Tennis :2017 season

[Muloghonto]

Federer has finally figured out Nadal.

It has fundamentally changed Federer's game from his peak years (which i think is from 04-07) and though i think peak Federer is still the better Federer, THIS Federer, is a better Nadal killer.

His movement has diminished noticeably from the past, but his unbelievable ability to take a ball anywhere on the court on the half-volley has covered the expected huge drop-off in tennis performance when a player's movement becomes slower.

His first serve is more potent, as he can 'aim' more, due to the 'easier power' of the bigger racket. 

This has also completely changed his backhand, where he can now blow holes on the court, with regularity, with the backhand.

The bigger racket has caused one noted drop in his game: his forehand is no longer the unbeatable weapon it was once before. His forehand is now significantly weaker but he still retains his amazing accuracy with it, so he can still paint lines with it. 

However, the new Federer is more vulnerable to someone who can play a consistent game and can dominate his forehand. Aka Del Potro. But it matters not, because there are no good players who have a truly great forehand currently-except the unluckiest tennis player who's ever lived, DelPo.  Djokovic is a pusher, so is Murray and Nadal and Nadal's forehand is no longer the iron-precise and fails often. Rest who have good forehands (Raonic for e.g.) have other holes in their games that Federer pounces on and exposes them.

 

[kumar713]

On 10/11/2017 at 1:31 PM, Gollum said:

This is the best I have Rafa playing on HCs since his fantastic 2013 run. Will he finally get a YEC this year, the only big title that has eluded him for so long. I see him holding on to no 1 for at least another 50 weeks which will take his reign to nearly 200 weeks. The race for GOAT is getting very tight. If Rafa ends up even 1 short of Fed in the majors count, his other stats will propel him to no 1 in the GOAT race, even a rabid Fedtard like me will find it hard to argue with the Nadal fans then .

Nah this is not Rafa's best run

US open was a mere gift. His draw was a joke.

Didn't face any top players.

Djokovic, Kei, Murray, Wawrinka all were out.

 

Pouille choked in MP in Beijing.

 

Rafa got blown off the court by Federer. Nadal on Fast court was no contest for Federer. Great to see  

 

Finally Federer with 5 consecutive wins over Nadal. H2H getting little bit better. Nadaltards in ruins.

 

[kumar713]

On 10/17/2017 at 3:06 AM, Muloghonto said:

Federer has finally figured out Nadal.

It has fundamentally changed Federer's game from his peak years (which i think is from 04-07) and though i think peak Federer is still the better Federer, THIS Federer, is a better Nadal killer.

His movement has diminished noticeably from the past, but his unbelievable ability to take a ball anywhere on the court on the half-volley has covered the expected huge drop-off in tennis performance when a player's movement becomes slower.

His first serve is more potent, as he can 'aim' more, due to the 'easier power' of the bigger racket. 

This has also completely changed his backhand, where he can now blow holes on the court, with regularity, with the backhand.

The bigger racket has caused one noted drop in his game: his forehand is no longer the unbeatable weapon it was once before. His forehand is now significantly weaker but he still retains his amazing accuracy with it, so he can still paint lines with it. 

However, the new Federer is more vulnerable to someone who can play a consistent game and can dominate his forehand. Aka Del Potro. But it matters not, because there are no good players who have a truly great forehand currently-except the unluckiest tennis player who's ever lived, DelPo.  Djokovic is a pusher, so is Murray and Nadal and Nadal's forehand is no longer the iron-precise and fails often. Rest who have good forehands (Raonic for e.g.) have other holes in their games that Federer pounces on and exposes them.

 

Nadal's decline plus not playing him on clay is helping Federer both mentally and physically.

Federer's serve is helping him against average returner like Rafa. Rafa's return position against Fed in Shanghai final  

Worked against Anderson but won't work against guys like Federer.

 

Nadal was good during clay season but his HC season was over rated.

His US open draw was a mere joke.

 

 

[Gollum]

1 hour ago, kumar713 said:

Nah this is not Rafa's best run

US open was a mere gift. His draw was a joke.

Didn't face any top players.

Djokovic, Kei, Murray, Wawrinka all were out.

 

Pouille choked in MP in Beijing.

 

Rafa got blown off the court by Federer. Nadal on Fast court was no contest for Federer. Great to see  

 

Finally Federer with 5 consecutive wins over Nadal. H2H getting little bit better. Nadaltards in ruins.

 

I agree his US open draw was grave injustice to tennis and humanity, but my point still stands. This was his best post USO run since 2013 which was the last time you saw him get success in the latter part of the year. Djokovic, Murray, Stan, Kei etc were out.... I agree that helped him but 2014-16 Nadal would still have made a fool out of himself with this competition. Nadal is a poor HC player (relative to other ATGs) and so the bar isn't so high for him, taking those things into consideration he was operating at his best possible level after SW19. 

Edited October 21, 2017 by Gollum

[Gollum]

Fed deserves a lot of credit for what he has achieved this year after a 6 month long career threatening injury break. But how good has Ljubicic been for him !!!! This BH change must be credited to the coach who himself had one of the best 1HBH of the modern era. Ljubicic has made Fed believe that there is more to his game than endless BH slices (works only on grass courts) and mad net rushes. Edberg screwed over Fed's head turning him into Roddick 2.0 with his crazy unnecessary net rushes and zero ground game in the 2014-16 period. You can't expect to win majors in the modern era just having a deadly serve and great volleying skills, that would have worked in the ultra quick courts of the 90s but not anymore. Fed went 0-4 in majors against Nole with his stupid tactics and godawful ground game but he was completely outplayed only in SW19 2015 and AO 2016....I believe even peak Fed would have had trouble staying with Nole in those 2 matches. SW19 2014 and USO 2015 were there for the taking if only he had Ljubo in stead of Edberg in his box. 

 

Now the way things have proceeded this year, I really shouldn't complain but I wish Fed had skipped Montreal and played Cinci with proper preparation. He played Montreal carrying a paunch after an extended family vacation, not to forget his decision to attend a Cold Play concert till late night, 10 hours before his 1st match . Nadal winning his 3rd USO since 2010 while Fed last won in 2009 and Nole with only 2 USOs is so unjust...... how can any proper tennis fan make peace with the fact that Nadal has more USOs than Nole despite being a far inferior HC player than him?  

Edited October 21, 2017 by Gollum

[Dil Dil India]

On 10/21/2017 at 8:35 PM, Gollum said:

Fed deserves a lot of credit for what he has achieved this year after a 6 month long career threatening injury break. But how good has Ljubicic been for him !!!! This BH change must be credited to the coach who himself had one of the best 1HBH of the modern era. Ljubicic has made Fed believe that there is more to his game than endless BH slices (works only on grass courts) and mad net rushes. Edberg screwed over Fed's head turning him into Roddick 2.0 with his crazy unnecessary net rushes and zero ground game in the 2014-16 period. You can't expect to win majors in the modern era just having a deadly serve and great volleying skills, that would have worked in the ultra quick courts of the 90s but not anymore. Fed went 0-4 in majors against Nole with his stupid tactics and godawful ground game but he was completely outplayed only in SW19 2015 and AO 2016....I believe even peak Fed would have had trouble staying with Nole in those 2 matches. SW19 2014 and USO 2015 were there for the taking if only he had Ljubo in stead of Edberg in his box. 

 

Now the way things have proceeded this year, I really shouldn't complain but I wish Fed had skipped Montreal and played Cinci with proper preparation. He played Montreal carrying a paunch after an extended family vacation, not to forget his decision to attend a Cold Play concert till late night, 10 hours before his 1st match . Nadal winning his 3rd USO since 2010 while Fed last won in 2009 and Nole with only 2 USOs is so unjust...... how can any proper tennis fan make peace with the fact that Nadal has more USOs than Nole despite being a far inferior HC player than him?  

At Wimbledon it is not even up for debate. Peak Federer takes it in 4 sets max. AO would be closer on plexicushion, but given that grandpa 35 year old took a set off absolute peak Novak there, his 04, 07 avatars at the AO would be more than a match for Novak...even 05 AO Fed and 09 Fed  probably.

[kumar713]

Federer Del potro going 3 in Basel

Guess Federer got this  

[Gollum]

Fed's decision to play Montreal is going to cost him his GS record. Nadal could never have overcome a deficit of 5 majors but 3 is doable especially considering that all predictions about him having an early downfall due to his physical play have come to naught. Realistically who is going to stop Rafa on Philippe Chatrier in the next 3 years?

[Muloghonto]

On 10/30/2017 at 2:16 AM, Gollum said:

Fed's decision to play Montreal is going to cost him his GS record. Nadal could never have overcome a deficit of 5 majors but 3 is doable especially considering that all predictions about him having an early downfall due to his physical play have come to naught. Realistically who is going to stop Rafa on Philippe Chatrier in the next 3 years?

If you watched this year, even on clay, Nadal looked beatable. IMO, if Djokovic & Murray return to their top form- even for a few months- they will stop Nadal at Roland Garros. Thiem, too, i believe can. But i don't think Nadal is going to be around till he is 35-36, so he has less time to make up the record. Its doable but definitely a hard task.

 

[Gollum]

22 minutes ago, Muloghonto said:

If you watched this year, even on clay, Nadal looked beatable. IMO, if Djokovic & Murray return to their top form- even for a few months- they will stop Nadal at Roland Garros. Thiem, too, i believe can. But i don't think Nadal is going to be around till he is 35-36, so he has less time to make up the record. Its doable but definitely a hard task.

 

Nadal looked imperious on clay this year bro. His only loss was against Thiem in Rome but that can be attributed to fatigue cum tanking, he was clearly preserving himself for Paris. He was so dominant in RG, made Thiem and Stan look like spectators in the semis and finals. In the current field only these 2 had a remote chance against Rafa on Philippe Chatrier, yet they won a combined 13 games in 6 sets !!!!  Stan is 34 and just parted ways with Norman, I don't see him as a factor in the coming years. Thiem never really struck me as a champion, he can't even string 2 good matches against the top dogs together, he will win RG but only after Nadal retires. 

 

Even if Nole and Murray return at their best level in 2018, I don't see them beating the Spaniard in RG. Murray has mostly been a non factor against Nadal on clay. Murray's only chance is at the Madrid open which is faster compared to other clay events, in fact that is the only surface where even Federer has chances against Nadal. Nole is the only man who can beat the clay God in events other than Madrid, but in what state will he return? Unless 2015 Nole makes an appearance in 2018, he can't hurt Nadal. At worst Nadal may concede a Masters or two, but he is almost unbeatable on the high bouncing, ultra slow PC court. Nole is too wounded after his past encounters with Nadal in the French , that too will be a factor. 2015 RG was absolute peak Nole vs the worst version of Nadal, I doubt we will see anything like that again. 

 

Nadal's single minded devotion towards winning RG should never be underestimated, even during his peak years he skipped other majors to get in top shape before RG. If push comes to shove I won't be surprised if he does that again. His longevity was always a question mark, in 2008/9 people thought he would be done by the age of 25......what happened to those predictions? He is doing fine at 31, playing some of the most impressive tennis of his life, that too after a lull of 2 years. We can never underestimate a champion, I genuinely believe he has it in him to win another 3 RGs. 

[zep1706]

On 10/21/2017 at 8:35 PM, Gollum said:

how can any proper tennis fan make peace with the fact that Nadal has more USOs than Nole despite being a far inferior HC player than him?  

lol wtf is that supposed to mean? Djokovic has always underperformed in the summer hard court swing, he hasn't won Cincinnati too. Nadal has also beaten him twice to win the US open. Every tennis fan except for a few bitter Fed or Djoko fans can make peace with that. Should we just give Djokovic more US opens because he's the better hard court player?  As of now, Nadal is better than him at the US open, more titles plus 2-1 head to head. 

Edited November 2, 2017 by zep1706

[zep1706]

BTW Nadal just clinched the year end #1, great achievement. 9 years gap between the first and this one. Talk about longevity! 

[Gollum]

41 minutes ago, zep1706 said:

lol wtf is that supposed to mean? Djokovic has always underperformed in the summer hard court swing, he hasn't won Cincinnati too. Nadal has also beaten him twice to win the US open. Every tennis fan except for a few bitter Fed or Djoko fans can make peace with that. Should we just give Djokovic more US opens because he's the better hard court player?  As of now, Nadal is better than him at the US open, more titles plus 2-1 head to head. 

Nadal's draws in his 3 USO triumphs are the cruelest jokes ever played. 

If not for such unfair draws, Nole would be 3-0 H2H. 2010 SF took a lot out of gluten Nole with just 1 day recovery before the final. In 2013 again he was involved in a brutal match against Stan in the semis while Nadal got Robredo and Gasquet in his QF and SF......are you kidding me?

Edited November 2, 2017 by Gollum

[Cricketics]

Briilliant ATP world tour finals so far. Nadal ran away in the middle but Jack Sock has been brilliant. He won 1000 atp points last week after winning that masters and entered this tournament on the last day thanks to those 1000 points which took him to this tournament for the first time.

 

Now he is in the semi finals after knocking Zverev out. Looking forward to seeing Federer win this tournament. 

[Cricketics]

Well done to David Goffin, one can call it an upset but he is a quality player and him beating Federer is no surprise to me. Well done David.

[Gollum]

Can't wait to have Nole coming back next year, hope we at least get a 85% prime Nole. This year has been very boring in spite of Fed's 2 majors. 

[zep1706]

10 hours ago, Cricketics said:

Briilliant ATP world tour finals so far. Nadal ran away in the middle but Jack Sock has been brilliant. He won 1000 atp points last week after winning that masters and entered this tournament on the last day thanks to those 1000 points which took him to this tournament for the first time.

 

Now he is in the semi finals after knocking Zverev out. Looking forward to seeing Federer win this tournament. 

Nadal ran away in the middle? lol Why did he run away from Paris after winning 2 matches when he had a clear shot at the title? Jeez I didn't expect you to be a blind hater, disappointed! 

Edited November 18, 2017 by zep1706

[Cricketics]

Just now, zep1706 said:

Nadal ran away in the middle? lol Why did he run away from Paris after winning 2 matches when he had a clear shot at the title? Jeez I didn't expect you to be a blind hater, disappointed! 

I am not hater, unlike many you will see. I respect him a lot which you won’t see from many RF fans or vice versa from Nadal fans about RF. But I felt he could have played more. No blind hating, I followed a lot of tennis in last 2 months.

[zep1706]

Not a great year for ATP, it was poor all around, all Fed fanatics shitting on Nadal's US open draw should take a look at Federer Wimbledon draw. The only player who had a tiny chance shat his pants in the final and cried, that or he was genuinely carrying some injury . Hopefully next year would be more competitive. 

[zep1706]

Just now, Cricketics said:

I am not hater, unlike many you will see. I respect him a lot which you won’t see from many RF fans or vice versa from Nadal fans about RF. But I felt he could have played more. No blind hating, I followed a lot of tennis in last 2 months.

 

That's why I am surprised. If he didn't have any physical issue, he wouldn't have retired after one match. He lost all 3 in 2011, there was no injury back then. Plush he had already withdrawn from Paris after winning 2 matches and despite being the hot favorite for the title without Federer. It's clear that he wasn't fully fit. He took a chance at WTF but it didn't come off. Your comment was uncalled for.