Whither Indian Spin

[Dhondy]

I know, I know, I'm back at it again. A 19 year old rookie, with one Test behind him, showed India's spinners how to do it. Kumble and Harbhajan, toiling away against Pakistan's lower middle order time after time, outbowled comprehensively by the newcomer. What wouldn't we give for a quality pacer? Look at the stats. Remember, these are dusty tracks, tailored to neuter fast bowlers, India are without their two first choice seamers, both injured, and without Zaheer as well for this Test. So far, Indian spinners have taken 25 wickets @ 35.6. India's inexperienced, third choice seamers have chipped in with 18 @ 37.8. Even more damning, star turn Harbhajan Singh, lags behind the average spinner and the average seamer with 10 @ 41.3, outperformed by Zaheer, Ishant and Ganguly in bowling averages. If he cannot bowl sides out on Indian tracks, what will he achieve on the unforgiving tabletops of Australia? Leave the guy at home, go with Kumble as the lone spinner and include Sreesanth in the squad on the off chance that he'll be ready for Perth and Adelaide. You couldn't go wrong.

[kabira]

completely agree. Go with Murli Kartik, if we need two spinners in Australia

[fineleg]

SS is injured and we cannot take him by just We can take a Murali Kartik if HS is poor, or include another fast bowler but can't just take SS while he is injured and needs to recover fully first.

[Cricketics]

i have pretty bad feeling about Bajji down under.. if he gets to play any game.. if u had watched recent Srilanka vs Aus 2 test.. Aus played Murali with ease and grace.. all from jaques till Clarke.. each and every batsman played well and read murali easily.. Bajji hasn't been doing any great on fast bowling tracks.. wonder what waitz for him when he tour down under

[Bumper]

The mention of the name Bhajji makes my blood boil. What an overrated, rubbish bowler. Even more painful than his no show is that his place is not even in question. How is he an automatic second choice spinner in the country ? The no. of times YK reverse swept Bhajji is unbelievable. No off spinner worth his salt will let a batsman get away with so many reverse sweeps. He looks completely clueless (may be he has become like that bowling defensive lines in ODIs ?). He doesnt know how to keep it tight & work on a batsman, is not willing to attack, does not show any variations in his spinners. Has become a complete waste of a spot.

[Guest BossBhai]

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[Bumper]

Not this one or even the one at Kolkatta .... The pitch at B'lore was dug up and re-laid ... they even got in a Aussie/NZ curators to literally "Ape" the Aussies .... The morons went to a nondescript place 100 miles away from Bengaluru to get the soil for this pitch .... Such pitches are exception not the norm in India.

But what good is Bhajji as a bowler then (if he will bowl well only in minefields) ? The guy bowls cluelessly. He cannot contain batsmen, he cannot get them out. Heck, he cannot even play a good support role to a strike bowler. He's completely forgotten how to take wickets.

[Lurker]

Blame it on the sheer amount of LOI and 20/20 Dhondy. The art of loop and flight has now given way to bowling faster ones and firing yorkers ad nauseum. Murali might be the last of the great spinners(along with Kumble). Monty and Vettori are possibly other fine spinners but that is pretty much it.

[Guest BossBhai]

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[Bumper]

Yes I agree about Harbi ... he needs to go back to domestic and/or County cricket for a full season and find his mojo back ... afterall he is only 28.

He's already done it Boss. He went to the counties & got some wickets. He isnt out of form to play domestic games and come back. He simply isnt good enough anymore, to play at this level. Even tailenders have figured him out. YK plays reverse sweeps of Bhajji with his eyes closed. How much more insulting can this get to an international bowler ? Would YK dare do this to a bowler like Kumble ? Bhajji is finished!

[Dhondy]

Blame it on the sheer amount of LOI and 20/20 Dhondy. The art of loop and flight has now given way to bowling faster ones and firing yorkers ad nauseum. Murali might be the last of the great spinners(along with Kumble). Monty and Vettori are possibly other fine spinners but that is pretty much it.

Monty's been found out very quickly, Lurker. Look at his struggles in SL where Murali is reaping his ritual 5-fers. His record away from home is Bhajji-esque. Vettori is a much better ODI bowler. Wouldn't rate him as a frontline spinner in Tests.

[Bumper]

Monty's been found out very quickly, Lurker. Look at his struggles in SL where Murali is reaping his ritual 5-fers. His record away from home is Bhajji-esque. Vettori is a much better ODI bowler. Wouldn't rate him as a frontline spinner in Tests.

Says something about off spinners in general isnt it ? Because they dont have as much variety like leg spinners, they get figured out quickly. Once the off spinner is booted out of his comfort zone, only the real talented ones such as Murali (and perhaps even Saqlain) have shown the skill to add more variety to their bowling to stay on top of batsmen. The rest have withered! For as long as Kumble has played for India, he's been our spearhead. We've had many off spinners come & go in the mean time, but no one could match the endurance of Jumbo.

[Mr. Wicket]

If we're taking 2 spinners down under, let the second one be someone like Powar - gutsy, resolute, capable of adapting to batsmen and with his reliance on flight, not needing turning tracks to be effective. Powar's been taking a few wickets for Bombay this season, not done too badly even on some flat tracks, and seems to have found his mojo with the bat at long last recently with a ton and a fifty in recent innings.

[Guest BossBhai]

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[sm332]

If we're taking 2 spinners down under' date=' let the second one be someone like Powar - gutsy, resolute, capable of adapting to batsmen and with his reliance on flight, not needing turning tracks to be effective. Powar's been taking a few wickets for Bombay this season, not done too badly even on some flat tracks, and seems to have found his mojo with the bat at long last recently with a ton and a fifty in recent innings.[/quote'] In the ODI against Oz he got slaughtered and his lack of batting and completely inept fielding caught up with him.

[coffee_rules]

Powar's fielding and batting is a big minus for Australia. Ozzies play off-spin very well. So, I doubt he will even get a chance. Go with Kumble and 3 pacers.

[Guest BossBhai]

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[King]

Bhajji can't do much in Australia. Bhajji will be taken to cleaners by the Aussies. They didn't even spare the likes of Murali and I don't reckon Harbhajan stands much of a chance. If I'd like to take a second spinner I would go with Murali Karthik. Not that he is a class spinner or anything but the Aussies traditionally have struggled against left arm spin. Vettori has been the best of the bowlers for NZ against Australia for some years now (barring the injured Bondy). Kumble may be able to pick wickets thanks to the bounce on the Aussie pitches but I wouldn't trust Harbhajan to do well in Australia.

A 19 year old rookie, with one Test behind him, showed India's spinners how to do it. Kumble and Harbhajan, toiling away against Pakistan's lower middle order time after time, outbowled comprehensively by the newcomer. What wouldn't we give for a quality pacer?

I won't read much into the figures Dhondy. I saw him bowling for couple of days non stop and I don't have anything great to write home about Ishant Sharma. He bowls short of good length about a foot outside off stump at about 130 kph and the Aussies thrive on such bowlers and length. Also Ishant Sharma struggled against the left handers big time often sticking to leg stump line. Sure he produced few balls that beat the bat and hit the pads but he didn't look like a bowler that would inspire. I'd be more than happy to go with Munaf if the choice was between Munaf and Ishant. Just having a good height won't get him anywhere, ask the likes of Abey Kuruvilla or Tinu Youhanna. Ishant is way too predictable in line and length. I think he still needs about couple of years or three to become international class.

[fineleg]

Bhajji can't do much in Australia. Bhajji will be taken to cleaners by the Aussies. They didn't even spare the likes of Murali and I don't reckon Harbhajan stands much of a chance. If I'd like to take a second spinner I would go with Murali Karthik. Not that he is a class spinner or anything but the Aussies traditionally have struggled against left arm spin. Vettori has been the best of the bowlers for NZ against Australia for some years now (barring the injured Bondy). Kumble may be able to pick wickets thanks to the bounce on the Aussie pitches but I wouldn't trust Harbhajan to do well in Australia. I won't read much into the figures Dhondy. I saw him bowling for couple of days non stop and I don't have anything great to write home about Ishant Sharma. He bowls short of good length about a foot outside off stump at about 130 kph and the Aussies thrive on such bowlers and length. Also Ishant Sharma struggled against the left handers big time often sticking to leg stump line. Sure he produced few balls that beat the bat and hit the pads but he didn't look like a bowler that would inspire. I'd be more than happy to go with Munaf if the choice was between Munaf and Ishant. Just having a good height won't get him anywhere, ask the likes of Abey Kuruvilla or Tinu Youhanna. Ishant is way too predictable in line and length. I think he still needs about couple of years or three to become international class.

Ravi, Very good analysis on I.S. Hopefully, we can re-evaluate in 2 years time and in the meanwhile he needs to work with coaches, MRF...etc to train hard. Regarding Bhajji - one thing that has been written here already summarizes it: If Chucklitharan (who despite his chucking, he is good at that!) could not be effective against Aus in Aus - there is no way in hell that Bhajji can do squat against them. We should play 3 fast bowlers + 1 spinner. In the event AK is injured we should have M.Kartik as reserve. HS does not qualify as 2nd spinner.

[The Outsider]

Harbhajan, the parasite, should be kicked out of the Indian team, real soon and real hard or he will continue sucking the life out of our bowling attack.