Is Sachin a greater test batsmen or ODI batsmen?

[Sachin=GOD]

:asleep: :asleep:

[Lord]

Arre ton banane ko kaun keh raha hai? 50-60 run to bana lo ki that is also impossible while chasing? In the match where he scored 5, he effected 3 run outs of top order batsmen. His fielding in that match is considered legendary. In the match he scored 33, it was the second highest score of the match and the highest from his team.

that 33 was chasing a paltry 180 n still he couldnt finish the job.I would call that a choke too.his fielding exploits were never in doubt.

[The Outsider]

that 33 was chasing a paltry 180 n still he couldnt finish the job.I would call that a choke too.his fielding exploits were never in doubt.

So when did Tendulkar top score for his side and had almost the highest score in a World Cup final? If top scoring for your side and almost having the highest score in the match is a choke I am lost for words to describe Tendulkar's performance. Even those 33 runs are more than what Tendulkar has scored in two attempts combined.

[harmuk]

no i was just upset with that guy's comments over sachin he was so undermining his achievements and to say gilchrist is better is a bit OTT. but i didn really mean what i posted there.

Do not rant. I was not undermining Sachin's acheivements. I called him the greatest accumulator in the history of the ODI's, which does not mean he is the best One day bat ever, which I distinguished and clearly spelt out my reasons. If anything you are the one doing that calling players like Gilly 'cowlashers' and undermining them despite him being more feared and changed the course of a game in a few overs many a time, in a format where S/R is as important as averages and total numbers of runs. May be you need to change your handle from 'just a fan' to 'just a Tendulkar fan', the way you are going about it.

[Lord]

So when did Tendulkar top score for his side and had almost the highest score in a World Cup final? If top scoring for your side and almost having the highest score in the match is a choke I am lost for words to describe Tendulkar's performance. Even those 33 runs are more than what Tendulkar has scored in two attempts combined.

Its all about context.Tendulkar had things stacked up against him chasing big scores,once against a top bowling attack. Viv on the other hand had things going for him chasing a low 183 against a decent at best attack.Still he couldnt finish it off.A choke to me is when you throw away a winning position,not when you are already behind in the game

[The Outsider]

Its all about context.Tendulkar had things stacked up against him chasing big scores,once against a top bowling attack. Viv on the other hand had things going for him chasing a low 183 against a decent at best attack.Still he couldnt finish it off.A choke to me is when you throw away a winning position,not when you are already behind in the game

Johannesburg and Bombay were both pattas. Just because 183 has to be chased does not mean it's an easy chase without accounting for pitch and bowling conditions. In Bombay, India actually won, which means the score was very much chaseable, so what was the reason for Tendulkar failing there?

[South_Paw]

So when did Tendulkar top score for his side and had almost the highest score in a World Cup final? If top scoring for your side and almost having the highest score in the match is a choke I am lost for words to describe Tendulkar's performance. Even those 33 runs are more than what Tendulkar has scored in two attempts combined.

When almost everyone accepts performing in a away Test sereies is better than performing in a ICC tournament, why do you keep on insisting about the scores in WC finals? Is that because you dont get any other poitn other than it? Even in that measure Sachin is umpteent times greater than your Richards as he was one among the primary reasons why India even reached the finals in both the WCs.

[Jersey #10]

Bradman played all of his career against the same bowlers, fielders, grounds against england! Sachin on the other had a 100 times more variables to play for. The comparison just falls flat on it's face. LOL at those comparing Sachin with Dhoni :haha:

[harmuk]

LOL at those comparing Sachin with Dhoni :haha:

Exactly!!!!! Dhoni averages over 50 and a better S/R over a 200 game span, which Tendulkar never over a 200 game span in his career, was able to accomplish that.

[The Outsider]

When almost everyone accepts performing in a away Test sereies is better than performing in a ICC tournament' date=' why do you keep on insisting about the scores in WC finals? Is that because you dont get any other poitn other than it? Even in that measure Sachin is umpteent times greater than your Richards as he was one among the primary reasons why India even reached the finals in both the WCs.[/quote'] What relevance does performing in away tests have in the context of discussing who is better in ODIs? Aren't World Cup finals the most important matches in ODIs? Have you looked at Richards' record in other World Cup matches besides finals? If you have, how is it inferior to Tendulkar's?

[JaFanatic]

Do not rant. I was not undermining Sachin's acheivements. I called him the greatest accumulator in the history of the ODI's, which does not mean he is the best One day bat ever, which I distinguished and clearly spelt out my reasons. If anything you are the one doing that calling players like Gilly 'cowlashers' and undermining them despite him being more feared and changed the course of a game in a few overs many a time, in a format where S/R is as important as averages and total numbers of runs. May be you need to change your handle from 'just a fan' to 'just a Tendulkar fan', the way you are going about it.

so you rate a batsman mainly based on his sr ? on that basis sehwag is the greatest batsman in odis. he is more feared than gilly better sr with similar avrg

[The Outsider]

so you rate a batsman mainly based on his sr ? on that basis sehwag is the greatest batsman in odis. he is more feared than gilly better sr with similar avrg

No Afridi is the best. I got scared just mentioning his name.

[Lord]

Johannesburg and Bombay were both pattas. Just because 183 has to be chased does not mean it's an easy chase without accounting for pitch and bowling conditions. In Bombay, India actually won, which means the score was very much chaseable, so what was the reason for Tendulkar failing there?

when chasing,specially in a big match like WC finals,score is most important factor as it defines the pace of the innings.I'd take chasing 3 an over in England conditions over 6 an over at pattas anyday. Chasing 6 an over,you have to take extra risks whereas chasing 183 you just need to bat through

[JaFanatic]

No Afridi is the best. I got scared just mentioning his name.

Boom Boom :D

[The Outsider]

when chasing,specially in a big match like WC finals,score is most important factor as it defines the pace of the innings.I'd take chasing 3 an over in England conditions over 6 an over at pattas anyday. Chasing 6 an over,you have to take extra risks whereas chasing 183 you just need to bat through

You cannot ignore conditions. They are the most important aspect. In tough conditions it can be difficult to even chase 100 forget about 183. But anyhow that's your perspective though the point remains that even in two attempts combined Tendulkar could not cross the derided 33 runs. Itna kya pressure ho gaya ki he wasn't able to even get into the 20s. Sehwag scored in '03, Dravid scored in '03, Gambhir scored in '11, Dhoni scored in '11. By your pressure theory they all should have failed as well.

[harmuk]

so you rate a batsman mainly based on his sr ? on that basis sehwag is the greatest batsman in odis. he is more feared than gilly better sr with similar avrg

Read that post one more time before drawing conclusions. I know folks like would bring Afridi etc etc without any proper perspective. And for the record in my books Gilly's overall exploits and his exhilarating ways of dismantling of attacks('cowlasher' for you) many a time on the biggest of stages makes him a defining one day batsman, much like Viv almost a generation back. On that account I do not think of She-wag as imposing a ODI batsman as Gilly all things considered.

[JaFanatic]

Read that post one more time before drawing conclusions. I know folks like would bring Afridi etc etc without any proper perspective. And for the record in my books Gilly's overall exploits and his exhilarating ways of dismantling of attacks('cowlasher' for you) many a time on the biggest of stages makes him a defining one day batsman' date=' much like Viv almost a generation back. On that account I do not think of She-wag as imposing a ODI batsman as Gilly all things considered.[/quote'] thing is you exaggerated the importance of sr there you dont really need 95+ sr to be a legend in ODIS. if a batsman can have such sr with a good avrg its just a bonus. ultimately avrg matters the most in odis if you think sr is as important as avrg and amount of runs scored then BOOM BOOM is the greatest ever batsman with 7000+ runs and 110+ sr deal with it.

[carnish]

ITS about Sachin vs Sachin .. Why you guys bringing Richards, Dhoni and Sir Afridi into this???

[JaFanatic]

Here is the culprit

only odis' date='there are many better test batsmen[/quote']

[harmuk]

thing is you exaggerated the importance of sr there you dont really need 95+ sr to be a legend in ODIS. if a batsman can have such sr with a good avrg its just a bonus. ultimately avrg matters the most in odis if you think sr is as important as avrg and amount of runs scored then BOOM BOOM is the greatest ever batsman with 7000+ runs and 110+ sr deal with it.

Sure, as I said average coupled with runs and S/R are the recipe. But then Afridi does not pass muster with his average IMO. But someone like a Gilly with a 35+ avg, who can just take away a game in a few overs with some sort of a consistency (heck he even determined the fate of the WC finals couple of times with in a few overs of start of the game, demoralising the opponent with his assault, in a famed line up standing out). That is something special and makes Gilly what he is.