Sachin, not the farmer

[daryl1985]

I was very surprised too but it was a hopeless cause and maybe he just doesn't agree with the notion of shielding the tail ender. I would have loved to have seen SRT look to launch a counter attack this morning and play some shots. However, he was probably looking to see out Morkel and Steyn before targeting Tsotsobe!

[vvvslaxman]

I was very surprised too but it was a hopeless cause and maybe he just doesn't agree with the notion of shielding the tail ender. I would have loved to have seen SRT look to launch a counter attack this morning and play some shots. However' date= he was probably looking to see out Morkel and Steyn before targeting Tsotsobe!

It was no more hopeless than when Laxman joined Ishant at 124 for 8.

[Nova]

Yeah, I think Tendu should have definitely tried to keep most of the strike. On the contrary, the Mohali test comes to mind where Ishant played 71% of the deliveries faced between him and Laxman.....something like this just does not happen too often. :( We could have avoided the innings defeat may be but losing the game was inevitable. As Marirs said, the team had already given hope, so don't know what was the mind set.

[Jersey #10]

I want to see smith talking after the second test

[vvvslaxman]

Smith's cockiness and arrogance (mocked India by saying We have heard a lot about India' date=' talked about our batters dont do well away from home etc) [b']could come back to bite him hard.

No evidence for that. India doesn't have bowlers to threaten them.

[Deleted_User_1]

Yup as much as I love SRT, I am very disappointed that he did not make any attempt to shield the tail.

[kabira]

Oh on DAy 4 he did farm the strike especially against Steyn.

[Ram]

Some guys are being unfairly critical of Sachin here. You have to keep in mind the circumstances before start pointing the finger of accusation at him. Starting day 5, we were 40 runs behind with only Sreesanth and Unadkat the two remaining tail-enders. Even if Sachin had done what people want him to do and farmed the strike and scored some runs, the most optimistic outcome of that could have been probably 70-80 or the most, a 100 runs. Thats a 60 run target for South Africa to chase. Its easy for us to sit here and say he should have done that, he should have done this, but the circumstances of this game were so dire going into day 5, defeat was only inevitable. Of course, if we had been 150 runs ahead with 2 wickets in hand, I am pretty sure Sachin's tactics would have been diameterically opposite, or at least, it should be. But in this case, there's no justification whatsoever to say he didnt live up to his standards.

[kabira]

btw did he look fit enough?? He was having cramps last night..Was he fine??

[Deleted_User_1]

Some guys are being unfairly critical of Sachin here. You have to keep in mind the circumstances before start pointing the finger of accusation at him. Starting day 5, we were 40 runs behind with only Sreesanth and Unadkat the two remaining tail-enders. Even if Sachin had done what people want him to do and farmed the strike and scored some runs, the most optimistic outcome of that could have been probably 70-80 or the most, a 100 runs. Thats a 60 run target for South Africa to chase. Its easy for us to sit here and say he should have done that, he should have done this, but the circumstances of this game were so dire going into day 5, defeat was only inevitable. Of course, if we had been 150 runs ahead with 2 wickets in hand, I am pretty sure Sachin's tactics would have been diameterically opposite, or at least, it should be. But in this case, there's no justification whatsoever to say he didnt live up to his standards.

I am sorry, but I absolutely do not agree. If he had shielded the tail, maybe we could have avoided the innings defeat. It is less humiliating. The fact that we went out without a fight on the 5th day does not send a strong message to the opponents. One has got to have a never say die attitude and India basically rolled over on the fifth day. As much as I love SRT, I think his approach was wrong on the last day and appears that he was trying to stay not out to boost his average given that any more resistance was futile in his mind with two bunnies to support him. My childhood idol Gavaskar was also accused of such in his career, so I find this not unique. In the end although he is finest batsman of the modern era (and arguably of all time), I find this approach very disappointing and he should answer to his fan why he did so. At least then we will know what was going on in his mind. I can't imagine the team thinktank would tell him to play like that, but I may be mistaken.

[Ram]

I am sorry, but I absolutely do not agree. If he had shielded the tail, maybe we could have avoided the innings defeat. It is less humiliating. The fact that we went out without a fight on the 5th day does not send a strong message to the opponents. One has got to have a never say die attitude and India basically rolled over on the fifth day. As much as I love SRT, I think his approach was wrong on the last day and appears that he was trying to stay not out to boost his average given that any more resistance was futile in his mind with two bunnies to support him. My childhood idol Gavaskar was also accused of such in his career, so I find this not unique.

Dude, I can perfectly understand why you feel the way you do feel. Its easy to look at the proceedings on day 5 and go ‘Oh, why did he play that way..’ But you need to understand that it was already a lost cause, everyone knows that. Graeme Smith deliberately bought that issue up only to ratchet up some phony controversy and we shouldn’t fall for his trick. Once again, if we were 150 runs ahead with 2 wickets in hand, I am sure Sachin’s approach would have been diametrically opposite. But this wasn’t the case. And please, over the years, you can accuse Sachin of a few missteps here and there (after all, he’s human as well..), but playing for stats and not outs isn’t one of them. Come to think of it, if stats were so important to him, would he not play a single ODI in nearly a year after the time he scored a double 100?

[gult]

Some of you are saying he was selfish. He could have easily protected sreesanth for sometime on this good batting track and scored few more runs, had he truly cared personal records (it could've improved his OK average). It takes two hands to clap. Given the situation we were in, the fight had to come from both ends. Even in the mohali test, ishant was given strike by VVS and because he performed exceptionally well, we were able to win. Don't analyze things more than required. This little man with 20+ years of experience knows better than you and me.

[Deleted_User_1]

Dude, I can perfectly understand why you feel the way you do feel. Its easy to look at the proceedings on day 5 and go ‘Oh, why did he play that way..’ But you need to understand that it was already a lost cause, everyone knows that. Graeme Smith deliberately bought that issue up only to ratchet up some phony controversy and we shouldn’t fall for his trick. Once again, if we were 150 runs ahead with 2 wickets in hand, I am sure Sachin’s approach would have been diametrically opposite. But this wasn’t the case. And please, over the years, you can accuse Sachin of a few missteps here and there (after all, he’s human as well..), but playing for stats and not outs isn’t one of them. Come to think of it, if stats were so important to him, would he not play a single ODI in nearly a year after the time he scored a double 100?

All great players play for stats to some extent. When you are a run machine and are toppling/creating new records frequently, why wouldn't you? If someone like Gavaskar or Tendulkar tells me that they do not pay attention to records I do not buy that. Gavaskar once said that he never paid attention to how much he had scored while batting. Hmmmm...... There is nothing wrong with paying attention to records (I would do the same thing if I were in their postion) as long as it does not conflict with your team interest. I understand that India could not have saved the match from here, but surely they could saved the humiliation of an innings defeat.

[fineleg]

Graeme Smith surprised that Tendulkar did not attempt to farm the strike on Day-5

Graeme Smith expected more of a fight from India on the final morning, and was surprised at how easily the last two wickets came. I must be honest I was a bit surprised he made life so easy for us this morning. That did surprise me a little bit. On the final morning, with India's last two wickets needing 30 runs to avoid an innings defeat, Tendulkar didn't farm the strike. He exposed Sreesanth and, after his dismissal, Jaidev Unadkat to the fiery quicks, Dale Steyn and Morne Morkel. Sreesanth fell when he was given three balls to face from Morkel, and Unadkat when he had to deal with an entire over from Steyn.

[fineleg]

I don't understand Tendulkar's approach on Day 5.....I would have loved for him to try to farm the strike' date=' not give in so easily. Or launch a fierce counter attack. Either way some signal to the South Africans that we are gonna fight till the last drop.

Thats what I was hoping for. Anyway - not much chance to 'save' the Test. Go for some big shots, and go past the innings deficit score, or go down playing a big shot.

[Ram]

Thats what I was hoping for. Anyway - not much chance to 'save' the Test. Go for some big shots' date=' and go past the innings deficit score, or go down playing a big shot.[/quote'] So you’re back at your deceitfully innocent sounding insinuations again? Where was your ‘Nothing against anyone, but I was only hoping for so and so..’, when Dravid was hurting our chances so badly between 2007 and 2008? Forgot how to open a thread back then? :P

[fineleg]

^ If you understood why Tendulkar was taking a single so early in each over, do explain. I did not. I can understand if he did not want to play 'farmer' since the Test was gone. Was there any reason to NOT try and hit some big shots - either it comes off or we finish the Test. I am talking especially after Unadkat came in. While Sreesanth was there - you may still come up with some dubious argument. Anyway - I think it is quite clear why some of us at least are perplexed with the way it was played out. Wiping out the innings deficit, would not have affected the result - but there was some pride in going for that, one would think. PS: Ok, maybe he wanted Unadkat to get some batting practice against Steyn and Morkel - investment for the future. Ok, I got it. The God works in mysterious ways. Thanks.

[Ram]

^ If you understood why Tendulkar was taking a single so early in each over' date=' do explain. I did not.[/quote'] If you answer these three questions first, I promise to answer yours in as much detail as you possibly want; 1)Was there any instance between 2007 and 2008 when, in your opinion, Dravid’s batting hurt India’s chances for victory? Yes or no? 2)If yes, how many times do you think that happened? And during how many of those occasions did you open a thread questioning his batting strategy? 3) If no, are you willing to debate with me one-on-one, if I actually point out those instances to you and asked you for an explanation as to how you possibly missed out on them?

[Ram]

^I am talking especially after Unadkat came in. While Sreesanth was there - you may still come up with some dubious argument. Anyway - I think it is quite clear why some of us at least are perplexed with the way it was played out. Wiping out the innings deficit, would not have affected the result - but there was some pride in going for that, one would think. PS: Ok, maybe he wanted Unadkat to get some batting practice against Steyn and Morkel - investment for the future. Ok, I got it. The God works in mysterious ways. Thanks.

Pointless babble, followed by more babble. What do you mean ‘some’ of us? Did a group of people nominate you to speak for them? Or did you consult them beforehand before choosing to speak for them? Do you also remember there were many of the same ‘some’ that you are so conveniently referring to now, who were absolutely irate at Dravid’s batting between 2007 and 2008? I wonder, why didn’t you lend your voice on behalf of them?

[fineleg]

I dont have to open a thread for any and all occasion. If you have opened a thread for valid criticism of Dravid, then I would not be defending him (if he was committing a mistake). On the other hand - be it Dhoni or Dravid - if they were playing conservative after the series was levelled or in the bag (NZ or Eng) - then I am supportive of that. No need to take risks once we have bagged the series. This thread is about Tendulkar farming - so if you want to talk that, then talk. If you want to open a separate thread abt Dravid incident - feel free to do so, I will read and tell you whether I agree with the criticism or not. I dont have to defend Dravid when he makes mistakes. I will provide my comment if he does make mistakes. He is not a personal friend or family for me to protect him from criticism. There is nothing to say if I open a thread on X, only I must open the thread on Y.