Attack with WHAT? The Indian bowling conundrum!!

[shortbread]

I'll start with the positive, our batting strength is impressive. A solid line up of Vijay, Pujara, Virat and Rahane. A few hit and misses like Dhawan, Dhoni and Rohit, but still a very impressive combined line up. The bowling side is on the other end of the spectrum. I AM TALKING OF A TOURING INDIAN SIDE, NOT AT HOME. The chances of this Indian bowling line up taking 10 wickets an innings on foreign soil before the rival teams score 350+ or die of boredom is as bleak as England being good in any format of cricket!! The Indian bowlers might throw the odd surprise or two but are very unlikely to repeat the feat against the same rivals the second time round. There are very few real strengths to speak of: 1. Batsmen underestimating our bowlers and play rash shots (J'burg 1st innings) 2. Reverse swing, effective but a long wait before in happens 3. Spinners proving effective on a crumbling pitch, wait till 3rd-4th innings The issue is the first possibility is too rare an occurrence. The other two possibilities prove to be too late. Waiting for the ball to reverse or pitch to play tricks give opponents enough time at the crease to make runs and be confident enough to play a long innings. Lets dissect the bowling departments: PACE: Weak link 1 Zak: Staging a comeback but is no where as effective as the old star. Looks tired especially in back to back tests and might die if attempting to play a 5 test series. Might be effective in swinging conditions. HIT OR MISS, TOO SLOW. Cant bat Ishant: No words. Cant bat Shami: Saving grace. Will improve with experience and bowl tighter. Needs to be moe effective with the new ball. HIT, QUICK. CANT bat Bhuvi: Benching him on the basis of the ODIs was too harsh, he is a young bowler who struggled to find his length in the ODIs. His early swing might have been the remedy needed with the new ball in tests. Slow but mostly effective nonetheless. Perfect variation ploy to Shami . HIT, SLOW. Cant Bat Yadav: All the prerequisites to make a perfect tear away bowler apart from the brains. Cant stitch together 3-4 tight effective overs. Is like sresanth minus the arrogance and buffoonery. MISS, FAST. Cant Bat The above grouping is not the scariest in the world. None are effective strike bowlers or very miserly ones. Also the odds are stacked up against them: - No clear leader, Zak the senior pro is struggling himself - The biggest issue, our 4 bowler Supreme court law means these guys bowl long spells, which is tiring and dangerous from an injury perspective. ALL ROUNDERS: Weak link 2 Ashwin: Doesn't play cricket outside India, MISS with ball. Can bat Jadeja: Can be effective especially on 4th-5th day, still largely unproven but an amazing fielder, HIT OR MISS with ball. Cant bat Irfan: Cant bat or bowl, Not in team SPIN Ashwin/Jadeja: As above Ohja: Maybe effective especially on 4th-5th day, still largely unproven abroad. Cant bat I really don't blame the spinners especially on foreign soil. They usually do a holding job, maybe take a few wickets and our spinners are capable of that. Solution One: 5 man attack. +ves: Balanced workload making everyone more effective. More variety=more wickets. -ves: Very very long tail. 5 down and we are f^ck£d!! SolutionTwo (PREFERRED): 2 all rounders play every game. +ves: Balanced workload making everyone more effective. Replacing a batsman with both Ashwin and Jadeja. If both can contribute a combined total of 30-35 runs its not that bad. LONG TERM: India has this fascination with pretty looking fancy cricketers. Its high time they start considering more gritty domestic players who can contribute with bat and ball, a la Robin Singh!! We need to hunt and school all rounders especially batsmen/medium pacers. We are not going to find a Kallis all of a sudden but need to induct someone with a long term view. Someone who can contribute like Paul Collingwood, Scott Styris, Abdur Razzaq.... I know these people wont set the world alight but they are effective and improve the balance of the side. Unfortunately such cricketers never catch the eyes of the selectors or the general public. They never have the headline grabbing double centuries in Ranji or the 5 wicket haul and are always sidelined. Selectors need to open their eyes and understand the teams requirements rather than simply have an orgy everytime their state player hits a straight drive!! To long a post, HAPPY NEW YEAR everyone!!

[cricketman]

I think for us to be successful we need to find a way to play both Jadeja and Ashwin every game.

[ThePhenomenal1]

we don't need ashwin and jadeja in the same test XI. personally, jadeja will do just fine as long as he learns to stay at the crease and survive 50 balls at least! Our bowlers don't need to score runs all the time but they need to know how to survive Pace department: Yadav - he will improve as he plays more. he's been benched for a while now and only had 1 game. Still he bowled well aside from that needless final over. He is a wicket taker, so even if he has figures of 3-54, i'll take it. First and foremost, we need wicket takers. BK - Can bat a bit and hang in there. Brilliant swing bowler but has cut down on pace a little and someone has messed with his bowling. Indian flat pitches have made him defensive, or some idiot has told him to focus on something else. We need him to produce the swing he had on debut and overseas. Back him, because he was our only hope a year ago in that Pak series. Aaron - keep him well, give him all 5 ODIs and let him get back into the groove. With pace and accuracy, he can get the breakthroughs. Better to return on pacy tracks. Shami - Like BK, the gem of a weak bowling attack. Needs to improve his swing because with an inswinging yorker bowled 3-4 times, he could be even more lethal. Good with new ball, old ball, against the tail etc. He's intense and steams in, that's what we want. Ishwar Pandey - Haven't seen much but has good figures, did well in SA overseas A-tour, was highest wicket taker there. Good bouncer, good action that can create pace. Good outswinger too. Then you have the bowlers who have been selected before or aren't selected or are injured like suyal, kulkarni, awana, pankaj singh, kaul, rahul shukla and others. Some deserve selection and others need some work but encouragement. Pitches need to be revamped so that they enjoy bowling fast and taking wickets. Indian pacers get whacked because of their poor lengths. Some accuracy is needed and hitting a consistent length is important at times. Then they can mix it up to take the wickets. With the above pacers you have a really good base. To be axed: Ishant - tried and tested failure. needs a coach and a barber. Zak - has shown me nothing apart from the 1st test 1st innings. one of my heroes but he won't do anything important. Better if he's a bowling coach.. Dhoni as test captain so that the young crop can be selected

[alexander]

I am approaching 40 years of age and in my time following cricket - since a little boy in Bath - India's bowling has not been strong in non Asian conditions. For a short time, Zaheer Khan was a dangerous proposition but else it's not been an illustrious history. Previously I rememer Dev's battle's with Botham well, and saw plenty of Srinath. Those are the only 3 Indian seamers worthy of the name.

[Pagalpanti]

A bit harsh on jadeja there, he got most of his wickets on day 3 and 4 in fact. Unproven yes but a bright start as far his test career is concerned. As long as he's playing as a no.8 its fine. Shouldn't be picked as an A/R.

[alexander]

His style has been effective in ODIs but I am unsure if he will trouble top test players without great variation.

[cowboysfan]

I think for us to be successful we need to find a way to play both Jadeja and Ashwin every game.

no we dont,Ashwin is a weaklink abroad,just look at Lyon on how well he bowled in australia with drift and disciplined bowling but Ashwin was beyond terrible in australia.we may have to face the facts that Ashwin is not worth it on pitches without much assistance to bowlers.

[Karan114]

Ashwin is a complete and utter joke away from home. Even at home, he has feasted on poor teams - he was utterly exposed against the English batsmen. As big a minnow basher as they come. Ironically he looks more classy and authentic as a batsman.

[shortbread]

I think for us to be successful we need to find a way to play both Jadeja and Ashwin every game.

no we dont' date='Ashwin is a weaklink abroad,just look at Lyon on how well he bowled in australia with drift and disciplined bowling but Ashwin was beyond terrible in australia.we may have to face the facts that Ashwin is not worth it on pitches without much assistance to bowlers.[/quote'] I think we should play Ashwin and Jadeja too. Playing Jadeja alone means we end up with the same issue, 4 bowlers with a huge workload. They will end up being ineffective, especially the tired pacers. We need 5 bowlers and the only short term solution is playing both Ashwin and Jadeja, anything else will weaken the batting line up. Until we find a half decent all rounder, Ashwin is the only option we have. If he can tighten the screws from one end then at least hes supporting the bowling and giving the 3 pacers some rest. The moment we find a decent all rounder drop Ashwin.

[alexander]

I would like all teams to play 5 bowlers as its the attacking style that appeals to me. Any good young guns in India? I hate that the ECB and the think tank play 4 bowlers - or have typically done so. Bowlers win test matches. You need 20 wickets.

[cowboysfan]

I think we should play Ashwin and Jadeja too. Playing Jadeja alone means we end up with the same issue, 4 bowlers with a huge workload. They will end up being ineffective, especially the tired pacers. We need 5 bowlers and the only short term solution is playing both Ashwin and Jadeja, anything else will weaken the batting line up. Until we find a half decent all rounder, Ashwin is the only option we have. If he can tighten the screws from one end then at least hes supporting the bowling and giving the 3 pacers some rest. The moment we find a decent all rounder drop Ashwin.

why pick Ashwin when he is not picking any wickets? he was outbowled by SA part timers.

[GolGappe]

we don't need ashwin and jadeja in the same test XI. personally, jadeja will do just fine as long as he learns to stay at the crease and survive 50 balls at least! .

Are we talking about 50 balls per match or per series? I can't believe someone with such pathetic technique and zero batting confidence has scored two triple centuries in India's domestic cricket. Agreed lot of flat pitch bullies have prospered in India's domestic cricket but this guy has less batting talent than Pujara's left testicle.

[Texan]

When India is bowling, instead of using the terminology "bowling attack", commentators should say "bowling to be attacked".

[shortbread]

why pick Ashwin when he is not picking any wickets? he was outbowled by SA part timers.

Hes a useless bowler abroad but which other bowler can bat especially if we need to play a 5 man attack?! Any other bowler would mean a long tail and a very weak batting side.

[I6MTW]

Are we talking about 50 balls per match or per series? I can't believe someone with such pathetic technique and zero batting confidence has scored two triple centuries in India's domestic cricket. Agreed lot of flat pitch bullies have prospered in India's domestic cricket but this guy has less batting talent than Pujara's left testicle.

He has scored 3 triple centuries.

[Gunner]

Yadav is undoubtedly our best bowler but he's always the first one to be benched lol

[express bowling]

Our picked bowlers should either be wicket taking or be fast. Wicket takers .... well they take wickets. Fast bowlers, even when they cannot take wickets, do the important job of softening up the opposition batsmen. On that count, Ishant and current Zaheer need to go. Ashwin should play only in the subcontinent. Strange that Yadav, who is both wicket taking and fast, is not choosen for the last 4 tests .

[JourneyMan]

a) find good bowlers b) maintain them [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-x_IONTok4o]Irfan Pathan Hat-trick v Pakistan Karachi 2006 - YouTube[/ame] What the heck happened?

[King Tendulkar]

a) find good bowlers b) maintain them Irfan Pathan Hat-trick v Pakistan Karachi 2006 - YouTube What the heck happened?

Dont start me at crapthan. To be honest that match sums up the plight of the trundller who swings it in test cricket. As yes with new ball can be dangerous. But as soon as ball gets old and stops swinging they become food and drink. In that innings after that hatrick with older ball he was murdered. Look at zak in this series. Before he had genuine wheels to go with his amazing skill. Now this time he had all the skill still, was swinging it both ways with new and old ball. Had it on a string. But it was all at 78 to 80 mph and the beasts of international cricket just coped with ease. Thats why pace matters. Not saying have to be 90mph. But if bowling 80 and below its just uselss. Need to be at least operating in 83 to 87 zone as a min

[JourneyMan]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SaaDgiR94D4]RP Singh 5 wicket haul Lords India vs England 2007 - YouTube[/ame] How did this guy not become our lead pace bowler?