Joe Dawes An introduction to Indian bowling talent

[MCcricket]

Well I am not sure of you ever having been to ICF, BUT IT IS A GOOD PLACE TO BE , to find out what is happening and also for an insight into our cricket. Iam impressed with the initial remarks made by you, as India's problem being untapped talent, bad selections, injury management , also someone to polish our new gen tearaways and make em into world beaters. We have a bunch of express bowlers for the first time who need immidiate attention and someone to take them under their wings, Rahul Shukla,Varun Aaron, Umesh Yadav, Ishant Sharma all can bowl high 140's to 150"s, all have played domestic cricket , still a bit raw , but perfect for moulding into world class attack. Most talented bowlers in domestic cricket , who look a class above most and have the potential to succeed at international level, Manpreet Gony he is about 6 5" tall, good action, gets bounce, seam, strong bowler, can be a good test and odi bet, can bowl 136 to 146 k"s. Anwar Ahmed he is about 6 5 " or more left handed , good action , has pace,bounce aggression, can be our strike bowler for test's and awkward customer in ODI'S, FIRST DOMESTIC SEASON , IS 25 YEAR OLD SO NEEEDS TO BE IMMIDIATELY LOOKED AT, he too me is the most promising bowler I have sen for a while , has pace to hurry the batsmen. Sudeep Tyagi burst into the domestic scene four years back and took loads of wickets, single handedly winning games for his side, also tall at 6 3", good high action, not managed well, had injuries on and off, has pace and bounce, seams the ball, bowls in 140"s when fit. Ashok Dinda has been the bowler knocking hard to be selected for the Indian team and unfairly kept out, on the shorter side, has a unique action with a huge jump , skiddy bowler with skills to match, seams , swings , great trier, per Ganguly the best bowler in India OUTSIDE THE TEAM, can bowl 135 to 145 k's. Abu Nechim Ahmed, is a wiry built youngster, who has a slingy quick arm delivery, bowls in 140's, good at bowling yorkers, swings the ball and can be a good ODI player to begin with, has been in devastating form this year, skiddy , and his slingy action gives him a good advantage. Shami Ahmed is in the Sreesanth mould , can bowl in 140"s , very good seam position, can swing, seam, good rhythmic action,bowls genuine wicket taking balls, per Akram one of the most talented young bowlers in India, his first domestic season, he can build more pace, and add more to his bowling and can be deadly. Pawan Suyal is a left hander with very good domestic record, is nippy, also said to be very promising. Pankaj Singh about 6 5' to 6 6' , needs some work on his action, fitness, is most consistent and complete bowler in domestic circle, needs to up his pace by 5 k's, bowl around 130's, has skills to seam , and his height and fuller length can be an asset. Players who need most help, Sreesanth , Vrv Singh, Mithun,need most work on their actions, fitness,attitude, all of them started as bowlers with pace and lost their way a bit after playing international cricket, at their best Sreesanth , VRV could be good for India as they have experience and have bowled some fine spells , but need most work, fitness, action, atitude wise. Wildcards Kamran Khan , left hander , slinger, bowls in 140's, has uniqueness like Malinga can be good in ODI'S, T20'S, if groomed. Prasanth Parmeswaram good action , bowls in 140's, left hander, has some potential,has played a season for Kerala. ICF will also provide u info on untapped talent like Rehan Khan , Abhishek Tamark, who could be the next big thing. For any expert advice we have our inhouse bowling experts ,Sabby, Chainsmoker , oblige and fill u in about any bowling talent, skills, :--D and RKT, apologies for the ones I have missed.:icflove: Indian selectors and team management have been ignorant in identifying and selecting bowling talent, that has been the bane for us not the lack of talent.:two_thumbs_up: India has 2 years before they go on a tour outside the sub continent, I want u to provide us a bowling unit, that can dismantle and put fear in any team, and have ready replacements for the injured players.

[Old guy]

sad part is.. i odnt htink none of this bowlers would tour south africa they will probably try to push in mithun and co again yadav might be injured by then lol

[MCcricket]

sad part is.. i odnt htink none of this bowlers would tour south africa they will probably try to push in mithun and co again yadav might be injured by then lol

With the change in capt and different teams for different formats, different slectors, Things will be better, I think we have the talent in bowling and batting to be world beaters, now it is upto BCCI, COACHES SELECTORS TO FORGE A WAY , Dhoni's captaincy, cheekas panel has done too much damage along with this selection , retirement, 100 th 100 business.:mama::mama:

[Old guy]

bro... with our population and love of cricket do u really think talent is the problem ? main problem is the thingsu stated are they changing ? i dont think so .. im not even sure aaron will be selected for asia cup forget shami in next 2 years!

[MCcricket]

bro... with our population and love of cricket do u really think talent is the problem ? main problem is the thingsu stated are they changing ? i dont think so .. im not even sure aaron will be selected for asia cup forget shami in next 2 years!

Yes I see, Aaron, Gony, Dinda, Shami , Anwar Ahmed, Abu Nechim , Suyal playing for India , RP , VK, Mithun in test's hope the mistake never happens again.Serious thinking is required as I feel Zaheer doesn't have much time, he should be played more in test's, Umesh, Aaron, Ishant, Gony, Dinda, Shami , should be the core with Munaf, Irfan as seniors

[Old guy]

Yes I see' date=' Aaron, Gony, Dinda, Shami , Anwar Ahmed, Abu Nechim , Suyal playing for India , RP , VK, Mithun in test's hope the mistake never happens again.Serious thinking is required as I feel Zaheer doesn't have much time, he should be played more in test's, Umesh, Aaron, Ishant, Gony, Dinda, Shami , should be the core with Munaf, Irfan as seniors[/quote'] thats wht any sane team management would do but this is india we are talking about :haha:

[MCcricket]

Most of us who love real cricket and love to hate IPL, one thing it does is gives exposure to young cricketers, as our domestic cricketers rarely get enough coverage in media or on print as well as non existent telecast of domestic games.Joe Dawes being the bowling coach of an ipl franchise will give him an opportunity to see talent , hopefully, Gony, Tyagi, Nechim, Shukla, Shami, Suyal MIGHT GET HIS ATTENTION. Too bad for VRV Singh, P Parmeswaran, A Ahmed as they wont be playing in this IPL, I especially hope to see some good performances by Gony, Aaron, Umesh, , Shami, hopefully he and the team management will take a pro active approach and look for some real bowlers not the embarrassing army of trundlers we have been playing recently. Have read a very good article recently of how the Paki coach Dav is watching and monitoring scouting for raw talent in Pakistan, hoping to groom and find some real talent, we never had an approach like that kind here, surely we can do a lot better then these trundlers we are seeing playing for India.

[Lord]

hes even more hopeless than Eric Simmons.not having too many expectations

[1983-2011]

Shami Ahmed because he's likely to play more matches in IPL with KKR than other 3 mentioned so he will be seen by many on the TV hence he will recieve more media coverage

[Ultimate_Game]

Enough about these upcoming fast bowlers. Whichever so called fast bowler I have seen on intl scene they have disappointed big time with neither pace, movement, control or vareity. Our demon fast bowlers suddenly become 120 kph trundlers on intl scene and I seriously doubt the credibility of speed measurements at domestic level. The only 2 fast bowlers with potential in the last 6 years have been Ishant and Umesh and that's about it. Ishant is already on the verge of frittering away his talent by not improving, and in fact regressing, since he made his debut 5-6 years ago and Umesh has potential but needs to improve a lot, especially in terms of consistent line & length and control.

[chainsmoker1985]

Shami Ahmed is the hottest property in domestic cricket at the moment(apart from Dinda who has already made his way to the Indian team)... Shami has picked a lot of wickets this season. Plus, KKR will give him enough chances to play(I hope so), so it will be really exciting to watch.

[chainsmoker1985]

BTW, on topic, I am sure, Joe Dawes wont be disappointed at all with the upcoming talent from India. It will be interesting to see, how they will progress from here. Joe Dawes has so many exciting fast bowlers to work with, which I think is happening for the first time. Likes of Yadav, Ishant, Aaron, Nechim, Shami Ahmed, Rahul Shukla, Gony, Tyagi, so many bowlers to pick from and groom them. Ideal time for Dawes to be a bowling coach of India

[Ultimate_Game]

Shami Ahmed is the hottest property in domestic cricket at the moment(apart from Dinda who has already made his way to the Indian team)... Shami has picked a lot of wickets this season. Plus, KKR will give him enough chances to play(I hope so), so it will be really exciting to watch.

And that is exactly the point I made. We heard so much about how great Dinda was and what a great injustice it was to keep him out of the team, and when hhe got a game against B'desh we all saw what he did :facepalm: The guy is nowhere near intl class and in fact makes Vinay Kumar look much better if such a thing is possible. Dinda played a series against Zim and then against B'desh and I didn't see any improvement in him at all. He is cannon fodder against better teams and frankly I would rather play an extra batsman if bowlers like Dinda is all that we have.

[msb1991]

And that is exactly the point I made. We heard so much about how great Dinda was and what a great injustice it was to keep him out of the team' date=' and when hhe got a game against B'desh we all saw what he did :facepalm: The guy is nowhere near intl class and in fact makes Vinay Kumar look much better if such a thing is possible. Dinda played a series against Zim and then against B'desh and I didn't see any improvement in him at all. He is cannon fodder against better teams and frankly I would rather play an extra batsman if bowlers like Dinda is all that we have.[/quote'] Dinda proved himself in a different format of the game; with different length spells, a different ball and different mentality altogether. His performances were worthy of Test consideration, not ODI consideration.

[Ultimate_Game]

Dinda proved himself in a different format of the game; with different length spells' date=' a different ball and different mentality altogether. His performances were worthy of Test consideration, not ODI consideration.[/quote'] But I didn't see anyting at all which would point to him being so successful in Tests either :dontknow: They guy was a trundler pure and simple who bowled up and down with no vareity if you exclude his "jump" in his bowling stride. If he could somehow translate the energy & effort he puts in his jump before he bowls in the actual delivery of the ball itself, he would add at least a couple of yards in pace.

[msb1991]

But I didn't see anyting at all which would point to him being so successful in Tests either :dontknow: They guy was a trundler pure and simple who bowled up and down with no vareity if you exclude his "jump" in his bowling stride. If he could somehow translate the energy & effort he puts in his jump before he bowls in the actual delivery of the ball itself, he would add at least a couple of yards in pace.

He's got a good bouncer and he pitches the ball up. He will get the edge eventually with a well maintained red ball. Also, it is not the job of the viewer or selector to see things that would point to him being successful in Tests. He has performed in First Class cricket. However he has done it, by hook or crook, he should be given a chance to try out similar skills on the Test stage. Skills which gain him First Class wickets, e.g. bowling a good length consistently (/predictably), may get one smashed in an ODI game.

[Ultimate_Game]

He's got a good bouncer and he pitches the ball up. He will get the edge eventually with a well maintained red ball. Also, it is not the job of the viewer or selector to see things that would point to him being successful in Tests. He has performed in First Class cricket. However he has done it, by hook or crook, he should be given a chance to try out similar skills on the Test stage. Skills which gain him First Class wickets, e.g. bowling a good length consistently (/predictably), may get one smashed in an ODI game.

Against quality batsmen I don't see him possessing any skills which will make him successful. Getting hit and taken for runs is one thing. Even likes of Pattinson and Umesh have been hit around in odis. But you can see potential in Umesh and Pattinson. They have pace and will bowl a delivery that makes you sit up and take notice. With Dinda there's nothing. He runs up, jumps and bowls at a friendly pace. We already have enough who do the same in PK, Vinay, Irfan etc. Why add to the sorry list?

[rkt.india]

Against quality batsmen I don't see him possessing any skills which will make him successful. Getting hit and taken for runs is one thing. Even likes of Pattinson and Umesh have been hit around in odis. But you can see potential in Umesh and Pattinson. They have pace and will bowl a delivery that makes you sit up and take notice. With Dinda there's nothing. He runs up' date=' jumps and bowls at a friendly pace. We already have enough who do the same in PK, Vinay, Irfan etc. Why add to the sorry list?[/quote'] Dinda, another Indian fast bowler, who suffers from flaws in his bowling approach, like Mithun and Aaron suffers, though Mithun is the worst case, but Dinda is not far too. Aaron is the best of the three. Dinda has the best runup of most Indian fast bowlers after Ishant Sharma and Sudeep Tyagi, but that runup does not help him as he takes a high leap while delivering the ball. This affects his momentum forward and accuracy as well. As a result, he loses pace and be wayward as well. The only thing it helps him is it makes his balls skid a bit and he can make batsmen hurry by his bouncers as he puts a lot of shoulder behind the ball as he lands after the upward leap.

[chainsmoker1985]

And that is exactly the point I made. We heard so much about how great Dinda was and what a great injustice it was to keep him out of the team' date=' and when hhe got a game against B'desh we all saw what he did :facepalm: The guy is nowhere near intl class and in fact makes Vinay Kumar look much better if such a thing is possible. Dinda played a series against Zim and then against B'desh and I didn't see any improvement in him at all. He is cannon fodder against better teams and frankly I would rather play an extra batsman if bowlers like Dinda is all that we have.[/quote'] Should give some more matches to Dinda before coming to a conclusion about him. Even I didn't like his approach in the first matches and even in the second match, he was way below par. And this is the thing which I don't like about many Indian bowlers, when you r given opportunity, just give it all, show lot more energy then you have. The positive energy can be seen in a bowler and that excites people to watch that bowler. If a bowler is low on energy and bowling within himself, then most of times it looks boring. But,I have seen Dinda bowling 140+ yorkers and bouncers. He has a very good yorker. He can bowl good bouncers too. We should watch him in this IPL, and it will give us a good idea about his ability.

[Ultimate_Game]

Should give some more matches to Dinda before coming to a conclusion about him. Even I didn't like his approach in the first matches and even in the second match, he was way below par. And this is the thing which I don't like about many Indian bowlers, when you r given opportunity, just give it all, show lot more energy then you have. The positive energy can be seen in a bowler and that excites people to watch that bowler. If a bowler is low on energy and bowling within himself, then most of times it looks boring. But,I have seen Dinda bowling 140+ yorkers and bouncers. He has a very good yorker. He can bowl good bouncers too. We should watch him in this IPL, and it will give us a good idea about his ability.

I don't know where you saw the same :dontknow: I saw Dinda against Zim in that tri-series in Zim and also in Asia Cup and all I can say is he was cr@p against Zim and hadn't improved one bit in Asia Cup. He was lucky to get away against Pakis who somehow couldn't put his friendly full-tosses away. If you freeze against the likes of Zimboks and Bangbros, intl cricket is not for you and I am sorry, I have seen enough of Dinda. The guy is just another trundler and I have no idea how he managed to take wkts at domestic level based on what I've seen of him at intl level.