rkt.india Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 Kasprowicz bowled 130 to 140 k mostly.....in test matches. Not low 140s... He was very tall though and got steep bounce. I have never seen Wasim bowl a single delivery over 145 k . Imran's fastest delivery in a much publicized speed contest in the 1970s was 139 k. Akram just did not have the bowling action to bowl really quick. He had a quick arm action which generated enough pace for him.
express bowling Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 TBF....Those pitches were pretty flat but may not be an out and out patta like S.C and also they had a gun bowling attack so credit where due :hatsoff:...I am a big fan of Kohli and yes he is good on bouncy pitches but not so much in swinging conditions. the earlier generation it should be the other way round...likes of Vengsarker and even Azhar etc used to do well in Eng and Nzl but struggle on bouncy pitches. Wanderers was not a flat pitch [ Test match in late 2013 ]. Apart from pace and bounce, there was consistent seam movement and some swing with the new ball. Kohli scored 119 and 96 there against Steyn , Morkel and Philander there. His technique sort of changed in England....he was fishing outside the off stump and playing widish outgoing deliveries....which he rectified in Australia.
express bowling Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 Akram just did not have the bowling action to bowl really quick. He had a quick arm action which generated enough pace for him. That is true.
Marut Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 Andy Roberts and D K Lillee, the 2 of the most feared, nasty mean fast bowlers of all time rated Vishy above Gavaskar and that means a lot to me. And Dravid as I said, great player against swing but against Donald, Lee, Ambrose, Bond etc I always saw him struggle. Vishy played some impact knocks against these teams, which could have led to this opinion. Vishy was more like Sehwag/VVS of the 70s and 80s, playing some crucial knocks when others failed. But Gavaskar was clearly a cut above him. Most batsmen struggled against Donald, Lee, Ambrose and Bond when they were in zone, not just Dravid.
SELVAM Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 People overestimating rahane's ability, kohli is still best player of both spin&fast bowling in current team
express bowling Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 Vishy played some impact knocks against these teams, which could have led to this opinion. Vishy was more like Sehwag/VVS of the 70s and 80s, playing some crucial knocks when others failed. But Gavaskar was clearly a cut above him. Most batsmen struggled against Donald, Lee, Ambrose and Bond when they were in zone, not just Dravid. I have never seen Vishwanath bat....so don't know first hand. My father and uncle say that he played well when others failed...but was not consistent enough. His test average of 41 after 91 tests suggests the same thing. I have seen Amarnath and Gavaskar bat. Amarnath played well during tough conditions too...and he too was not very consistent , partly due to him being frequently dropped and not allowed to settle down. His fitness level was appalling. But he was very courageous against the West Indian pace quartet and fought it out always. Gavaskar was the ultimate in terms of concentration, technique, focus and courage. He never used a helmet in his life and used a skull cap in his last 3 or 4 years. Both Gavaskar and Amarnath were very good against genuine quicks. So was Ravi Shastri. But these guys were accumulator of runs. They did not dominate bowlers. Their main achievement was scoring runs against genuine fast bowlers although they lacked adequate protective gear in that era. Kapil Dev, Tendulkar, Kohli and Rahane are the four Indian batsmen who have dominated and attacked genuine fast bowlers ...even in test matches played outside the subcontinent... and managed to score a lot of runs.
vamos_rafa Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 People overestimating rahane's ability' date=' kohli is still best player of both spin&fast bowling in current team[/quote'] Dont compare rahane the test batsmab wiB the odi one. Hes a much better test batsman already than kohli and he can obly inprove.
BeautifulGame Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 I am still not fully convinced by Kohli against bounce . Fact is the only wkt that had some pace and bounce in Australia tour was Brisbane.And he failed there in both innings and even in Odis .His cut shots are very unconvincing playing the cut in bouncy wkts For me both Rahane and Vijay are comfortably better at playing fast bowling than Kohli
vamos_rafa Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 ^ this. As far as vijay goes,very few people are better at leaving deliveries than him.
express bowling Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 I am still not fully convinced by Kohli against bounce . Fact is the only wkt that had some pace and bounce in Australia tour was Brisbane.And he failed there in both innings and even in Odis .His cut shots are very unconvincing playing the cut in bouncy wkts For me both Rahane and Vijay are comfortably better at playing fast bowling than Kohli Kohli scored 119 and 96 in the Wanderers against Steyn and Morkel... which had a lot of pace and bounce. In his first Australia tour , he scored 75 and 44 on a very bouncy Perth pitch. Even in the last Australia tour... the Melbourne pitch had good bounce and he scored a century there. Infact...all tracks in Australia have significantly more bounce than an average sub-continent track.
BeautifulGame Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 Kohli scored 119 and 96 in the Wanderers against Steyn and Morkel... which had a lot of pace and bounce. In his first Australia tour , he scored 75 and 44 on a very bouncy Perth pitch. Even in the last Australia tour... the Melbourne pitch had good bounce and he scored a century there. Infact...all tracks in Australia have significantly more bounce than an average sub-continent track. That Wanderers didn't have much pace .Pujara also scored 150+ and SA nearly chased 400+ in fourth innings . Having Pace in the pitch matters for bounce .And no the Melbourne was a flat patta .Perth knock was good though But he clearly has technical issues even in bouncy wkts not being able to play cut shots effectively .He also has horrible record against Australia in Odis as well . And as I already said in the one wkt that had both pace and bounce last tour in Aus he failed in both test and Odis
Marut Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 Kohli is definitely not at the level of Amla/AB/Clarke etc on bouncy and swinging conditions. Kohli is decent against bounce, but on available evidence he is suspect against good bowlers in swinging conditions. Barring one or two knocks here and there, he is yet to score big under swinging conditions. He has done better in bouncy conditions, but surely has weaknesses against bounce as well. This is true of tests and ODIs as well.
express bowling Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 That Wanderers didn't have much pace .Pujara also scored 150+ and SA nearly chased 400+ in fourth innings . Having Pace in the pitch matters for bounce .And no the Melbourne was a flat patta .Perth knock was good though But he clearly has technical issues even in bouncy wkts not being able to play cut shots effectively .He also has horrible record against Australia in Odis as well . And as I already said in the one wkt that had both pace and bounce last tour in Aus he failed in both test and Odis The Durban pitch was a patta. Wanderers had both pace and bounce, especially in the Ist innings. Pujara played exceptionally well to score that 153 in the 2nd innings. SA nearly chasing 400 in the 2nd innings had a lot to do with our poor pace attack...a clearly unfit Zaheer, an inexperieced Shami looking lost without reverse swing in his first away test snd the mercurial Ishant. Most past players all over the world are always praising Kohli's ability to play pace and bounce and the authority with which he hooks and pulls quick deliveries. His batting ability is held in the highest esteem by great cricketers and the lowest esteem in ICF. Does seem strange.
Marut Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 The Durban pitch was a patta. Wanderers had both pace and bounce, especially in the Ist innings. Pujara played exceptionally well to score that 153 in the 2nd innings. SA nearly chasing 400 in the 2nd innings had a lot to do with our poor pace attack...a clearly unfit Zaheer, an inexperieced Shami looking lost without reverse swing in his first away test snd the mercurial Ishant. Most past players all over the world are always praising Kohli's ability to play pace and bounce and the authority with which he hooks and pulls quick deliveries. His batting ability is held in the highest esteem by great cricketers and the lowest esteem in ICF. Does seem strange. Test match wickets were mostly flat in Australia, NZ and SA. Kohli struggled in swinging conditions in England. In ODIs, Kohli averages just 33 against Aus, NZ, Eng and SA in these four nations, compared to an average of 55 at home. While he has 22 hundreds and 33 fifties in 158 matches, if we restrict the matches to these four nations against these four teams, he has just two hundreds and five fifties in 35 matches. Kohli does struggle to get even fifties against these nations while he is creaming hundred after hundred in his comfort zones. Kohli is yet to play a single impact innings against these four nations in these countries - his highest score in an Indian win under these conditions is 46.
BeautifulGame Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 the wickets in NZ were not flat by any means NZL wkts flatted out in 2nd innings in both tests
Muloghonto Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 Among Gavaskar's contemporaries Vishwanath had a reputation of fearless batting against pace bowling. I have never watched him bat' date=' so would love to hear an opinion from someone who has.[/quote'] No, Vishy was a God against spin bowling and vulnerable against hostile fast bowling ( the carribean type where they bowl fast and bouncy on good length to target the body). Vice's reputation was the man on the burning deck, aka he played many many great innings when all hope was lost.
Muloghonto Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 Akram just did not have the bowling action to bowl really quick. He had a quick arm action which generated enough pace for him. That is BS. Akram could consistently bowl in the 145-150kph range when he wanted to and usually bowled at those speeds in Australia where his swing was negated and bowlers needed to bang it in to generate bounce and pace.
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