anotherhawkeye Posted December 31, 2012 Posted December 31, 2012 I see two kind of people in the thread. In one side, we have the idealists, who thinks the government and the society in general should 'fix' the issue to prevent rapes. These idealists are fed up with the system, and rightfully so. In another side, we have the realists, who puts the onus on the individual to prevent such crimes and don't want to wait for the society at large to change. They want the women to exercise common sense, because it is what it is and the women should ensure that they don't become a statistic while the society changes slowly. Both are right in their own way, but idealists think the realists are utterly wrong. They ask 'how dare you tell women to not go out in the night, by themselves, without any personal transportation?'. My question to idealists (say, beetle) would be: if you have a daughter in her twenties in Delhi or Mumbai, living with friends, what would you advise them, if any? Would you tell them to do what they want and blame the government if something goes wrong? Or would you tell them to be careful; arm themselves (pepper spray, not gun) to protect if anything bad happens; use personal or prearranged transport when out at night; be with friends when possible?
Cevno Posted December 31, 2012 Posted December 31, 2012 You are taking the debate to extremes here. Obviously going without transportation in middle of the night is stupid. Hell, it's stupid for even boys. And even in many parts of USA. But this girl wasn't exactly alone without transportation in the middle of the night though. She was with a boy and that too at 9:30 which is a fair time.
Cevno Posted December 31, 2012 Posted December 31, 2012 I was saying this for years now. Instead taking responsibility and accepting the truth, we keep saying that more security, more check ups stricter laws, death penalty etc. Would a death penalty stop men from misbehaving with women? absolutely no. They know they can get away with this easily. Rape happens not bcoz of sexual starvation, its becoz they want to dominate and show their superiority on women. How we gonna stop this? The well advanced country like America has the highest number of rape victims. Our culture was a great one before these feminists started believing themselves that they are equal to men. They started thinking that they can roam freely in nights, they can wear whatever they want... Practically its not possible in our society which has a chalta hai attitude. Especially in our culture where a hero in movie keeps on staking a women till she accepts her love. In western culture he would be called as a psycho. But here he is shown as a hero. Indian men idolizes their hero and keep stalking women an think themselves as movie stars. Its women's responsibility from getting away from these fools. If women also keep thinking herself as a movie heroine and wear dresses of their favorite heroines and movie stars, then, heroes are gonna come and stalk u. This is the fact. lol Kidding, right ? Or you don't want Hollywood movies. Probably the weirdest post in the thread so far. Apologies but it Shows a wrong mindset, loser attitude and no idea of the problem or solutions in equal measure.
ganeshran Posted December 31, 2012 Posted December 31, 2012 I see two kind of people in the thread. In one side, we have the idealists, who thinks the government and the society in general should 'fix' the issue to prevent rapes. These idealists are fed up with the system, and rightfully so. In another side, we have the realists, who puts the onus on the individual to prevent such crimes and don't want to wait for the society at large to change. They want the women to exercise common sense, because it is what it is and the women should ensure that they don't become a statistic while the society changes slowly. Both are right in their own way, but idealists think the realists are utterly wrong. They ask 'how dare you tell women to not go out in the night, by themselves, without any personal transportation?'. My question to idealists (say, beetle) would be: if you have a daughter in her twenties in Delhi or Mumbai, living with friends, what would you advise them, if any? Would you tell them to do what they want and blame the government if something goes wrong? Or would you tell them to be careful; arm themselves (pepper spray, not gun) to protect if anything bad happens; use personal or prearranged transport when out at night; be with friends when possible? In which bucket would you put people who blame the way women are dressed?
Cevno Posted December 31, 2012 Posted December 31, 2012 I see two kind of people in the thread. In one side, we have the idealists, who thinks the government and the society in general should 'fix' the issue to prevent rapes. These idealists are fed up with the system, and rightfully so. In another side, we have the realists, who puts the onus on the individual to prevent such crimes and don't want to wait for the society at large to change. They want the women to exercise common sense, because it is what it is and the women should ensure that they don't become a statistic while the society changes slowly. Both are right in their own way, but idealists think the realists are utterly wrong. They ask 'how dare you tell women to not go out in the night, by themselves, without any personal transportation?'. My question to idealists (say, beetle) would be: if you have a daughter in her twenties in Delhi or Mumbai, living with friends, what would you advise them, if any? Would you tell them to do what they want and blame the government if something goes wrong? Or would you tell them to be careful; arm themselves (pepper spray, not gun) to protect if anything bad happens; use personal or prearranged transport when out at night; be with friends when possible? It's possible to be both a idealist and a realist. It's not a either/or situation. Take as many precautions as you can, but don't let that stop you from doing what you want too. Hell, i would advise even a boy to arrange a transport if possible, but that's very different to telling her to cover up, or quit a job where her co workers are mostly boys.
daryl1985 Posted December 31, 2012 Posted December 31, 2012 RIP to the poor girl. This tragedy has made news worldwide. Some Welsh guy i know posted a photo of the girl (one normal pic of her and one of her in hospital - not sure if fake) on facebook, the link also explained the story of what happened to her.
vvvslaxman Posted January 1, 2013 Posted January 1, 2013 RIP to the poor girl. This tragedy has made news worldwide. Some Welsh guy i know posted a photo of the girl (one normal pic of her and one of her in hospital - not sure if fake) on facebook, the link also explained the story of what happened to her. Wall street Journal front page news .
beetle Posted January 1, 2013 Posted January 1, 2013 I was saying this for years now. Instead taking responsibility and accepting the truth' date=' we keep saying that more security, more check ups stricter laws, death penalty etc. Would a death penalty stop men from misbehaving with women? absolutely no. They know they can get away with this easily. Rape happens not bcoz of sexual starvation, its becoz they want to dominate and show their superiority on women. How we gonna stop this? The well advanced country like America has the highest number of rape victims. [b']Our culture was a great one before these feminists started believing themselves that they are equal to men. They started thinking that they can roam freely in nights, they can wear whatever they want... Practically its not possible in our society which has a chalta hai attitude. Especially in our culture where a hero in movie keeps on staking a women till she accepts her love. In western culture he would be called as a psycho. But here he is shown as a hero. Indian men idolizes their hero and keep stalking women an think themselves as movie stars. Its women's responsibility from getting away from these fools. If women also keep thinking herself as a movie heroine and wear dresses of their favorite heroines and movie stars, then, heroes are gonna come and stalk u. This is the fact. lol Look at the newspapers and TV.Do you think Indian men have started raping women in their families because of western influence.Neighbors ,teachers,friends...all of them are only doing this now. These things have been happening for ever.There is one major difference now. Earlier when a girl got gang raped and had her organs pulled out the Indian thing to do was to pray for her death before anyone came to know about the shame that was brought on the family. Now the parents and her brothers beg the doctors to somehow save her life because they see a life for her. Is this the western influence these feminists have brought to our great culture.
Ram Posted January 1, 2013 Posted January 1, 2013 I was saying this for years now. Instead taking responsibility and accepting the truth' date=' we keep saying that more security, more check ups stricter laws, death penalty etc. Would a death penalty stop men from misbehaving with women? absolutely no. They know they can get away with this easily. Rape happens not bcoz of sexual starvation, its becoz they want to dominate and show their superiority on women. How we gonna stop this? The well advanced country like America has the highest number of rape victims.[b'] Our culture was a great one before these feminists started believing themselves that they are equal to men. They started thinking that they can roam freely in nights, they can wear whatever they want... Practically its not possible in our society which has a chalta hai attitude. Especially in our culture where a hero in movie keeps on staking a women till she accepts her love. In western culture he would be called as a psycho. But here he is shown as a hero. Indian men idolizes their hero and keep stalking women an think themselves as movie stars. Its women's responsibility from getting away from these fools. If women also keep thinking herself as a movie heroine and wear dresses of their favorite heroines and movie stars, then, heroes are gonna come and stalk u. This is the fact. lol Yes, Sati, female infanticide, forcible child marriage of minor girls to older men, Often marrying rape victims to the rapist themselves are all glorious examples of a culture that has always treated women with respect and dignity! :nice:
beetle Posted January 1, 2013 Posted January 1, 2013 I see two kind of people in the thread. In one side, we have the idealists, who thinks the government and the society in general should 'fix' the issue to prevent rapes. These idealists are fed up with the system, and rightfully so. In another side, we have the realists, who puts the onus on the individual to prevent such crimes and don't want to wait for the society at large to change. They want the women to exercise common sense, because it is what it is and the women should ensure that they don't become a statistic while the society changes slowly. Both are right in their own way, but idealists think the realists are utterly wrong. They ask 'how dare you tell women to not go out in the night, by themselves, without any personal transportation?'. My question to idealists (say, beetle) would be: if you have a daughter in her twenties in Delhi or Mumbai, living with friends, what would you advise them, if any? Would you tell them to do what they want and blame the government if something goes wrong? Or would you tell them to be careful; arm themselves (pepper spray, not gun) to protect if anything bad happens; use personal or prearranged transport when out at night; be with friends when possible? I don't go out in the dark alone . I always carry a pepper spray and a swiss knife in my handbag.I keep my car windows up all the time ,Keep a big spanner under the seat where I can reach it quickly as a weapon. My husband has taught me a few attack moves to kill if attacked. That is the life of a woman in our great country.And I don't even have to travel by buses and trains because I am a stay at home mom now.I shudder when I see women in crowded buses or the ones who have to travel alone at night. My daughter is only 4yrs old and I don't leave her alone with any one other than her dad.I don't even send her to the neighbor's place. I hope this country becomes a better place as she grows .If it doesn't...then I will try and do my best to send her to a safer place. There are no guarantees in life but I would like her to have better odds than what our country offer her. If that is not possible then I will pray that some lunatic nukes the hell out of this part of the world.
1983-2011 Posted January 1, 2013 Posted January 1, 2013 has her identity been revealed because some outlets are naming Amanat while others are using Damini?
Dumbbells Posted January 1, 2013 Posted January 1, 2013 Kidding, right ? Or you don't want Hollywood movies. Probably the weirdest post in the thread so far. Apologies but it Shows a wrong mindset, loser attitude and no idea of the problem or solutions in equal measure. What are u talking abt dude? In bollywood movies, heroes, keep on stalking a girl till she accepts him. He keeps on pinching, kissing, slapping her back and they show that this is kinda funny and the try to show that the girl has secret love for him. This is WHAT our boys try to replicate in real life, they don't take no as an answer. They keep on following her, when she finally rejects him, they get very angry and even goes to the level of throwing acid on her face. In western cultures, or a hollywood movies u would never see that. u know wat is disturbing here? even girls starting behave like bollywood heroines. They try to replicate their dress, attitude, and its kinda fake and irritating at times. If girls are trying to dress like movies stars, the so called heroes would stalk. Its up to u to accept this.
Dumbbells Posted January 1, 2013 Posted January 1, 2013 Look at the newspapers and TV.Do you think Indian men have started raping women in their families because of western influence.Neighbors ,teachers,friends...all of them are only doing this now. These things have been happening for ever.There is one major difference now. Earlier when a girl got gang raped and had her organs pulled out the Indian thing to do was to pray for her death before anyone came to know about the shame that was brought on the family. Now the parents and her brothers beg the doctors to somehow save her life because they see a life for her. Is this the western influence these feminists have brought to our great culture. I agree to ur second point but y don't u tell me y a great western country like America has highest number of rape victims and crime rates in the world? Don't start the crap like its reported and its not reported here etc. Its becoz of alcohol and the way they dress.
Dumbbells Posted January 1, 2013 Posted January 1, 2013 Yes' date=' [i']Sati, female infanticide, forcible child marriage of minor girls to older men, Often marrying rape victims to the rapist themselves are all glorious examples of a culture that has always treated women with respect and dignity! :nice: Female infanticide is nothing to do with culture. Its due to poverty. Sati happened only with Rajputs in Rajastan. Not with everyone. Foricible child marriage was forced on men too.. This is nothing to do with women. Even in western countries, women got the right to vote very late. Don't talk as if India was the only country which had double standards.
Ram Posted January 1, 2013 Posted January 1, 2013 Female infanticide is nothing to do with culture. Its due to poverty. Sati happened only with Rajputs in Rajastan. Not with everyone. Foricible child marriage with men too.. This is nothing to do with women. Even in western countries, women got the right to vote very late. Don't talk as if India was the only one who did it. I am not even going to bother responding to your disingenuous points, but let me just state this - For you to even imply that all was fine and dandy with women in India until the the so-called-feminists came in and screwed it for all is beyond hilarious. As a country/culture, our record on women's rights is shameful. We live in an overwhelmingly male dominated society that is characterized by utter disregard for women's emancipation. I know it, coz I have seen it myself, first hand.
punjabi_khota Posted January 1, 2013 Posted January 1, 2013 I agree to ur second point but y don't u tell me a great western country like America has highest number of rape victims and crime rates in the world? Don't start the crap like its reported and its not reported here etc. Its becoz of alcohol and the way they dress. Abbe chutiye, what about Europe. Most countries in Europe dress more 'scantily' and drink more than Americans. Japanese girls wear super short dresses ALL the time and men drink like ****ing maniacs. Apni g@@nd mein lele apni ghatiya theory.
1983-2011 Posted January 1, 2013 Posted January 1, 2013 Shashi Tharoor @ShashiTharoor Wondering what interest is served by continuing anonymity of #DelhGangRape victim. Why not name&honour her as a real person w/own identity? Expand Reply Retweet Favorite Shashi Tharoor @ShashiTharoor Unless her parents object,she should be honoured&the revised anti-rape law named after her. She was a human being w/a name,not just a symbol Expand Reply Retweet Favorite Shashi Tharoor @ShashiTharoor I stated v.clearly "unless parents object". They might not. Does no one remember Geeta Chopra Award 4aBraveheart raped&killed decades ago? Expand Reply Retweet Favorite Shashi Tharoor @ShashiTharoor There's so much disinformation going around now. Purported pix of the victim on social media are apparently of a Kerala engineering student! Expand Reply Retweet Favorite http://twitter.com/ShashiTharoor
Desi Cartman Posted January 1, 2013 Posted January 1, 2013 17-year-old raped by two in Delhi on December 31 night NEW DELHI: Just hours before Nirbhaya's ashes were immersed in the Ganga, a 17-year-old girl studying in class XI of a prominent south Delhi school was allegedly sedated and raped by two men at a New Year's party in the upscale Safdarjung Enclave area of south Delhi, police sources told TOI on Tuesday. The two accused, who work in leading IT companies, were arrested late at night after the girl approached the police. They live in Sarojini Nagar with their families. Both are in their late 20s. While one is a computer engineer with an IT company, the other works in the HR department of a blue-chip tech and consulting multinational, an officer said. The accused were produced in Saket court on Tuesday afternoon and later sent to Tihar jail. The whole operation was kept under wraps by the police. TOI attempted to call senior police officers to confirm the report and also sent text messages but got no response. Sources in Delhi Police revealed that the girl had said in her statement that one of the accused had befriended her on a social networking site a few months ago. The accused had expressed his wish to meet the victim several times and use to chat with her online. On New Year's Eve, the accused convinced the girl to meet at a south Delhi market after which he coaxed her to accompany him in his car to an undisclosed location. As per the girl`s statement, the accused gave her a drink which was laced with a heavy dose of sedatives after which she began to feel dizzy. The girl alleged that the accused then took turns to rape her inside the flat and then left her alone. They even threatened her with dire consequences if she disclosed the incident to anyone. However, the girl managed to flee from their clutches after the accused left her alone and went out. She rushed to Safdarjung Enclave police station after taking an auto and reported the incident to the cops. The stunned cops immediately formed six teams and dispatched them to various locations on the basis of the information provided by the victim. The operation was supervised by the joint commissioner of police southern range, Vivek Gogia and DCP south Chhaya Sharma, the source said. The raiding teams were being led by additional DCP south P S Kushwah. Meanwhile, the girl`s medical examination was conducted at Safdarjung Hospital which confirmed rape, a source said. The girl was provided with medical help and counseling and a case of outraging a woman`s modesty and criminal intimidation was registered on the basis of her statement. The call records of the victim helped cops get the location of the accused and one of the teams nabbed the two and placed them under arrest. During interrogation, the accused accepted their involvement before the police and confessed to having lured the girl on pretext of meeting on New Years Eve, police said. The girl made a stupid decision and parents need to teach their kids to be careful about these things but crime is a crime. Im glad that the girl went to the police and the cops have arrested her. Few quick convictions and people will think few times before committing these kind of crimes
Dumbbells Posted January 1, 2013 Posted January 1, 2013 Abbe chutiye, what about Europe. Most countries in Europe dress more 'scantily' and drink more than Americans. Japanese girls wear super short dresses ALL the time and men drink like ****ing maniacs. Apni g@@nd mein lele apni ghatiya theory. Abbe chutiye. What about America which has 300 million population and has highest number of rape crimes compared with India? u r talking as if Alcohol and dressing like ***** does not incite human beings to commit mistakes...u can get sex easily in western countries and men are less sex starving but still rapes are happening there.. Here men get sex very late, and they are bound to get sex starved. Hence, its up to women to stay away from these sex maniacs. Keep ur *****u theory with urself. Look at the story posted above by Desi cartman. The guys made her drink and raped her. "Sources in Delhi Police revealed that the girl had said in her statement that one of the accused had befriended her on a social networking site a few months ago. The accused had expressed his wish to meet the victim several times and use to chat with her online. On New Year's Eve, the accused convinced the girl to meet at a south Delhi market after which he coaxed her to accompany him in his car to an undisclosed location. As per the girl`s statement, the accused gave her a drink which was laced with a heavy dose of sedatives after which she began to feel dizzy. The girl alleged that the accused then took turns to rape her inside the flat and then left her alone. They even threatened her with dire consequences if she disclosed the incident to anyone. " This was what i was talking abt...U ******* who has his mind up on ur ass would not want to believe this.
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