are poor in academics even a PHD tutor can't do much.

[express bowling]

India has never had a good bunch of test pacers. We have produced only 3 decent test pacers in our history. Lack of good pacers is a problem all Indian captains in all "outside subcontinent tours" have faced. It is not a problem unique to Dhoni.

[King Tendulkar]

India has never had a good bunch of pacers. We have produced only 3 decent pacers in our history. Lack of good pacers is a problem all Indian captains in all outside subcontinent tours have faced. It is not a problem unique to Dhoni.

Actually dhoni is first skipper to actually have genuine fast bowlers at his disposal. But the mofo don't pick them

[express bowling]

Actually dhoni is first skipper to actually have genuine fast bowlers at his disposal. But the mofo don't pick them

Some naive fans think that the selectors left him out.

[CSK Fan]

This. Yeh baat MTC aur KT ko sunao. When your kids are poor in academics even a PHD tutor can't do much.

Yes, keep whining on the same point and don't reply to genuine pointys raised by others on many threads 1) Why do our bowlers get praised by some of the best in the business when they break into the scene, people like Donald. Do you think each and every one of them are wrong 2) Why do our bowlers seem world beater when they break into the scene and only fall away AFTER being in the team for a while? 3) How does not making use of the bowler in the best way, asking to bowl only on side of the wicket, asking to bowl to save run, help an attacking bowler take wickets? 4) Do you deny that MSD's primary strategy is strangling the oppisiton and not attacking, even when overseas? What does this spell for fast bowling Repeating a million times that we do not have good bowlers is jut being extremely retarded, looking at the symptoms and not the actual disease. As I have said multiple times (and whih you will ignore again as it suits you), something can be an excuse as a beginner, but after tons of money, talent hunt and having the freedom to chose who you want, if you come up with the same excuse, you are useless in your positon

[CSK Fan]

India has never had a good bunch of test pacers. We have produced only 3 decent test pacers in our history. Lack of good pacers is a problem all Indian captains in all "outside subcontinent tours" have faced. It is not a problem unique to Dhoni.

Why? Why is this? Can you answer? Even India's batsmen were not as sophisticated as we have n ow, so looking at the past does not provide answer. Why has india's batting and fielding come uo by leaps and bound but not bowling? What's stopping them? We never had amazing ground fielders. How did that change? Why are we producing more and more world class batsmen? and do remember, sometimes our previous captain delivered more results out of much more ordinary bowlers than what we have at our disposal today. Looking at the past and forgetting everything completely ignores that not only does our current captain have a thousand times more freedom to chose players, he has a 100 more coaches and talent scouts at his disposal and he earns a thousand time more than any captain in history. So why not reduce his salary to the past too as he is expected only to do what happened in the past?

[CSK Fan]

can't blame MSD for having such bowlers. even the new crop are uninspiring as of now

On the contrary, MSD is exactly the one to be blamed, here is why 1) He is one captain who has the power to over-rule all selectors and get exactly who he wants in the team. So after repeatedly claiming he lacks a pace bowler, if he does not select someone like Yadav, who do we blame? 2) He has been in the helm long enough to have time to devise a strategy for our lack of fast bowling resources.. If there is no progress, whom do we blame? 3) Attacking, wicket taking bowlers like BK, Yadav, try to become run savers and containers AFTER joining the international team. Whom do we blame? Do we pretend we do not know what Dhoni instructs them to do? 4) What is our vision and mission to develop bowling? What is Dhoni doing? How does his strategy of using bowling as attacking option instead of batting (like at home) look like?

[Austin 3:!6]

Yes, keep whining on the same point and don't reply to genuine pointys raised by others on many threads 1) Why do our bowlers get praised by some of the best in the business when they break into the scene, people like Donald. Do you think each and every one of them are wrong 2) Why do our bowlers seem world beater when they break into the scene and only fall away AFTER being in the team for a while? 3) How does not making use of the bowler in the best way, asking to bowl only on side of the wicket, asking to bowl to save run, help an attacking bowler take wickets? 4) Do you deny that MSD's primary strategy is strangling the oppisiton and not attacking, even when overseas? What does this spell for fast bowling Repeating a million times that we do not have good bowlers is jut being extremely retarded, looking at the symptoms and not the actual disease. As I have said multiple times (and whih you will ignore again as it suits you), something can be an excuse as a beginner, but after tons of money, talent hunt and having the freedom to chose who you want, if you come up with the same excuse, you are useless in your positon

:haha: Will answer on your remaining points later but the 2nd point cracks me up. Which bowler looked like 'World beater' for India in test at the start of their career? Lets look into the bowlers who debuted under Dhoni's captaincy - RP Singh, P.Kumar, A. Mithun, U.Yadav, V.Kumar, Bhuvi, Shammi & Aaron. Apart from Shammi, not a single bowler had an impressive start to their test career to term them as world class. Shammi looked fantastic with his reverse swings in his debut series and MS never dropped him till then. If this is not backing a bowler what is? Yes Umesh is little unfortunate but then again he didn't lit the world on fire either. We all criticized Dhoni for selecting Zak in NZ & SA and demanded fresh bloods. Unfortunately young guns didn't had a great outing in 1st warm up but we need to wait for our judgement. Dhoni never got a young pace bowler like Srinath that Azhar had, Young Zak or Pathan that Ganguly had, Young Ishant that Kumble had.

[express bowling]

Why? Why is this? Can you answer? Even India's batsmen were not as sophisticated as we have n ow, so looking at the past does not provide answer. Why has india's batting and fielding come uo by leaps and bound but not bowling? What's stopping them? We never had amazing ground fielders. How did that change? Why are we producing more and more world class batsmen? and do remember, sometimes our previous captain delivered more results out of much more ordinary bowlers than what we have at our disposal today. Looking at the past and forgetting everything completely ignores that not only does our current captain have a thousand times more freedom to chose players, he has a 100 more coaches and talent scouts at his disposal and he earns a thousand time more than any captain in history. So why not reduce his salary to the past too as he is expected only to do what happened in the past?

You missed the point of my post. Dhoni fans are claiming that failing in overseas tours is not Dhoni's fault. It is because our pacers are bad. I just pointed out that we have never had good pacers. Yet, other captains have never fared so badly overseas. So, it is not a valid excuse. I actually agree with most parts of what you are saying. Our batting and fielding has improved over the years. Our bowling should have too. Moreover, a long serving captain wields more powers and influence over team selection and overall team development than most people think. The types of bowlers getting selected and the defensive approach they are taking have a lot to do with Dhoni's approach to bowling.

[velu]

Yes, keep whining on the same point and don't reply to genuine pointys raised by others on many threads 1) Why do our bowlers get praised by some of the best in the business when they break into the scene, people like Donald. Do you think each and every one of them are wrong 2) Why do our bowlers seem world beater when they break into the scene and only fall away AFTER being in the team for a while? 3) How does not making use of the bowler in the best way, asking to bowl only on side of the wicket, asking to bowl to save run, help an attacking bowler take wickets? 4) Do you deny that MSD's primary strategy is strangling the oppisiton and not attacking, even when overseas? What does this spell for fast bowling Repeating a million times that we do not have good bowlers is jut being extremely retarded, looking at the symptoms and not the actual disease. As I have said multiple times (and whih you will ignore again as it suits you), something can be an excuse as a beginner, but after tons of money, talent hunt and having the freedom to chose who you want, if you come up with the same excuse, you are useless in your positon

1) Pretty lame way to judge a bowler. Ex: -"Dale steyn impressed with indias vinay kumar" :haha: 2) How many indian who set the world on fire when they break into the scene ? 3) To set an attacking field to get wickets , we need wicket taking pace bowlers. 4) Agreed for a change. MSD is defense first captain and i would do the same if i have bowlers like him. Can you list the set of good bowlers here who could do well overseas ?? :icflove:

[velu]

Why? Why is this? Can you answer? Even India's batsmen were not as sophisticated as we have n ow, so looking at the past does not provide answer. Why has india's batting and fielding come uo by leaps and bound but not bowling? What's stopping them? We never had amazing ground fielders. How did that change? Why are we producing more and more world class batsmen? and do remember, sometimes our previous captain delivered more results out of much more ordinary bowlers than what we have at our disposal today. Looking at the past and forgetting everything completely ignores that not only does our current captain have a thousand times more freedom to chose players, he has a 100 more coaches and talent scouts at his disposal and he earns a thousand time more than any captain in history. So why not reduce his salary to the past too as he is expected only to do what happened in the past?

stop being a blind hater.. if our fielding improved it doesnt mean our bowling will also improve. with better facilities we can improve our fielding , but not the case with bowling. dada had far more better batting lineup than anyone else in the history of indian batting. and dada had few half decent bowlers.. and having 100s of coaches mean nothing .. ask mumbai indians :hehe:

[maniac]

1) Pretty lame way to judge a bowler. Ex: -"Dale steyn impressed with indias vinay kumar" :haha: 2) How many indian who set the world on fire when they break into the scene ? 3) To set an attacking field to get wickets , we need wicket taking pace bowlers. 4) Agreed for a change. MSD is defense first captain and i would do the same if i have bowlers like him. Can you list the set of good bowlers here who could do well overseas ?? :icflove:

Sreeshanth won us the 2nd test in South Africa,was looking in prime form in 3rd test and what happens....msd criticisms him in public....being the mental midget he is he just disintegrates. Sends yuvraj in wt20 ,fair enough worth a gamble,when he r's it up comes in and does jack,could have sent in Raina even then. Screws up in Ipl final and blames everyone under the sun except himself. Don't even want to get in to his skills as a batsman or a keeper.....just talking about his "mythical" captaincy traits. Making fun of bowlers,batsmen etc when he himself is a big screw up....that should sum up msd.

[Austin 3:!6]

As I said previously the biggest problem Dhoni has is a lack of a quality spinner. India always backed on spinners more than seam bowlers but at present we don't have any. Ashwin/Jadeja is rubbish overseas, Bhajji went down hill and Kumble retired. All the previous Indian skippers had the services of good spinners which Dhoni does not have.

[maniac]

stop being a blind hater.. if our fielding improved it doesnt mean our bowling will also improve. with better facilities we can improve our fielding , but not the case with bowling. dada had far more better batting lineup than anyone else in the history of indian batting. and dada had few half decent bowlers.. and having 100s of coaches mean nothing .. ask mumbai indians :hehe:

Dada as a player was very valuable.....his batting>msd batting Even his dibble dobbly part time bowling>msd test wicket keeping

[Austin 3:!6]

Dada as a player was very valuable.....his batting>msd batting Even his dibble dobbly part time bowling>msd test wicket keeping

Ganguly was a better test skipper...no denying that.

[velu]

On the contrary, MSD is exactly the one to be blamed, here is why 1) He is one captain who has the power to over-rule all selectors and get exactly who he wants in the team. So after repeatedly claiming he lacks a pace bowler, if he does not select someone like Yadav, who do we blame? 2) He has been in the helm long enough to have time to devise a strategy for our lack of fast bowling resources.. If there is no progress, whom do we blame? 3) Attacking, wicket taking bowlers like BK, Yadav, try to become run savers and containers AFTER joining the international team. Whom do we blame? Do we pretend we do not know what Dhoni instructs them to do? 4) What is our vision and mission to develop bowling? What is Dhoni doing? How does his strategy of using bowling as attacking option instead of batting (like at home) look like?

1) i dont think dhoni can pick players as he wishes , he can suggest layers . 2) blame the team responsible for grooming pace bowlers. 3) If the attacking bowlers pick wickets , why do dhoni will keep them for defensive duties. 4) Blaming dhoni for everything is indianized lahori logic ( or i would put it as MTC/KT logic ). PS:- Now how do i insert sachin here so that i can have a meaningful discussion about the improvement of indan crciket and our pace bowling with MTC.. :icflove:

[maniac]

As I said previously the biggest problem Dhoni has is a lack of a quality spinner. India always backed on spinners more than seam bowlers but at present we don't have any. Ashwin/Jadeja is rubbish overseas' date=' Bhajji went down hill and Kumble retired. All the previous Indian skippers had the services of good spinners which Dhoni does not have.[/quote'] The very fact that jadeja kept being shoved down our throats is dhonis fault.....I like jadeja and he is a good utility loi cricketer but him playing tests is a disgrace,his good performances have a long term impact which we are looking at right now