gattaca Posted March 29, 2015 Posted March 29, 2015 I was watching this movie Evelyn on Netflix about a father trying to get custody of his kids. He couldn't according to their laws because he needs consent from his wife who runs away. So according Irish law kids have to stay under church supervision till they will be adults. They had children's act in their constitution for parent to get custody of a kid they need consent from parents. This movie is based on real life facts. How could get a consent when the wife runs away. I remember an incident happened in Ireland , an indian lady had issues with pregnancy she would have survived had they terminated the baby but because their laws are based on religion (conservative Christians don't like babies aborted) she died.I don't like this religion meddling in wih constitution.
Cricket_Hacker Posted March 29, 2015 Posted March 29, 2015 we also have same problem(religion meddling) Need to get UCC
Malcolm Merlyn Posted March 29, 2015 Posted March 29, 2015 May be Donal Cozzie can tell us about this.
gattaca Posted March 29, 2015 Author Posted March 29, 2015 we also have same problem(religion meddling) Need to get UCC For india they should ban all religions and practices.
Donal Cozzie Posted March 29, 2015 Posted March 29, 2015 Ah yes the abortion issue, one of our greatest shames. I'll post about this later in as much detail as I can, not bothered right now :P All shall be revealed shortly my Bangla friend, just bear with me
Malcolm Merlyn Posted March 29, 2015 Posted March 29, 2015 Ah yes the abortion issue, one of our greatest shames. I'll post about this later in as much detail as I can, not bothered right now :P All shall be revealed shortly my Bangla friend, just bear with me I am not a BDer.Spare me O Celtic One.
Guldozer Posted March 29, 2015 Posted March 29, 2015 For india they should ban all religions and practices. Does that mean Atheism also gets banned?:winky:
gattaca Posted March 29, 2015 Author Posted March 29, 2015 Does that mean Atheism also gets banned?:winky: If you classify atheism as religion. Religions were needed back in the days of kings to have control over people. The whole point of religion is control over people. In this day science and technology religion has absolutely no use. I still don't see any use with religions in this day. All the money they spend in temples , masjids, churches could be used for betterment of people. Religions have brought more hatred and killings in the recent times than probably diseases.
velu Posted March 29, 2015 Posted March 29, 2015 in norway or sweeden police took the kid away from indian parents because they used their hands to feed their kid :rofl:
Precambrian Posted March 29, 2015 Posted March 29, 2015 If you classify atheism as religion. Religions were needed back in the days of kings to have control over people. The whole point of religion is control over people. In this day science and technology religion has absolutely no use. I still don't see any use with religions in this day. All the money they spend in temples ' date=' masjids, churches could be used for betterment of people. Religions have brought more hatred and killings in the recent times than probably diseases.[/quote'] Ban parents as well... how dare they control their children. They are nothing but useless after initial years. Heck, nothing but an economic pain as they age. Right?
Donal Cozzie Posted March 29, 2015 Posted March 29, 2015 OK, so the OP mentions that according to state law here So according Irish law kids have to stay under church supervision till they will be adults May I ask when the film was set? If it was the 80s or earlier I can believe this, but this certainly isnt the case today. You see ever since our independence in 1949 and well prior to this the Catholic Church had a huge hold on Irish law,society and culture. Throughout our history all schools were Catholic funded as the British government never really cared to set any up, hell in some poor place places the church was the only thing that would feed or take care of them. Unsurprisingly Irish society was very religious and conservative as a result, and not in a good way e.g various paediphile priests were knowingly moved arounf the country so they could continue destroying lives all the while the higher ups in the church did zilch. Such was the power they had the police often ignored their crimes. Law was also affected e.g. until the 80s you couldnt even divorce or buy condoms without a subscription here. It sounds like something you'd read about Saudi but thats how we were until 3-4 decades ago, we really have progressed a long way since then and the church thankfully is a dying influence here and has no power over state affairs. The case you mention, family law here certainly favours the female over the male in regards to custody of kids, but sadly this is the case in nearly all western countries as in most cases the mother is left to care for the baby and the father is nowhere to be seen. Its not right and will change but its a slow process, as in cases where you can argue the father is better, there are also cases where the mother is the best option. Things should be looked at independently and hopefully will be in the near future You also mentioned the Savita case, where the woman died after being refused an abortion. The stance on abortion is one of the last remnants of our dark days of the church's power and a referendum will be held in a couple years to solve it once and for all. According to our current law, a woman can only have an abortion under certain cases so abortion on demand isnt available legally. Rest assured there was widespread outrage/embarrassment over the Savita case and that poor womans death wont be in vain. The abortion stance really is our biggest shame and the government at the moment is a cowardly farce of a government and wont hold a ref on it as an election is due soon enough and they dont want to rock the boat too much among the older more conservative voters who may still subscribe to old views, but trust me, in 5 years time this wont be an issue.
Muloghonto Posted March 29, 2015 Posted March 29, 2015 Does that mean Atheism also gets banned?:winky: That is an logical fallacy. For one, you cannot consider disbelief of something to be the same as belief in something. "I deny its existence till its proven to exist" is not a fully functional viewpoint either but it is not the same assumptive behavior as choosing to believe something exists without any proof of it. The reason for atheism being > theism from an existential viewpoint, is simple: One can say with empiric existentialism, " I choose not to consider anything that which i cannot truly perceive empirically, beyond my senses, because it does not change the determinism of my action". That is not, technically speaking, denial of existence of God or a higher paradigm. It is stating that I choose not to believe in any evidence ever presented of existence of any higher existence/paradigm, i.e., i am not convinced that your God, is the real thing. You cannot challenge this with logic because the reality is, there is no such thing as a perfect anything and you cannot prove the existence of a perfect being without proving that any one given thing you can think of is perfect in the first place. This subset of atheism is called agnosticism. To put it simply, it is refusing to care for that which is beyond our control or understanding and believe other people who say they know the real deal without presenting any undeniable evidence of this 'Godly correctness'.
Malcolm Merlyn Posted March 29, 2015 Posted March 29, 2015 OK, so the OP mentions that according to state law here May I ask when the film was set? If it was the 80s or earlier I can believe this, but this certainly isnt the case today. You see ever since our independence in 1949 and well prior to this the Catholic Church had a huge hold on Irish law,society and culture. Throughout our history all schools were Catholic funded as the British government never really cared to set any up, hell in some poor place places the church was the only thing that would feed or take care of them. Unsurprisingly Irish society was very religious and conservative as a result, and not in a good way e.g various paediphile priests were knowingly moved arounf the country so they could continue destroying lives all the while the higher ups in the church did zilch. Such was the power they had the police often ignored their crimes. Law was also affected e.g. until the 80s you couldnt even divorce or buy condoms without a subscription here. It sounds like something you'd read about Saudi but thats how we were until 3-4 decades ago, we really have progressed a long way since then and the church thankfully is a dying influence here and has no power over state affairs. The case you mention, family law here certainly favours the female over the male in regards to custody of kids, but sadly this is the case in nearly all western countries as in most cases the mother is left to care for the baby and the father is nowhere to be seen. Its not right and will change but its a slow process, as in cases where you can argue the father is better, there are also cases where the mother is the best option. Things should be looked at independently and hopefully will be in the near future You also mentioned the Savita case, where the woman died after being refused an abortion. The stance on abortion is one of the last remnants of our dark days of the church's power and a referendum will be held in a couple years to solve it once and for all. According to our current law, a woman can only have an abortion under certain cases so abortion on demand isnt available legally. Rest assured there was widespread outrage/embarrassment over the Savita case and that poor womans death wont be in vain. The abortion stance really is our biggest shame and the government at the moment is a cowardly farce of a government and wont hold a ref on it as an election is due soon enough and they dont want to rock the boat too much among the older more conservative voters who may still subscribe to old views, but trust me, in 5 years time this wont be an issue. Donal Was there much publicity in Ireland with regard to Savita case?Was it a topic of discussion among common folks?What was the church's reaction to it?
Muloghonto Posted March 29, 2015 Posted March 29, 2015 Ban parents as well... how dare they control their children. They are nothing but useless after initial years. Heck, nothing but an economic pain as they age. Right? I don't see where parental control and religion mix as analogies in this context. Why would believing in a certain unknown deity or deities and adhering to their laws (theism) the same thing as imparting knowledge & life skill to an offspring ?
Donal Cozzie Posted March 29, 2015 Posted March 29, 2015 Donal Was there much publicity in Ireland with regard to Savita case?Was it a topic of discussion among common folks?What was the church's reaction to it? Massive publicity, for a first world country to let that happen was hugely embarrassing for the majority of us. The church were sympathetic but firm, abortion is evil etc, etc. Quite frankly the vast majority dont give a toss about the church and the constant negative publicity they get cant help them. A referendum on gay marriage is up this summer, no doubt the church will say some more stupid stuff in the lead up to it.
Donal Cozzie Posted March 29, 2015 Posted March 29, 2015 This is the Irish online news site I use, they've had massive amounts of articles on this topic in the past 2 years. It also has a comments section so you can see what the vast majority feel towards the issue. Just ignore the obvious trolls if you take a look. http://www.thejournal.ie/savita-halappanavar/news/
Donal Cozzie Posted March 29, 2015 Posted March 29, 2015 The problem with the Savita case was, the baby was 100 percent confirmed to miscarry. It had no chance of living. But it still had a heartbeat in the womb, According to law here an abortion can only be given generally of the foetus is dead, so even though it had zero chance of living its life was valued over hers. Honestly it makes me feel ashamed/sick just thinking back on that case. Thankfully the outrage expressed and vigls/marches organised restored some of my faith in humanity
Texan Posted March 30, 2015 Posted March 30, 2015 If you classify atheism as religion. Religions were needed back in the days of kings to have control over people. The whole point of religion is control over people. In this day science and technology religion has absolutely no use. I still don't see any use with religions in this day. All the money they spend in temples ' date= masjids, churches could be used for betterment of people. Religions have brought more hatred and killings in the recent times than probably diseases. Completely disagree. And I have given considerable thought to "Why do we need religion today?" One of the biggest reasons we need religion is that it tells us what is morally right and wrong. There are many everyday situations you land in when you are faced with a dilemma of what is right and what is wrong. In many cases, both your options will be perfectly legal. However, one option would be morally wrong and the other right. This is where religion plays its role. Besides, belief in an Almighty who will guide you to better times gives hope to the hopeless. And that is what helps sustain their lives. Do not attribute some of the evils of today just to religion. If we did not have religion, we would probably have even more evils than what we do now.
Precambrian Posted March 30, 2015 Posted March 30, 2015 I don't see where parental control and religion mix as analogies in this context. Why would believing in a certain unknown deity or deities and adhering to their laws (theism) the same thing as imparting knowledge & life skill to an offspring ? The only difference I see is biological connection. Just because the child was born to the parents, the parents should be able to exert complete influence over its life?
Muloghonto Posted March 30, 2015 Posted March 30, 2015 The only difference I see is biological connection. Just because the child was born to the parents' date=' the parents should be able to exert complete influence over its life?[/quote'] I don't see how parents are able to exert complete influence over its life..parental authority is limited by social norm in virtually every society- some more than others. I still don't see the connection between an abstract value system and that of raising a child ?
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