Predator_05 Posted May 12, 2008 Share Posted May 12, 2008 Dravid's job is to lead the picked players. If he does mistakes with playing 11 or with on-field decisions, he can be blamed. You can't just dump team picking responsibility all on a player and expect it to work well. Looks like Mallya and Charu Sharma dumped the job of team selection on Dravid and they should be blamed for that. Team owners in all pro-sports get majorly involved in player selection. If you don't know a shyte about the game, you hire someone to do that. In this case Mallya claims he had his own list of players. Why the fack didn't he overrule Dravid and Charu Sharma and go with his super-list? You think the Lakers will dump the draft duties on Kobe and blame him if all fails? No, but if everything fails, you know Phil Jackson won't be in a job for too long. My point is that the owner/chairman/president etc. doesn't take the fall. Kobe Bryant doesn't pick the players. The manager/coach is one who asks for the players he wants. In cricket, the captain is the one who has that role. So if Dravid did pick the squad (like every other captain in the IPL did) then he should be held responsible for their results. There is nothing wrong with that. I don't know what Mallya's intentions were and whether he actually had his own "list" or not, but i'd think that his knowledge of cricket probably isn't upto scratch, hence why it would make sense for him to trust Dravid. Unfortunately for him, Dravid - at least judging by his selection of the team - clearly doesn't have the slightest idea about what it takes to win in T20. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IndianRenegade Posted May 12, 2008 Share Posted May 12, 2008 As I said, BRC's travails is more a direct function of under performing players than faulty team selection. If anything BRC has been one of the least affected squads due to exodus of Aussie, Windies and Kiwi players. Teams like KKR and CSK have been a shadow of their former selves since their star players left. BRC faced few such problems. In fact, their squad has gotten progressively stronger as the tournament has progressed. yeah... BRC faced few such problems... they sucked big time before the exodus of these forigners in the other teams and they continue to suck big time even after it. I don't see how they have got stronger as time as gone by. I keep repeating to the point of boring everyone to death, Dravid cant be held responsible if his star players dont perform. What he can do if till now, the combined group of Kallis+Shiv+White+Kohli do very little? My point is what has he done? You keep pointing fingers at kallis et all. look at Dravid himself, what has he done? Hasn't he failed himself? Then as I said Kallis is not made for this game, Shiv has very little T20 experience and his records aren't great. Kholi too has no great T20 experience. And white has played 3 innings as of now failed in 2 and has done well in another, so I can't find too much fault with him. The point is Dravid was responsible for having all of them into the team and many of them have very little T20 experience or haven't done well in the format, so how can he be absolved of the blame? No, what I meant was, in in T20, esp in a franchise based IPL where talent is so equally distributed, there's very little separating the teams. And we have seen that plenty of times how the so called fancied teams have lost to less-fancied opponents. BRC could easily tallied 2-3 more wins had luck gone their in crucial moments, or had their players delivered in crucial moments. Exactly, he had players who can't deliver in this format in the team, whose fault is it? You don't win many games by luck or lose many either by luck. It happens because you aren't good enough. No, I meant to tell that you cant label BRC as 'test-squad' either, coz, apart from a couple, its squad is filled with hard-hitters and improvisers. And you drop them and make them warm the benches? And play the likes of Kallis, Shiv, and Jaffer. Moreover, Dravid himself wastes the balls coming up the order and makes things difficult for these big hitters. Whose fault is it? We really cant comment on team selection coz we simply dont know whats the strategy inside the dressing room. :hysterical::hysterical::hysterical::hysterical::hysterical::hysterical::hysterical::hysterical: WTF? DRAVID IS THE CAPTAIN. It is of little doubt dravid would have a big role to play in the team selection as any captain would & moreover considering that he got the team he wanted he would have had a big role to play in the strategy, and the playing XI.What kind of stupid strategy leaves out Misbhah out of the scheme of things but finds use for jaffer & Shiv? if he had put his feet up and said this is the team he wanted who would have stopped him? certainly not mallya. But now I doubt Mallya would trust dravid anymore... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IndianRenegade Posted May 12, 2008 Share Posted May 12, 2008 Solid Strategy - That's what comes to mind when you think of the Royal Challengers Bangalore. This is a team that firmly believes that a match here and there may be won with dash and verve, but it is the strategists who will ultimately take home the trophy. Right from the IPL auction, the Royal challengers campaign has been true to its game plan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vadodaravictor Posted May 12, 2008 Share Posted May 12, 2008 Great..so every IPL season, we will see some franchise owner, who spent millions of dollars, come out shouting, screaming and complaining just because his team is at bottom and he didn't get his money worth. Nice..this IPL is cricket with masala (bhajji slapping, maliya's blame game) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobbydhillon Posted May 12, 2008 Share Posted May 12, 2008 Mallya still has been really kind to Dravid as far as speaking out in the press. It is not that this team is hopeless. It still has potential to perform, but there again Dravid spoils the party by taking some stupid decisions. Like keeping Misbhah away - yes - he hasn't fired in the couple of games he has played, but his record in T20 format is enough justification to play him until he regains his lost touch which won't be far. When dravid can play himself after 2 consecutive golden ducks & with no strong T20 background, why can't he play Misbhah? Having players like C. White in the XI and promoting himself up the order, is pure nonsense. When C. White finally came out and started firing Dravid & his openers had already made the job too difficult by playing innings like 5/6 (11). I am sorry to say this, Dravid is not the same great cricketing mind when it comes to T20. cant agree more, i truly was thinking the same **** , he has to give misbah and white chance in every game but i guess he lost it and i am losing whatever sympathy i had with dravid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ram Posted May 12, 2008 Share Posted May 12, 2008 yeah... BRC faced few such problems... they sucked big time before the exodus of these forigners in the other teams and they continue to suck big time even after it. I don't see how they have got stronger as time as gone by. . They won 2 of their first 4 or 5 matches and thats a reasonable start by any standard. My point is what has he done? You keep pointing fingers at kallis et all. look at Dravid himself' date=' what has he done? Hasn't he failed himself?.[/quote'] That is an entirely separate discussion by itself. Dravid has done what he could, scoring the odd 50 and a run-a-ball 30, like today. That, in a team based 20/20 is more than sufficient, given the other players around him attacked and went forward. That simply hasnt happened. Then as I said Kallis is not made for this game' date=' Shiv has very little T20 experience and his records aren't great. Kholi too has no great T20 experience. And white has played 3 innings as of now failed in 2 and has done well in another, so I can't find too much fault with him. .[/quote'] Kallis and Shiv may be acclaimed test match players, but they have played some rollicking ODI innings too. Both of 'em certainly have enough class to score quickly if they want to, but they simply havent been able to do it. Kolhi has been massive disappointment, given how he has been given the extra responsibility of coming in the top-order. The point is Dravid was responsible for having all of them into the team and many of them have very little T20 experience or haven't done well in the format' date=' so how can he be absolved of the blame?.[/quote'] And what T20 experience did Watson, Gony etc have ? Dravid backed his horses, but they turned out to be donkeys. Exactly' date=' he had players who can't deliver in this format in the team, whose fault is it? You don't win many games by luck or lose many either by luck. It happens because you aren't good enough. .[/quote'] Look, I am not saying BRC is the best team out there. Sure they are one of the weaker squads, but they are not, in absolute terms as bad as they seem to be. That is all I am saying. :hysterical::hysterical::hysterical::hysterical::hysterical::hysterical::hysterical::hysterical: WTF? DRAVID IS THE CAPTAIN. It is of little doubt dravid would have a big role to play in the team selection as any captain would & moreover considering that he got the team he wanted he would have had a big role to play in the strategy, and the playing XI.What kind of stupid strategy leaves out Misbhah out of the scheme of things but finds use for jaffer & Shiv? if he had put his feet up and said this is the team he wanted who would have stopped him? certainly not mallya. But now I doubt Mallya would trust dravid anymore... BRC had to play Boucher and Steyn in every match. Kallis is an all-rounder, so they have had to choose between White and Misbah and they went for White in the initial games. Sure, that may not sound right, but thats the way I see it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IndianRenegade Posted May 12, 2008 Share Posted May 12, 2008 Great..so every IPL season, we will see some franchise owner, who spent millions of dollars, come out shouting, screaming and complaining just because his team is at bottom and he didn't get his money worth. Nice..this IPL is cricket with masala (bhajji slapping, maliya's blame game) See someone has to be at the bottom, everyone knows that. But it is not that you need to be at the bottom because you played bad. It would be okay if you had played fine but the others were too good. But BRC hasn't even played anything close to good cricket. Dravid needs to find a way to get things right pretty soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bumper Posted May 12, 2008 Share Posted May 12, 2008 And what T20 experience did Watson, Gony etc have ? Dravid backed his horses, but they turned out to be donkeys. But Dravid's faulted for not backing the only donkey in the team, though! And when the donkey's backed, the donkey kick rattles the stumps, undoing Bangalore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IndianRenegade Posted May 12, 2008 Share Posted May 12, 2008 They won 2 of their first 4 or 5 matches and thats a reasonable start by any standard. No, it is not... they won only 1 out of the first 5 games. That is an entirely separate discussion by itself. Dravid has done what he could, scoring the odd 50 and a run-a-ball 30, like today. That, in a team based 20/20 is more than sufficient, given the other players around him attacked and went forward. That simply hasnt happened. How is that so? Isn't he a part of the team? A run a ball innings is no means good by T20 standards. Having said that, it is not hard to imagine that is all Dravid can offer. It would be a bonus if he scores beyond that. This will be looked away if the team wins, but when it is loosing you need to find why and Dravid can't escape from being pointed out as one of the reasons. But more than his batting it is his captaincy that is a problem. Kallis and Shiv may be acclaimed test match players, but they have played some rollicking ODI innings too. Both of 'em certainly have enough class to score quickly if they want to, but they simply havent been able to do it. Kolhi has been massive disappointment, given how he has been given the extra responsibility of coming in the top-order. A run a ball score would be considered rollicking in ODI's and not so in T20. kallis and Shiv may be able to do that in ODI, once they settle down. That is by no means T20 standard. Of course, Kholi doesn't seem to be the one made for this type of game too. he was a gamble, but he never payed off. And what T20 experience did Watson, Gony etc have ? Dravid backed his horses, but they turned out to be donkeys. Watson was taken in the second auction and Gony (too was taken in the second auction, I think - not sure) but he was a bonus, was expected to cover CSK's weak bowling until Nitini and Morkel where available. But the sad part with BRC is players who are meant to be the mainstay haven't really fired. Look, I am not saying BRC is the best team out there. Sure they are one of the weaker squads, but they are not, in absolute terms as bad as they seem to be. That is all I am saying. Yeah, right and you won't expect a great cricketing mind to come up with such a weak squad. Dravid isn't a T20 cricketing mind. Moreover I never said BRC is hopeless. in fact I said they have some potential that needs to be used properly. BRC had to play Boucher and Steyn in every match. Kallis is an all-rounder, so they have had to choose between White and Misbah and they went for White in the initial games. Sure, that may not sound right, but thats the way I see it. Steyn wasn't available for the first 2 matches. Anyone would have gone for Misbhah for the 4th foreigner but Dravid. Even then Misbhah is far more reliable than White. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest HariSampath Posted May 12, 2008 Share Posted May 12, 2008 The truth is that Dravid with his pathetic batting would have never been able to raise team morale or ask the top order to fire...I can imagine Dravid saying at team meetings " come on boys...we need the batters to go hard at the bowling, I wanna see 4s and 6s, I wanna see the bowling smashed, show aggression you duds, let's see some real batting" and bang the table....his team mates will simply look at each other and ask " what was THAT all about Rahul...how about showing us how its done" with a knowing wink ;-)...and thats why the BRC batting has collapsed and with it the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gambit Posted May 12, 2008 Share Posted May 12, 2008 Had Dravid actually performed with the bat, people would have had more sympathy for him but the fact is that he has been pretty poor with the bat. Even Ganguly and Laxman have outperformed him. It's pretty much a given that a non performing captain in a non performing team is the first one to get the sack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brainfade Posted May 12, 2008 Share Posted May 12, 2008 The buck stops with Mallaya - if he is not happy with his own selection he has only himself to blame and if he thinks firing Charu Sharma and Dravid will change things' date=' he is well within the right to do so with a severance package of $3 million for Dravid. No one forced him to buy the Bangalore franchise and if its sucking he has to share the biggest blame.[/quote'] Exactly. The man has no accountability. I guess that's what happens when life gets handed to you on a platter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ludhianvi Posted May 12, 2008 Share Posted May 12, 2008 Let's face it, someone has to come last in the tournament, not every team can be number one. Bangalore has some decent players. Its just that they did not play them with the right combinations. Apart from the so-called test players, they have: Ross Taylor Cameron White Misbah Bracken(injured) Boucher Steyn That's a decent group of int'l players. They should've played this squad IMO Praveen Kumar Ross Taylor Misbah Kohli Cameron White Dravid Goswami Zaheer Khan Kumble Vinay Kumar Bracken/Steyn/Kallis/Another bowler They could've rotated these players: Boucher, Bracken,Kallis, Chanders, if they wanted them to have a game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cricketman Posted May 12, 2008 Share Posted May 12, 2008 I think Mallya is lying through his freaking teeth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cricketman Posted May 12, 2008 Share Posted May 12, 2008 The truth is that Dravid with his pathetic batting would have never been able to raise team morale or ask the top order to fire...I can imagine Dravid saying at team meetings " come on boys...we need the batters to go hard at the bowling' date=' I wanna see 4s and 6s, I wanna see the bowling smashed, show aggression you duds, let's see some real batting" and bang the table....his team mates will simply look at each other and ask " what was THAT all about Rahul...how about showing us how its done" with a knowing wink ;-)...and thats why the BRC batting has collapsed and with it the team.[/quote'] Exactly, thats why Dravid has been easily the best batsman of the bottom four teams!:withstupid: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flamy Posted May 12, 2008 Share Posted May 12, 2008 Even with the very unbecoming squad they selected, a better captain would have brought some tangible results to the table. Dravid has failed in everything. From selecting the playing 11, the batting order, and fielding captaincy (giving Dhoni so many gaps after holding tight reign of the match for so long). Why doesn't he pick Goswami? Give the kid a chance, he did pretty well in U19. Of course, whatever little hope I had was pissed all over, when he wouldn't pick Misbah even when he was available. I knew then, BRC was doomed to bang its head against the stubborness and solidity of "The Wall" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flamy Posted May 12, 2008 Share Posted May 12, 2008 However, I entered this thread thinking Mallya was confessing about some bastard he had sired :D I was thrown off-topic by the discussion here :hmpf: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Posted May 13, 2008 Share Posted May 13, 2008 Just a bit more drama to the tourney. Any advertisement is a good advertisement. Bangalore RCs have no chance in this year's IPL, it's time to move on. Bangalore may win a game or two at the most but there is no doubt the players picked to play for Bangalore are not that good for Twenty20 format. Whether Mallya points fingers at Charu or Rahul, it doesn't matter anymore. He'll only sound like a sore loser for whinging and passing the buck in public half way through the tournament. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobbydhillon Posted May 13, 2008 Share Posted May 13, 2008 even in 16 over game against kkr, they picked chanderpaul over misbah, that's what made me lose any sympathy for dravid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suraj Posted May 13, 2008 Share Posted May 13, 2008 even in 16 over game against kkr' date=' they picked chanderpaul over misbah, that's what made me lose any sympathy for dravid.[/quote'] Exactly!!! what stupid selection Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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