Lone Wolf Posted June 26 Posted June 26 (edited) 41 minutes ago, singhvivek141 said: What are they expecting from the talks ? Is Pookistan gonna drop the radicalization against Non Muslims ? Pookistan is worried about the insurgencies in PoJK, KPK, Balochistan and to a small level in Sindh. Plus Saudis are pulling them in MIddle East conflict. They are facing challenges within the foot soldiers. While Indian border is comparatively quiet and the only real challenge is Indus Water Treaty. Which we shouldn't give up as thats the leverage. If US is promising us the delivery of engines, then overtly show calm at the border, but covertly arm the TTP & BLA is what I would suggest. Ajit Doval is a expert in covert strategic operations which we can see from the POV of unknown gunmen killings. But time is high to escalate the cost of war in Pakistan. Give BLA & Afghan Taliban drones & other loitering munitions so that they can strike at Pak military posts. Already Russia is giving them some form of air defence. For India's sake, its important that Pakistan bleed from inside. A stable Pakistan is against India....we have to be like a wolf and play the same game which Pooks play with US. My guess is pressure is enormous on GoI from Americans and Arabs to go back to status quo. Indian diplomatic clout is at all time low already. Policy to isolate Pooks on global stage was bound to fail eventually as it will never get isolated coz its a mercenary state to begin with. Doval is 80 odd & is no longer in his prime. He was supposed to retire as well. His tenure was extended at PM's own request. Probably his final term this. Need people with fresh ideas and perspective to deal with this overt US Pak ties and China not against Pak but on the sidelines for the moment. Edited June 26 by Lone Wolf
singhvivek141 Posted June 26 Posted June 26 (edited) 18 minutes ago, Lone Wolf said: Massively overpriced for mere 130 odd guns regardless. Happens in case of imports. It's not as if you are sending us Subsonic cruise missiles. Terrain is much harsher on Indian side compared to Chinese flat Tibetan plateau, Changthangh plateau in SE Ladakh and Xinjiang autonomous region. Their mechanised divisions don't have much issues to deploy quickly in numbers Makes even more sense for us to opt for light tanks Thats where our rocket force and drone warfare becomes important. Atleast thats something which is in our control. Selectively targeting the airbases and civilian infra would be the key to cut off Chinese logistics movement into Tibet. We need to build underground bases in Himalayas...likes of Daulat Beg Oldie & Siliguri corridor are pretty exposed. Edited June 26 by singhvivek141 Lone Wolf and G_B_ 1 1
Lone Wolf Posted June 26 Posted June 26 6 minutes ago, singhvivek141 said: Thats where our rocket force and drone warfare becomes important. Atleast thats something which is in our control. Selectively targeting the airbases and civilian infra would be the key to cut off Chinese logistics movement into Tibet. We need to build underground bases in Himalayas...likes of Daulat Beg Oldie & Siliguri corridor are pretty exposed. Need long range conventional strike platforms. That's where LRLACM is so crucial both surface and air launched variants. For now we have maintained defensive posture but that's unsustainable in both short and long term against a foe like PLA, PLAAF and PLARF.
singhvivek141 Posted June 26 Posted June 26 (edited) 54 minutes ago, Lone Wolf said: Need long range conventional strike platforms. That's where LRLACM is so crucial both surface and air launched variants. For now we have maintained defensive posture but that's unsustainable in both short and long term against a foe like PLA, PLAAF and PLARF. LR-LACM (Nirbhay) range is still 1500 km, plans are to extend it to 2500 km. Good but not great. It's subsonic as well. We need missiles which can threaten the east coast of China as well. K4/K5 and AGNI are Nuclear, we need conventional options altogether. Again, I'm not entirely ignoring our missile capacity, it can absolutely obliterate Pookistan and many nations in the world. But for China, along with the capability, the range also matters. Most of our missiles are still Pook focussed. Shaurya, K series and Agni are Nuclear first so they can cause chaos in the wrong environment. We need conventional missiles with supersonic/hypersonic tech and long ranges to conflict the cost of war to China. Our prep has to be China focussed, Pookistan can be wiped out in a matter of 3-4 days. Also need to raise defence budget to atleast 2.5% of the GDP (it's bumped up to 1.9% this year from 1.5%) till 2047. Jitna paisa daaloge, utna ROI milega. Edited June 26 by singhvivek141
singhvivek141 Posted June 26 Posted June 26 @Lone Wolf, @G_B_ Again the problem seems to be for AMCA and not Tejas mk2. 150 odd engines for F414 will be ordered for proposed 120 (6 squadrons) of Tejas mk2. Price, 150*70 = 10500 Crores. https://defence.in/threads/no-stalemate-in-f414-engine-negotiations-for-tejas-mk2-as-hal-clarifies-separate-amca-commercial-discussions-continue.18099/ Safran engine deal needs to go through soon. The CCS approval is there anyway. AMCA Mk1, we may need to product in limited numbers (40-60) units so that we need to get some 150 units of F414 which can cost 150*200 = 30000 Crores. Total 40,500 crores on Engines from F414. Sign this deal and then shut off new orders. TEDBF in my opinion should move ahead with a different design. Mig 29k can still be stretched till 2040. Rafale M will be there as well. Redesign TEDBF with Safran-GTRE engine (which will be similar in dimensions to F414), and move ahead. Lone Wolf and G_B_ 1 1
Lone Wolf Posted June 26 Posted June 26 3 minutes ago, singhvivek141 said: @Lone Wolf, @G_B_ Again the problem seems to be for AMCA and not Tejas mk2. 150 odd engines for F414 will be ordered for proposed 120 (6 squadrons) of Tejas mk2. Price, 150*70 = 10500 Crores. https://defence.in/threads/no-stalemate-in-f414-engine-negotiations-for-tejas-mk2-as-hal-clarifies-separate-amca-commercial-discussions-continue.18099/ Safran engine deal needs to go through soon. The CCS approval is there anyway. AMCA Mk1, we may need to product in limited numbers (40-60) units so that we need to get some 150 units of F414 which can cost 150*200 = 30000 Crores. Total 40,500 crores on Engines from F414. Sign this deal and then shut off new orders. TEDBF in my opinion should move ahead with a different design. Mig 29k can still be stretched till 2040. Rafale M will be there as well. Redesign TEDBF with Safran-GTRE engine (which will be similar in dimensions to F414), and move ahead. Said this before as well. Official word says issue is coming with AMCA mk1, Alpha defence wale ne bhi bola tha after confirming with sources. Idk honestly what's the hold up they have been sitting on this deal for last 15 years. Safran I was reading that things have stalled/slowed somewhat. Don't know the reason or how accurate it was. Let's hope it goes through soon unlike the GE case singhvivek141 1
singhvivek141 Posted June 26 Posted June 26 4 minutes ago, Lone Wolf said: Said this before as well. Official word says issue is coming with AMCA mk1, Alpha defence wale ne bhi bola tha after confirming with sources. Idk honestly what's the hold up they have been sitting on this deal for last 15 years. Safran I was reading that things have stalled/slowed somewhat. Don't know the reason or how accurate it was. Let's hope it goes through soon unlike the GE case Stuck in alignment with share of work. Safran as usual will show kanjoosi in sharing the piece of work to other vendors. That's the cost of being a sovereign nation that we've to pay, coz they'll setup the MRO as well in India. France usually does things on it's own so they're not ready to open their doors so easily. But with them, delivery of engines is a guarantee. Rolls Royce is ready to share IP rights now, but once we pivot to them, they too will start causing issues plus the pressure from Amreeka. Although Rolls Royce is workng on 6th gen engines so sharing work for 5th gen engines won't be an issue to them. GE is completely under Trump, probably once Trump goes out things will improve. But that's 2 year late. Lone Wolf 1
singhvivek141 Posted June 27 Posted June 27 With the amount of mishaps that we are seeing in our Tejas program. I am more and more inclined that we need to put more energy onto Ghatak. Not sure why DRDO is sleeping over it. Ghatak will be a one shot solution for most of our IAF problems. It's stealthy, completely indigenous and free from any external engine complications. Single engine Ghatak with Kaveri will be a POC while twin engine Ghatak can easily match Rafale or Tejas mk2 in capability. G_B_ 1
singhvivek141 Posted June 28 Posted June 28 Good decision, IMO. Instead of creating token ships of 4 or 6. P18 should see atleast a dozen ships to combat the adversaries. Given the fact that INS Delhi class destroyers are on the brink of retirement in a decade...it's important that we bridge the gap not only in terms of numbers, but also in terms of missile launching capability. G_B_ 1
Lone Wolf Posted June 28 Posted June 28 This was a very fiery podcast. MoD HAL ki dhajjiya uda di hai is baar
singhvivek141 Posted June 28 Posted June 28 1 hour ago, Lone Wolf said: This was a very fiery podcast. MoD HAL ki dhajjiya uda di hai is baar I sometimes feel Shiv Aroor & Vishnu become overdramatic in order to convey their points. Almost there every podcast these days is concerning and bit negative. While, I feel Sandeep Unnithans show is bit more balanced. Both Chakra and in our defence. Best and underrated is Dabolim Dialogues though, bit more old school and need patience. But host himself is from Defence background. Worst is Gaurav Arya though, too much hyperbole and Pak centric. It's clear that he has not much knowledge of the defence requirements of other wings and is primarily into Artillery discussion. But he knows how to market himself. Lone Wolf and Sgattick10 2
singhvivek141 Posted June 28 Posted June 28 Kalyani Group has a window to sell their equipments and build more trust.
Lone Wolf Posted June 28 Posted June 28 19 minutes ago, singhvivek141 said: I sometimes feel Shiv Aroor & Vishnu become overdramatic in order to convey their points. Almost there every podcast these days is concerning and bit negative. While, I feel Sandeep Unnithans show is bit more balanced. Both Chakra and in our defence. Best and underrated is Dabolim Dialogues though, bit more old school and need patience. But host himself is from Defence background. Worst is Gaurav Arya though, too much hyperbole and Pak centric. It's clear that he has not much knowledge of the defence requirements of other wings and is primarily into Artillery discussion. But he knows how to market himself. Thing is Vishnu and Aroor have sources from top to bottom. Vishnu has been in the game for a long time now, he is fully aware of the bureaucratic sh*hole of MoD and incompetence of HAL. He can be way too blunt sometimes but guy knows his sh*t. Chakra is also very good. Others are not worth mentioning. Just click bait inaccurate and strictly for views. Twitter/X is a much better source than the daily slop they put up and they mostly rely on said platform as well. Gaurav Arya is a useful tool online to rile up Porks but you cannot expect him to know anything remotely concerning to defence related discussions. singhvivek141 1
Lone Wolf Posted June 28 Posted June 28 (edited) 3 hours ago, singhvivek141 said: Good decision, IMO. Instead of creating token ships of 4 or 6. P18 should see atleast a dozen ships to combat the adversaries. Given the fact that INS Delhi class destroyers are on the brink of retirement in a decade...it's important that we bridge the gap not only in terms of numbers, but also in terms of missile launching capability. Yeah also the three remaining Rajput class destroyers are on the brink to be decommissioned atp.. we should go ahead with P15c as Project 18 still seems deep into the future. My guess is Budget constraints are preventing Navy to fully commit to it. Edited June 28 by Lone Wolf
G_B_ Posted June 28 Posted June 28 On 6/26/2026 at 7:28 AM, singhvivek141 said: @Lone Wolf, @G_B_ Again the problem seems to be for AMCA and not Tejas mk2. 150 odd engines for F414 will be ordered for proposed 120 (6 squadrons) of Tejas mk2. Price, 150*70 = 10500 Crores. https://defence.in/threads/no-stalemate-in-f414-engine-negotiations-for-tejas-mk2-as-hal-clarifies-separate-amca-commercial-discussions-continue.18099/ Safran engine deal needs to go through soon. The CCS approval is there anyway. AMCA Mk1, we may need to product in limited numbers (40-60) units so that we need to get some 150 units of F414 which can cost 150*200 = 30000 Crores. Total 40,500 crores on Engines from F414. Sign this deal and then shut off new orders. TEDBF in my opinion should move ahead with a different design. Mig 29k can still be stretched till 2040. Rafale M will be there as well. Redesign TEDBF with Safran-GTRE engine (which will be similar in dimensions to F414), and move ahead. I read even ge provided f404 for mk1a had issues. Dont know of hal trying to reflect or not singhvivek141 1
singhvivek141 Posted June 28 Posted June 28 3 hours ago, G_B_ said: I read even ge provided f404 for mk1a had issues. Dont know of hal trying to reflect or not Yeah, 6th engine GE provided has run into issues. There is zero doubt that GE is purposefully trying to sabotage our Tejas program under the directions from US govt. Situation will improve probably, but we've faced a delay of almost 5 years now. Tejas mk1a was the reason why we didn't go with massive Rafale orders in 2016 and just bought 2 token squadrons. No fighter jet program is gonna be successful without own engine. ADA need to immediate start working on TEDBF land prototype (ORCA), power it with twin Kaveri engines and test them through. At the moment the lowest hanging fruit is Ghatak....inducting them in huge numbers will cover our lack of squadron quantity. But GTRE can't build that by itself, it needs to share the tech to private vendors so that they can mass produce them.
IndianRenegade Posted June 30 Posted June 30 (edited) Royal meltdown from pooks on IWT going on!!! Edited June 30 by IndianRenegade Pratik77 1
singhvivek141 Posted July 1 Posted July 1 14 hours ago, IndianRenegade said: Royal meltdown from pooks on IWT going on!!! IWT is a serious issue for Pooks in every sense. It cripples their Punjab region in terms of agriculture and water...Pooks dont care about any other region. So this is the real Nuclear bomb India has. It was a catastrophic mistake by us to not use this as a leverage, specially when Pooks started using first Punjab and then Kashmir as a breeding ground for terrorists and Mujahideens. IndianRenegade 1
singhvivek141 Posted July 1 Posted July 1 Brahmos has become a lead character in India's weapon export. Hogging all the limelight. Demands across geographics and more importantly from the American backyard is an encouraging sign. Already def minister mentioned that we are on track to achieve the target of 50000 crore export way before 2030, we are at 39000 crore now in 2026. https://defence.in/threads/india-sees-new-enquiries-for-brahmos-from-gulf-latin-america-and-asia-report.18141/
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