best player of fast bowling form india

[Muloghonto]

Best player of fast bowling from india: 1. Gavaskar 2. Tendulkar 3. Amarnath 4. Laxman 5. Dravid

[Deleted_User_1]

Amarnath was too inconsistent, but in 1982 & early 83 he was the best. From a consistency, I would give the nod to SRT and then Sunny (Sunny was not as consistent in his career as SRT).

[SELVAM]

Test match wickets were mostly flat in Australia, NZ and SA. Kohli struggled in swinging conditions in England. In ODIs, Kohli averages just 33 against Aus, NZ, Eng and SA in these four nations, compared to an average of 55 at home. While he has 22 hundreds and 33 fifties in 158 matches, if we restrict the matches to these four nations against these four teams, he has just two hundreds and five fifties in 35 matches. Kohli does struggle to get even fifties against these nations while he is creaming hundred after hundred in his comfort zones. Kohli is yet to play a single impact innings against these four nations in these countries - his highest score in an Indian win under these conditions is 46.

Before you put down kohli, you have to check other indian batsmen record and compare that with kohli record, then you know how he is performed exceptionally well, he have better record than Sachin in these countries

[Muloghonto]

Amarnath was too inconsistent' date=' but in 1982 & early 83 he was the best. From a consistency, I would give the nod to SRT and then Sunny (Sunny was not as consistent in his career as SRT).[/quote'] If Sunny was as consistent as Tendulkar, he'd be the greatest batsman ever. He was ridiculously good in an era where opening the batting was ridiculously hard. To illustrate how so, the nearest opener to Sunny in terms of record from that era is Geoff Boycott and Boycott scored 2000 less runs, 12 less centuries in only 20 less innings than Sunny. And Sunny arguably had a much harder job than Boycott because Boycott didn't have to face the English attack, which in the 70s and early 80s was quite good. Botham is not quite an ATG bowler (like Kapil) and neither is Bob Willis but together, especially backed by Underwood ( a very underrated spinner & slow bowler, essentially, he was slightly worse left-handed version of Kumble) and a good support cast was a very very good attack. All the other openers in that era average 40-45. Against fast bowlers in general, especially the really fast ones like Lillee, WI pace quartet, Imran etc, Gavaskar was a league ahead of every other opener. Even if you compare him to middle order bats, who are supposed to be more consistent than opener (and they almost all are), Gavaskar's consistency was rivalled only by Viv, Border, G.Chappell and Miandad.

[express bowling]

Test match wickets were mostly flat in Australia, NZ and SA. Kohli struggled in swinging conditions in England. In ODIs, Kohli averages just 33 against Aus, NZ, Eng and SA in these four nations, compared to an average of 55 at home. While he has 22 hundreds and 33 fifties in 158 matches, if we restrict the matches to these four nations against these four teams, he has just two hundreds and five fifties in 35 matches. Kohli does struggle to get even fifties against these nations while he is creaming hundred after hundred in his comfort zones. Kohli is yet to play a single impact innings against these four nations in these countries - his highest score in an Indian win under these conditions is 46.

Everyone connected to cricket would agree that test matches are real tests of a batsman's technique , temperament and ability against either genuine pace or genuine spin..not ODIs. In ODIs, the wickets are usually flatter and batsmen often lose wickets in an attempt to maintain the required run rate. Kohli averages 60+ in tests played IN Australia. 5 centuries in 8 test matches against Johnson, Harris, Starc, Hazelwood, etc. and a 75 and 44 in fast and bouncy Perth. He averages 70+ in tests played in South Africa. A century and a 96 in fast, bouncy and seaming Wanderers against Steyn, Morkel and Philander. He averages 60+ in NewZealand with 1 century from 2 tests. 7 of Kohli's 10 centuries from only 34 tests are outside the subcontinent. All this as a part of an inexperienced batting attack under extreme pressure because their team is losing seies after series overseas. He has dominated the bowlers in most of his big innings, especially the vicious Johnson. If these are not impact knocks, I don't know what are ! Subcontinent ODIs are generally far more high scoring affairs compared to those in Australia, England and South Africa. There are exceptions obviously.* Reason why Indians top the centuries list in ODIs. Most batsmen , especially from the subcontinent, always have more ODI centuries here.

[Deleted_User_1]

If Sunny was as consistent as Tendulkar, he'd be the greatest batsman ever. He was ridiculously good in an era where opening the batting was ridiculously hard. To illustrate how so, the nearest opener to Sunny in terms of record from that era is Geoff Boycott and Boycott scored 2000 less runs, 12 less centuries in only 20 less innings than Sunny. And Sunny arguably had a much harder job than Boycott because Boycott didn't have to face the English attack, which in the 70s and early 80s was quite good. Botham is not quite an ATG bowler (like Kapil) and neither is Bob Willis but together, especially backed by Underwood ( a very underrated spinner & slow bowler, essentially, he was slightly worse left-handed version of Kumble) and a good support cast was a very very good attack. All the other openers in that era average 40-45. Against fast bowlers in general, especially the really fast ones like Lillee, WI pace quartet, Imran etc, Gavaskar was a league ahead of every other opener. Even if you compare him to middle order bats, who are supposed to be more consistent than opener (and they almost all are), Gavaskar's consistency was rivalled only by Viv, Border, G.Chappell and Miandad.

Gavaskar played Lillee only in two series. Once early in his career as part of World XI in 1971 and then in the series in 1980-81 also in Aus. Both times he faired poorly. It did not help that during 1980-81 he was in horrible form. His performance against Lillee was probably a weak point in his career. Against all other bowlers in that era he had good to average performance. Gavaskar was in peak form IMO from 1978-1980, but then he went through pretty lean patch until 1983 WI series in India. Look, Sunny was my idol growing up. And he did play in an era where the quality of bowling was better and he played without a helmet. All of these do matter. But I think SRT would have fared same or better if he played in that era. Sunny had the technique and temperament but did not dominate the bowlers.

[rkt.india]

That is BS. Akram could consistently bowl in the 145-150kph range when he wanted to and usually bowled at those speeds in Australia where his swing was negated and bowlers needed to bang it in to generate bounce and pace.

You can't be more wrong. It's not like Akram played in 70s, so, most people here have seen him. Have seen his bowling from mid 80s. He was nowhere as quick as Johnson or Starc now.

[div]

Dravid didn't have great batspeed,rarely seen him dominating fast bowlers.Players like Ponting,Lara,Sehwag etc have/had quick hands and were able to dominate bowlers.

[Muloghonto]

You can't be more wrong. It's not like Akram played in 70s' date=' so, most people here have seen him. Have seen his bowling from mid 80s. He was nowhere as quick as Johnson or Starc now.[/quote'] yes, he was. from 89 to 93/94, he was a consistent 90mph bowler. When pakistan toured Australia in 91 or 92, he didn't swing the aussie batsmen out, he blasted them out. Akram didn't bowl full tilt all the time because you cannot get as much swing at 90+mph as you can from 83-88mph range and thats what Akram mostly did. But in WI and AUS in the 90s where swing was very minimal but pithes were rock-hard, he blasted the batsmen out.

[Muloghonto]

Gavaskar played Lillee only in two series. Once early in his career as part of World XI in 1971 and then in the series in 1980-81 also in Aus. Both times he faired poorly. It did not help that during 1980-81 he was in horrible form. His performance against Lillee was probably a weak point in his career. Against all other bowlers in that era he had good to average performance. Gavaskar was in peak form IMO from 1978-1980, but then he went through pretty lean patch until 1983 WI series in India. Look, Sunny was my idol growing up. And he did play in an era where the quality of bowling was better and he played without a helmet. All of these do matter. But I think SRT would have fared same or better if he played in that era. Sunny had the technique and temperament but did not dominate the bowlers.

in the 81 series, Lillee dismissed gavaskar 2 times out of 6, out of which one time was when Gavaskar had already scored 70 runs. So how is it 'not performing against Lillee' ? He had more trouble against Pascoe than Lillee that series. I don't see how you can dominate bowlers in test cricket as an opener, unless your name is Virender Sehwag, especially in the 80s. Openers are not supposed to be as successful as middle order batsmen. Given that Gavaskar was, its a testament to how great a batsman he was

[CricketBuffOne]

For me its, Vishy, Gavaskar, Sachin, Dravid, Laxman and Kohli.

[Deleted_User_1]

in the 81 series, Lillee dismissed gavaskar 2 times out of 6, out of which one time was when Gavaskar had already scored 70 runs. So how is it 'not performing against Lillee' ? He had more trouble against Pascoe than Lillee that series. I don't see how you can dominate bowlers in test cricket as an opener, unless your name is Virender Sehwag, especially in the 80s. Openers are not supposed to be as successful as middle order batsmen. Given that Gavaskar was, its a testament to how great a batsman he was

Dude did you see the scores in that series? He was miserable against all bowling. He has never been successsful against Lillee. Of course it did not help his stats since Lillee was playing for WSC when India toured in 1977-78 and he never toured India. In fact, during his prime Sunny played against several B teams and scored tons of runs because of WSC defection. By this I do not mean he would not have been successful otherwise, but this is a fact. Also, there have been several of openers who have had decent careers who were attacking. Never been a Sehwag fan, was mostly a STB, a great one though.But his overseas record isn't that great. In my opinion, Gavaskar is the best opener India has ever produced. How old are you? I have closely followed Sunny's career; have seen him play at Eden Gardens pretty much every time he played. I am well aware what he could and could not do. I idolized him growing up.

[express bowling]

yes' date=' he was. from 89 to 93/94, he was a [b']consistent 90mph bowler. When pakistan toured Australia in 91 or 92, he didn't swing the aussie batsmen out, he blasted them out. Akram didn't bowl full tilt all the time because you cannot get as much swing at 90+mph as you can from 83-88mph range and thats what Akram mostly did. But in WI and AUS in the 90s where swing was very minimal but pithes were rock-hard, he blasted the batsmen out.

Speed guns were not used with any regularity during 1989 to 94. So, it is not possible to know that. You are just making this up. Akram had the ability to bowl fast spells...but his speciality was getting the ball to kick up from just short of good length or actual short length ...when he used a lot of shoulder in his deliveries. He had a vicious bouncer. That helped him blast out batsmen when required. He was never among the quickest as far as pace in the air was concerned. I remember speed guns being used in Sharjah in a tournament around 1993 ( a rare happening ). Wasim was bowling around 135 to 142 k even then.

[Marut]

Everyone connected to cricket would agree that test matches are real tests of a batsman's technique , temperament and ability against either genuine pace or genuine spin..not ODIs. In ODIs, the wickets are usually flatter and batsmen often lose wickets in an attempt to maintain the required run rate. Kohli averages 60+ in tests played IN Australia. 5 centuries in 8 test matches against Johnson, Harris, Starc, Hazelwood, etc. and a 75 and 44 in fast and bouncy Perth. He averages 70+ in tests played in South Africa. A century and a 96 in fast, bouncy and seaming Wanderers against Steyn, Morkel and Philander. He averages 60+ in NewZealand with 1 century from 2 tests. 7 of Kohli's 10 centuries from only 34 tests are outside the subcontinent. All this as a part of an inexperienced batting attack under extreme pressure because their team is losing seies after series overseas. He has dominated the bowlers in most of his big innings, especially the vicious Johnson. If these are not impact knocks, I don't know what are ! Subcontinent ODIs are generally far more high scoring affairs compared to those in Australia, England and South Africa. There are exceptions obviously.* Reason why Indians top the centuries list in ODIs. Most batsmen , especially from the subcontinent, always have more ODI centuries here.

No doubt Kohli is damn good when the wicket is easy to bat on, even against very good bowlers. But Kohli is not consistently getting runs when the wicket is not easy to bat on - in Australia he failed in both innings at Gabba, the most difficult pitch during the tour. In England he was completely at sea and there was a lot of swing during that tour. His only 100 during the NZ tour was in a match that featured nearly six hundreds. He played a fantastic knock at the Wanderer's but it has to be noted that Steyn had the worst match of his career and Morkell did not play the second innings. At Durban against a fiery Steyn, he failed again. TBH I am yet to see Kohli score a lot of runs when the pitches/conditions favour the bowlers. Moeen Ali, Panesar and Swann all troubled him on helpful wickets.

[express bowling]

No doubt Kohli is damn good when the wicket is easy to bat on, even against very good bowlers. But Kohli is not consistently getting runs when the wicket is not easy to bat on - in Australia he failed in both innings at Gabba, the most difficult pitch during the tour. In England he was completely at sea and there was a lot of swing during that tour. His only 100 during the NZ tour was in a match that featured nearly six hundreds. He played a fantastic knock at the Wanderer's but it has to be noted that Steyn had the worst match of his career and Morkell did not play the second innings. At Durban against a fiery Steyn, he failed again. TBH I am yet to see Kohli score a lot of runs when the pitches/conditions favour the bowlers. Moeen Ali, Panesar and Swann all troubled him on helpful wickets.

I have just pointed out the difficult conditions where Kohli has scored, like Wanderers and Perth. The Melbourne pitch wasn't that flat either. No batmen scores everytime the condition is tough. But your belief is otherwise...what can I say ? Fact is ... the Durban pitch, where Kohli scored less runs, was a very flat pitch. Similarly, apart from the Lords test, first innings and another test in that series...the other pitches were normal ones. England did not have any sub 30 average test bowler either. Kohli failed because he was out of form. Just remember that when the playing conditions are really tough and the opposition bowling attack is very good...most batsmen , however good, fail far more times than they succeed. Most foreign batsmen used to fall like 9 pins when Kumble and later on Kumble and Harbhajan used to bowl on viciously turning tracks. Gavaskar , Amarnath, Dravid and Laxman failed many many times when both the playing conditions and opposition attack were difficult.

[SELVAM]

No doubt Kohli is damn good when the wicket is easy to bat on, even against very good bowlers. But Kohli is not consistently getting runs when the wicket is not easy to bat on - in Australia he failed in both innings at Gabba, the most difficult pitch during the tour. In England he was completely at sea and there was a lot of swing during that tour. His only 100 during the NZ tour was in a match that featured nearly six hundreds. He played a fantastic knock at the Wanderer's but it has to be noted that Steyn had the worst match of his career and Morkell did not play the second innings.At Durban against a fiery Steyn, he failed again. TBH I am yet to see Kohli score a lot of runs when the pitches/conditions favour the bowlers. Moeen Ali, Panesar and Swann all troubled him on helpful wickets.

:facepalm: in durban test 1st innings he was strangled down legside, 2'nd innings he was given wrongly out caught behind

[kabirkhan]

1. Yuvraj Singh 2. Sehwag 3. Virat Kohli 4. Sachin Tendulkar

[BlueBee]

1. Yuvraj Singh 2. Sehwag 3. Virat Kohli 4. Sachin Tendulkar

Fans are literally blind

[Marut]

:facepalm: in durban test 1st innings he was strangled down legside' date=' 2'nd innings he was given wrongly out caught behind[/quote'] Why is being strangled down the legside an excuse? The second one was a poor decision.

[SELVAM]

Why is being strangled down the legside an excuse? The second one was a poor decision.

Because, 9out 10 times that would have been boundaries