What exactly makes Dhoni a superb captain??

[Laaloo]

[Number]

I think you guys are over-analyzing issues. When you lose like this, people tend to analyze everything. But it's important to keep perspective on what made this team tick. It's the batting, led by strong opening partnerships. If our batting holds together the rest will take care of itself, including Dhoni's captaincy. I am not making excuses for his defensive tactics, he's been doing this for a while (starting with the last test in SAF) - but this has come up now only because we are losing and losing big time. Yes, Dhoni's test captaincy has not been great. Yes, he has not attacked as much as we'd like him to. (There were a few dropped catches too in the 2nd innings @ MCG that stretched the lead further). But we still bowled out the Aussies twice at the MCG and 290 was gettable. Our openers failed and our batting overall failed, as simple as that. Regardless of what we harp on, this 's why we lost. How can a team carry a permanent passenger in #6, who cannot bat or bowl ? How can we build totals on poor starts ? How can we carry 2 out of form middle order batsmen every tour ? How long can we live with a poor tail ? And, oh, its easy to say, xyz screwed up! What is your solution ? Who will replace Dhoni as test captain ? Gambhir ? I thought some of you wanted him out one innings ago ? Or is it Sehwag who has not made any runs in Eng, SAF and Australia ? Just simply dumping the coach and captain after heavy losses is a typical padosee reaction. Doing so, has not gotten them very far. PS: If you go by our history, we have never been a dominant team. We were always imperfect. Our players make mistakes, tons of them. We used to win despite these issues. But everything going wrong collectively can only mean disaster and that's what we are going thru.

good post. :nice:

[CG]

Yuvraj? Yuvi didnt make any decent contribution with the bat in any of our big final wins under DHoni in World cup or CB series or in World T20. And i wonder why u have skipped this point.We lost 11 consecutive Finals under Ganguly including horribly chocking in Champions trophy final and World cup final.Can u explain how a great captain can lose 11 consecutive finals. And Ganguly had Sachin in his prime unlike Dhoni.Yet he averaged an awful 25 under Ganguly in Finals.Whereas under Dhoni he averages 125 and before Ganguly became Captain Sachin averaged 58 in finals.Even a great player like Sachin performed horribly under Ganguly performing great before Ganguly and after Ganguly.So why does players always chocked in finals under Ganguly? Cant such a great captain like Ganguly even motivate players for finals? Also Ganguly had a far far superior team test team than Dhoni yet he didnt win a single series outside Sub continent.Ganguly had four all time greats (Sachin Dravid Laxman Kumble) all At their peak playing for him unlike Dhoni.Yet we didnt win a single series outside sub continent. How can a great captain captaining 4 all time greats not win a single series outside sub continent?.Or choke in 11 consecutive finals? P.S Can u please name the few 145 plus ODI bowlers we had under Dhoni for world cup or CB series final or World T20?

1.We lost 11 finals Surely but We did Get to finals away from home also,Frankly some of them were very close like the icc knock out final in kenya and icc champions trophy in srilanka,Yes you can say we choked but its better than going out in first round as we are doing under dhoni in icc tournaments outside of sub continent.Also its up to individual players ability to handle pressure in final matches what can a captain do?Gambhir has palyed a decisive role in our final wins and he was not under ganguly. 2.Sachin did not look like the old sachin in 2004-2007 period he had tennis elbow and other problems ,he was not the attacking one we see now. 3.At time of ganguly captaincy we were losing every where away so by drawing series in australia,england we atleast started something.Worldcup -spinners did the job. 4-World t20-R.p singh and sreesanth spell against australia in semifinal they were main reason we did well in world t20, cb series- ishant bowled well throughout and sreesanth also bowled well in final got hussey out in a crucial situation. Point is results are not always a indication how good a captain is even if you take results which indian captain has lost 6 tests in a row for india.Ganguly built the team and drvaid and kumble continued it and dhoni took the benefits,Only thing we cans ay is dhoni backed gambhir and guys like raina.

[BeautifulGame]

1.We lost 11 finals Surely but We did Get to finals away from home also,Frankly some of them were very close like the icc knock out final in kenya and icc champions trophy in srilanka,Yes you can say we choked but its better than going out in first round as we are doing under dhoni in icc tournaments outside of sub continent.Also its up to individual players ability to handle pressure in final matches what can a captain do?Gambhir has palyed a decisive role in our final wins and he was not under ganguly.

Yes we came very close yet we choked everytime under Ganguly.If he is a great captain why cant he motivate his players to perform. And i would take a captain who cap win a world cup in his very first attempt even if it is at home even if are knocked out of CT and World T20 first round every time that someone who chokes is every final and wins nothing.

2.Sachin did not look like the old sachin in 2004-2007 period he had tennis elbow and other problems ,he was not the attacking one we see now.

Sachin performed till 200 excellently in finals before Ganguly became captain.And he was at him best mostly till 2004.And he always did well in round robin matches under Ganguly too for this injury excuse.Yet when it came to finals he choked in finals but performed really well under Dhoni as well as before Gaguly.Maybe Ganguly cant inspire players in a final like Dhoni can. And Gambhir himself said Dhoni backing as a captain was one of the most important reasons in him performing well since his come back.

3.At time of ganguly captaincy we were losing every where away so by drawing series in australia,england we atleast started something.Worldcup -spinners did the job.

Yet we cant win a single series outside Sub continent despite having 4 all time greats under his captaincy at their peak.

4-World t20-R.p singh and sreesanth spell against australia in semifinal they were main reason we did well in world t20,

Neither of them bowled a single consistent spell in any of these finals.If u brand bowling a 145k delivery in every full moon as "145K" bowlers then Ganguly always had 3 145K bowlers in Zaheer Agarkar and Nehra.

cb series- ishant bowled well throughout and sreesanth also bowled well in final got hussey out in a crucial situation.

yet we had better bowlers under Ganguly and they failed to perform when it came to finals unlike under Dhoni.

Point is results are not always a indication how good a captain is even if you take results which indian captain has lost 6 tests in a row for india.Ganguly built the team and drvaid and kumble continued it and dhoni took the benefits,Only thing we cans ay is dhoni backed gambhir and guys like raina.

Tell me a single captain in cricketing history that is considered great captain that has neither won world cup nor won a single series away from sub continent?

[Shunya]

1.We lost 11 finals Surely but We did Get to finals away from home also,Frankly some of them were very close like the icc knock out final in kenya and icc champions trophy in srilanka,Yes you can say we choked but its better than going out in first round as we are doing under dhoni in icc tournaments outside of sub continent.Also its up to individual players ability to handle pressure in final matches what can a captain do?Gambhir has palyed a decisive role in our final wins and he was not under ganguly. 2.Sachin did not look like the old sachin in 2004-2007 period he had tennis elbow and other problems ,he was not the attacking one we see now. 3.At time of ganguly captaincy we were losing every where away so by drawing series in australia,england we atleast started something.Worldcup -spinners did the job. 4-World t20-R.p singh and sreesanth spell against australia in semifinal they were main reason we did well in world t20, cb series- ishant bowled well throughout and sreesanth also bowled well in final got hussey out in a crucial situation. Point is results are not always a indication how good a captain is even if you take results which indian captain has lost 6 tests in a row for india.Ganguly built the team and drvaid and kumble continued it and dhoni took the benefits,Only thing we cans ay is dhoni backed gambhir and guys like raina.

seriously man...u should quit hating him so much...we all agree that India are loosing badly under him and he being the leader must get flak for this...but going back in past and trying to prove how "lucky" or bad he was is ridiculous... and comparing his limited overs record with any other captain is not worth it...accept it he has done better than anyone in this aspect... no need to downplay all good things from the past to prove how bad Dhoni is now...those things are way to impressive for anybodys resume...lucky n all is pure BS...all greats were there in past as well...infact by your logic...AZHAR should credit for GANGULYs success...which will sound absurd...so its no point ripping Dhoni of everything he and his team has achieved by calling it FLuke or Luck or being at right place n all...

[CG]

Yes we came very close yet we choked everytime under Ganguly.If he is a great captain why cant he motivate his players to perform. And i would take a captain who cap win a world cup in his very first attempt even if it is at home even if are knocked out of CT and World T20 first round every time that someone who chokes is every final and wins nothing. Sachin performed till 200 excellently in finals before Ganguly became captain.And he was at him best mostly till 2004.And he always did well in round robin matches under Ganguly too for this injury excuse.Yet when it came to finals he choked in finals but performed really well under Dhoni as well as before Gaguly.Maybe Ganguly cant inspire players in a final like Dhoni can. And Gambhir himself said Dhoni backing as a captain was one of the most important reasons in him performing well since his come back. Yet we cant win a single series outside Sub continent despite having 4 all time greats under his captaincy at their peak. Neither of them bowled a single consistent spell in any of these finals.If u brand bowling a 145k delivery in every full moon as "145K" bowlers then Ganguly always had 3 145K bowlers in Zaheer Agarkar and Nehra. yet we had better bowlers under Ganguly and they failed to perform when it came to finals unlike under Dhoni. Tell me a single captain in cricketing history that is considered great captain that has neither won world cup nor won a single series away from sub continent?

1.Motivation?Do you think players playing for india in a final need motivation?If dhoni was so good at motivating why are we losing so many test matches and odis where was the motivation in finals we lost like asia cup and bangladesh and champions trophy,So he can only motivate players in india? 2.Its not ganguly fault sachin did not perform in finals under him ,Both of them shared a good relationship also. 3.Nobody bowls at 145+ regularly ,But in t20 world cup he had r.p singh and sreesanth bowling 135-147km/h and in australia he had ishant bowling at 150km/h and sreesnath 145km/h add praveen kumar with his swing and compare to nehra ,agarkar,zak who was not half the bowler he is today you get the answer.ganguly had a decent attack in the world cup and we reached finals against a very very good australian team Also australia were far dominant team when ganguly was captain and we lost many finals to them also. 2w-RaJjumLo

[Viki_J]

DHONI a gr8 batsman, a gr8 captain and last but not the least a gr8 man hats off :hatsoff::hatsoff:

[Vijay.Sharma]

Tell me a single captain in cricketing history that is considered great captain that has neither won world cup nor won a single series away from sub continent?

Pedantic one - Ian Chappell never won a WC or a series in the sub continent but he is one of cricket's greatest captains. Hansie Cronje was one of the greatest captains but yes he won a series against us in India although he never won a WC I don't remember Viv Richards, who was a very successful captain, winning either a WC or a series in the sub continent. I don't remember Graeme Smith, who has been a very successful captain, winning either a WC or in the subcontinent. Mark Taylor, one of the best captains ever, never won a WC or in India, SL Even Guru Chappal never won a WC or in the sub continent And the list goes on....

[BeautifulGame]

Pedantic one - Ian Chappell never won a WC or a series in the sub continent but he is one of cricket's greatest captains. Hansie Cronje was one of the greatest captains but yes he won a series against us in India although he never won a WC I don't remember Viv Richards, who was a very successful captain, winning either a WC or a series in the sub continent. I don't remember Graeme Smith, who has been a very successful captain, winning either a WC or in the subcontinent. Mark Taylor, one of the best captains ever, never won a WC or in India, SL Even Guru Chappal never won a WC or in the sub continent And the list goes on....

Sure u read correctly? I said away from sub continent. And if u dont Taylor won test series in Pakistan in sub continent.ofcourse his biggest legacy is winning in West Indies the best team of that time.And thus establishling Australia's supremacy. So can u name me a single captain in test history that has never won any series away from sub continent or world cup yet considered great. Not Aussie captains of 70's whose main priority where winning Ashes and rested their best players often when touring sub continent. SO can u give me a straight answer?

[BeautifulGame]

1.Motivation?Do you think players playing for india in a final need motivation?If dhoni was so good at motivating why are we losing so many test matches and odis where was the motivation in finals we lost like asia cup and bangladesh and champions trophy,So he can only motivate players in india? 2.Its not ganguly fault sachin did not perform in finals under him ,Both of them shared a good relationship also. 3.Nobody bowls at 145+ regularly ,But in t20 world cup he had r.p singh and sreesanth bowling 135-147km/h and in australia he had ishant bowling at 150km/h and sreesnath 145km/h add praveen kumar with his swing and compare to nehra ,agarkar,zak who was not half the bowler he is today you get the answer.ganguly had a decent attack in the world cup and we reached finals against a very very good australian team Also australia were far dominant team when ganguly was captain and we lost many finals to them also. 2w-RaJjumLo

Most times when we lost to Aus in finals apart from WC final they usually played weakened side.Yet we didnt even put up a fight.Heck we even choked against Newzealand in CT final.And not all 11 finals were against Australia either. 2.Yet record shows Sachin only struggled to perform under the captaincy of Ganguly.Perhaps Ganguly put too much pressure on players during final so that we choked when it comes to finals. 3.Sreesanth RP Singh and Ishant are better bowlers than Agarkar Zaheer(who canbowl 145K) Nehra at his fastest and Srinath? Look i consider Ganguly as great a captain as Dhoni as i already said earlier in this thread.All i was trying to point out was that Ganguly has as many faults as Dhoni if not more.We consider both of them as greats for what have achieved with us not for their failures. If u want to be ignorant and think our world cup win has nothing to do with Dhoni's captaincy and his captaincy is just fluke then just carry on being fooling yourself.Frankly I had enough of this debate.

[CG]

Most times when we lost to Aus in finals apart from WC final they usually played weakened side.Yet we didnt even put up a fight.Heck we even choked against Newzealand in CT final.And not all 11 finals were against Australia either. 2.Yet record shows Sachin only struggled to perform under the captaincy of Ganguly.Perhaps Ganguly put too much pressure on players during final so that we choked when it comes to finals. 3.Sreesanth RP Singh and Ishant are better bowlers than Agarkar Zaheer(who canbowl 145K) Nehra at his fastest and Srinath? Look i consider Ganguly as great a captain as Dhoni as i already said earlier in this thread.All i was trying to point out was that Ganguly has as many faults as Dhoni if not more.We consider both of them as greats for what have achieved with us not for their failures. If u want to be ignorant and think our world cup win has nothing to do with Dhoni's captaincy and his captaincy is just fluke then just carry on being fooling yourself.Frankly I had enough of this debate.

1.Ganguly did win the natwest series and icc champions trophy finals ,What has dhoni won a cb series final and world cup final and world t20?Dhoni also has had fair share of losses in finals, Also tests is captains are judged and dhoni with a much better team had lost 6 away test and may make it 8 in a row. 2.:hysterical::hysterical::hysterical: 3.Srinath was ending and zak was nowhere as good as he was and nehra was as bad a today, Overall taking both tests and odis rp sing,sreesanth,ishant have won us more matches than those particularly tests. what decisons did not dhoni take to win us the world cup?can you please enlighten he shockingly backed piyush chawla over ashwin.It was a feat as we won the world cup even though he was captain.I also admired dhoni captaincy in the begining ,he was aggressive and took risks like the 8-1 field agianst australia at nagpur,But now he seems laid back and if you cannot see the problem after so many losses you are one fooling yourself.

[Shunya]

1.Ganguly did win the natwest series and icc champions trophy finals ' date=What has dhoni won a cb series final and world cup final and world t20?Dhoni also has had fair share of losses in finals, Also tests is captains are judged and dhoni with a much better team had lost 6 away test and may make it 8 in a row. 2.:hysterical::hysterical::hysterical: 3.Srinath was ending and zak was nowhere as good as he was and nehra was as bad a today, Overall taking both tests and odis rp sing,sreesanth,ishant have won us more matches than those particularly tests. what decisons did not dhoni take to win us the world cup?can you please enlighten he shockingly backed piyush chawla over ashwin.It was a feat as we won the world cup even though he was captain.I also admired dhoni captaincy in the begining ,he was aggressive and took risks like the 8-1 field agianst australia at nagpur,But now he seems laid back and if you cannot see the problem after so many losses you are one fooling yourself.

ROFL @ what has Dhone won? a cb series final, a world cup final and a t20 final (Dats it !!!) bas karo yaar...kitna mazaak banayega...:sigh:

[CG]

ROFL @ what has Dhone won? a cb series final, a world cup final and a t20 final (Dats it !!!) bas karo yaar...kitna mazaak banayega...:sigh:

The point is dhoni also has lost many finals and where was his motivational ability as bg was saying in those games.