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4 hours ago, Mariyam said:

@zen

 

Hum is not in the league of the other four movies that you've posted. You have to be trolling here.

 

Hum is a completely cringe movie where Amitabh just shakes his head violently to become from a civilized sheheri to a don. Captain Zatack? Really? Come on now.

Hum is in the category of movies that Amitabh must have done purely to raise funds or for friends.

Hum, Kohram, Lal Badshah, RGV ki Aag,  And that movie with Rishi Kapoor based in some place in the Middle East where a dolphin? is Amitabh's mother. - Ajooba!

These were his worst by far.


I like Hum. As I said, it is the last Big B masala film to feel like a Big B film from his angry young (or not so young) days. Other films that were released in that time frame were not on the mark. Hum did well at the box office too and was remade in other languages: 

 

“The movie was an inspiration for the 1996 Kannada movie Soma. Before that, it was adapted into the 1995 Tamil movie Baashha starring Rajinikanth in the lead[2]which went on to be remade in Kannada in 2001 as Kotigobba , in Bengali in 2003 as Guru and in Bangladeshi in 2001 as Sultan starring Mannna. Dilwale (2015) also was loosely inspired by this film.” 

 

We used to like Captain Zatak! Funny character esp.  in the fight with Rajni & Govinda. Where can you find such sequences: 

 


:dontknow: 

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Ram Balram ... lots of action ... tons of villains: Ajit, Amjad Khan, Prem Chopra ... Dharmendra ‘s role is nice ... Amitabh plays his regular police officer role. Gives a lecture to Ajit on why police is powerful only to see Ajit hold him as a hostage against the police 

 

Dostana ... still pretty good ... At times, feels like a rehash of Zanjeer, etc ... Shatru is good as the lawyer (did that in Vishwanath too) and Prem Chopra tricky with a small gun in his pocket ... Amitabh does all the action 


 

 Btw, which was the film where Dharmendra (iirc) jumps through floors of that 7 floors building. Maybe it had Zeenat Aman too ... Probably Prof. Pyarelal :hmmm: 

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Suhaag ... used to love such films early on but now feels like a rehash while still remaining a decent time pass masala film (mainly watched it for kaun sa chappal, #)

 

Khudagawah ... headache ... watched mostly it in FF mode so technically not completely rewatched  ... woh ayaga :facepalm:

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Agneepath ... oh boy, this one has aged like a fine wine ... Big B's knockout performance remains evergreen ... I would not call it a typical masala film (though it has some masala elements) but a relatively focused gangster film (Scarfacesque). 

 

If a proper 4K restoration is done of this classic, it would be a kickass home video title!

 

PS what a sequence below esp. the Amitabh-Danny meeting :hatsoff:

 

 

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Deewar (1975) ... Now feels like a mixed bag esp. because of the 1st hour which is barely watchable. Once the film picks up it with has some good moments including memorable dialogues 

 

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3 hours ago, zen said:

Deewar (1975) ... Now feels like a mixed bag esp. because of the 1st hour which is barely watchable. Once the film picks up it with has some good moments including memorable dialogues 

 

Deewar is a far more relevant and entertaining movie than Sholay.

The only place it lacks vis a vis Sholay is that the second actor Shashi Kapoor is not as impactful as Dharmendra was in Sholay.

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8 hours ago, Mariyam said:

Deewar is a far more relevant and entertaining movie than Sholay.

The only place it lacks vis a vis Sholay is that the second actor Shashi Kapoor is not as impactful as Dharmendra was in Sholay.


I am not sure if Deewar is more entertaining than Sholay … From a 2021 perspective, I found Deewar to be relatively lacklustre, saved by some good moments … Shashi Kapoor was good for his "role", I liked his jovial scenes 

 


Such films are not meant to be overanalyzed but if you do:

 

1st hour is almost unwatchable: 

 

* Starts off with Shashi accepting a police award, which not many would considering what happened to the brother

* The hadtaal sequences have been done to death (A union leader would not go alone to sign but since this is film that can be overlooked)

* The union leader just walks away from hospital, leaving his family behind 

* A kid gets bullied by the locals for his father and is forced to have his hand tattooed (a cringe worthy sequence) 

* “Growing up” segment in Mumbai 

* Shashi Kapoor’s interviews (many of those segments can be cut)

* Surprisingly, Amitabh’s godown fight looks a bit dated now 

 

^ And that is just the first hour 

 


Also many of its action sequences lack punch:

 

* Amitabh takes sona back from Sawant without much trouble (It is followed by a redundant mujra/qawali sequence. The song isn’t memorable too)

* Shashi arrests a gang by telling a story (though probably better than some comical/dated dishum dishum) 

 

 

In b/w all these, you will see Satyan Kappu hanging around in trains (totally irrelevant for the story at that point apart from creating a reason for that sindoor sequence, which appears meh now too) … There is that Shashi Kapoor shooting a kid and rona-dhona with AK Hangal as well (though relevant to the film as we discussed earlier on this thread but not interesting) … The monologue in the temple adds to boredom 

 

Shashi’s  dilemma is compared to Arjun’s where he has to do his duty but, from a big picture PoV, he is just after one selected gang while likes of Sawant appear to be not impacted 

 

Amitabh has repeated such angry young man roles in many films so it is familiar (at the time of film’s release, it would have been fresh. But now we have seen almost all such roles of AB)

 

 

As for pros (which keep reducing as years pass):

 

* Amitabh- Daavar interactions including “main aaj bhi feke huway paise “

* Amitabh-Parveen meeting in the hotel and the shooting outside 

* Amitabh showing value for the building where his mother worked 

* Amitabh-Shashi sign sequence

* Amitabh-Shashi meeting under the bridge 

* Amitabh-Shashi chase sequence at the end

* Shashi Kapoor in jovial segments 

 

 

Deewar has its good moments sandwiched b/w a series of hurdles/speed bumps. Now the film can be labeled as a drama than an action-drama. 

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@zen 

Thanks for the detailed response.

 

The godown fight is all chutzpah. He's chewing his beedi with his legs on a stool waiting for the goondas. Also ab main chaabi tere jeb se le kar tala khoolunga was a stylish dialogue. More so the way it was said and what ensued.

 

The AK Hangal scene and shooting the kid was a very poignant moment too. 

Shashi Kapoor shoots the kid. He's shattered when he finds out that its a loaf of bread that he's stolen.He goes to the kids home and the mother starts her tirade that the cops always catch the small fish but the mega scamsters are let off the hook. AK Hangal's masterji, principle as ever, says that the kid has broken the law and deserve what came his way, while also apologising for his wife's behaviour. 

 

It is supposed to show the inner turmoil ( Arjun like, as you said) that Shahsi Kapoor is facing. Why is he so soft on his own brother but gung ho towards the other criminals.

 

Like you pointed out, almost all AB scenes are memorable.

 

Even the entire AB not going to the mandir as a kid, and the ending sequence (monologue as you call it) at the mandir was very well done and weaved right into the story. Very well written piece.

 

Deewar is a more profound film. Its moments and lessons stay with you forever. Sholay is an out and out masala movie.

 

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5 minutes ago, Mariyam said:

@zen 

Thanks for the detailed response.

 

The godown fight is all chutzpah. He's chewing his beedi with his legs on a stool waiting for the goondas. Also ab main chaabi tere jeb se le kar tala khoolunga was a stylish dialogue. More so the way it was said and what ensued.

 

The AK Hangal scene and shooting the kid was a very poignant moment too. 

Shashi Kapoor shoots the kid. He's shattered when he finds out that its a loaf of bread that he's stolen.He goes to the kids home and the mother starts her tirade that the cops always catch the small fish but the mega scamsters are let off the hook. AK Hangal's masterji, principle as ever, says that the kid has broken the law and deserve what came his way, while also apologising for his wife's behaviour. 

 

It is supposed to show the inner turmoil ( Arjun like, as you said) that Shahsi Kapoor is facing. Why is he so soft on his own brother but gung ho towards the other criminals.

 

Like you pointed out, almost all AB scenes are memorable.

 

Even the entire AB not going to the mandir as a kid, and the ending sequence (monologue as you call it) at the mandir was very well done and weaved right into the story. Very well written piece.

 

Deewar is a more profound film. Its moments and lessons stay with you forever. Sholay is an out and out masala movie.

 


I can see that you like Deewar (maybe because it connected with you when you watched it as a kid), but why pit it against Sholay and that too on entertainment factor :lol:

 

Deewar is relatively a rona-dhona film 

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4 minutes ago, zen said:


I can see that you like Deewar (maybe because connected with it when you watched it as a kid), but why pit it against Sholay and that too on entertainment factor :lol:

 

Deewar is relatively a rona-dhona film 

Its Sholay that I saw as a kid. My grand father liked it so much that it would always play in the background once or twice a week. 

Deewar I saw after I joined law school. I instantly took to it. 

The other AB film that resonated with me to such a degree was " Main Azad hoon". That too I saw first when I was 18/19.

 

The reason I pit it against Sholay is because these are AB's two biggest films. 100 years from now, these two films will still be spoken about.

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21 hours ago, Mariyam said:

Its Sholay that I saw as a kid. My grand father liked it so much that it would always play in the background once or twice a week. 

Deewar I saw after I joined law school. I instantly took to it. 

The other AB film that resonated with me to such a degree was " Main Azad hoon". That too I saw first when I was 18/19.

 

The reason I pit it against Sholay is because these are AB's two biggest films. 100 years from now, these two films will still be spoken about.


Among AB films, Sholay usually gets mentioned because of its blockbuster status and how many of its characters including Gabbar Singh connected with the audiences 

 

As for me, based on what I wrote here from recent viewings, it is probably Agneepath and Don

 

Sholay, I have not seen recently to see how it holds up. From memory (multiple viewings in the past), its action sequences could hold up better (the background score in those sequences is foot tapping too). Its comedy sequences need to be evaluated to see if they appear childish now. Overall through its key strengths, the film should still hold up well in 2021

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Weekend pe Sholay bhi wapas dekh dali ... Jaise loha, lohe ko kaat ta hai, waise masala film lovers ko Sholay ... A great masala film!

 

What I like about the film is that it immediately sets the agenda through the Thakur-Jailor meeting and also the pace with the superb train fight sequence sporting some foot tapping background score. The sequence is a good introduction to Jai & Veeru, highlighting their characters where one is relatively serious and other relatively fun loving … The comedy sequences still work ... The film has memorable sequences one after the other: Train fight sequence -> Angrez ke zamane ke jailor -> Basanti's intro -> Gabbar's intro -> etc. ... Also it was nice to see Jai-Veeru return Thakur's money after learning about his story (they do not always work for money), showing a different side of their personality or the coin as Thakur would say ... The film also briefly delves into Radha's, who is now dressed in white, love for colors ... As I said, the background score during action scenes can be foot tapping. The camera angles are used nicely. Will not go into popular points about it like the dialogues. 

 

Cons are relatively negligible. But if I have to mention something it would probably be about some smart editing (the film is over 3 hours long) - Veeru's dreams about kids feel repetitive. Some of the sequences could have been presented better for e.g. a) when the goons come to capture Basanti, she walks right through them to set up a chase, b) When Veeru goes back to seek revenge with Gabbar, hardly anyone is shooting at him (not everyone would be out of rounds) ... It is easy to make the doubles out (but not a big deal considering the age of the film) ... If I recall correctly, Ramesh Sippy originally wanted Thakur to kill Gabbar. Maybe that could have worked better as many of Gabbar's associates were already killed. The police showing up at the end to give a lecture appears like a standard film insert. On the other hand, because it was Thakur's character, we can say that let his hands or legs remain clean (even though he hired Jai-Veeru, who killed many dacoits).

 

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1 hour ago, zen said:

If I recall correctly, Ramesh Sippy originally wanted Thakur to kill Gabbar. Maybe that could have worked better as many of Gabbar's associates were already killed. The police showing up at the end to give a lecture appears like a standard film insert. On the other hand, because it was Thakur's character, we can say that let his hands or legs remain clean (even though he hired Jai-Veeru, who killed many dacoits).

 

This ending is cannon as far as I am concerned.

 

 

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