jusarrived Posted May 15, 2017 Share Posted May 15, 2017 3 hours ago, Muloghonto said: You are talking out of your rear end. Talking about law and order doesn't make one a leftist. It makes one a nationalist, because you can't claim to be 'pro nation' and not prioritize implementation of the SAME NATION's legal code on its citizenry. And yes, state government can pump up police, if central government can provide extra funding- which they can easily do by cutting back on high end arms acquisitions that are not used in its lifetime. Give another 5-6 years and Sukhois will be requiring extended refits to 'extend their lifecycle' - i.e., nearing retirement without seeing combat. We don't absolutely-must need an aircraft carrier either. It is only ever used in aggressive action against a nation and we are not in the business of breaking up foreign nations. Atleast, not for a long-long while. We already got 1. Building one more. We sure as hell don't need 3, because we are sure as hell not going to have WWIII versus China. Aircract carriers overall, end up costing 10-15 billion dollars per. Before you jump up and down going 'but it only costs 5 billion to make one', i am talking entire lifecycle cost of 1600-2000 personnel, cost of all the jets on it, fuel, parts, etc. Surely, the third one can wait, before our police has enough resources to BLOODY IMPLEMENT THE LAW !!!!! And besides, law and order doesnt need to be a state purview either. The BJP - once it has RS majority, can implement an RCMP/FBI type national police-force. Or at the very least, turn CBI into one. I don't expect Yogi government to enforce an America level policing. Just like i don't expect little girls from India to stop being peddled for sex slavery anytime soon. But one can hope. Yours is the 'making excuses/chalta-hai' attitude, that is the cancer of the nation. Ever checked how many girls get sexually abused in America under you gold standard of FBI policing ? The stats suggest one on every four girl is sexually abused , costing in excess of 100 billion every year . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jusarrived Posted May 15, 2017 Share Posted May 15, 2017 On 2017-5-13 at 8:37 AM, Haarkarjeetgaye said: its this supporting thing which has divided us. If one focuses on the move and outcomes, then we may have more constructive discussion. right now it becomes name calling - pakistani, anti Indian, desh drohi, congressi, aaptard. With time we will get rid of this also. How about following what you preach ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haarkarjeetgaye Posted May 15, 2017 Author Share Posted May 15, 2017 16 minutes ago, jusarrived said: How about following what you preach ? Sure. We all should, including our PM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jusarrived Posted May 15, 2017 Share Posted May 15, 2017 38 minutes ago, Haarkarjeetgaye said: Sure. We all should, including our PM Thanks for proving my point Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muloghonto Posted May 15, 2017 Share Posted May 15, 2017 6 hours ago, jusarrived said: Ever checked how many girls get sexually abused in America under you gold standard of FBI policing ? The stats suggest one on every four girl is sexually abused , costing in excess of 100 billion every year . And how many girls get stolen from their families and sold into sex slavery in USA again ? If you are gonna make a comment, understand what has been said first. Nobody said anything about molestation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muloghonto Posted May 15, 2017 Share Posted May 15, 2017 10 hours ago, mishra said: How do you decide what are good indicators for defense spending? Isnt it all in relative terms. Next door hostile nation is spending x y and z. So shouldnt India be spending something on basis of that? Or you just pull something random out of your hat. Answer my question - how many great powers have existed in the last 150 years that is incapable of punishing mob violence ? Yes, defence spending is in relative terms to your neighbourhood. But WHAT you acquire has to be justified. There is no valid reason to get 3 aircraft carriers, unless we want to invade someone- aircraft carriers are *NOT* defensive weapons, they are offensive weapons. We won 1965 with the aircraft carrier in dry-dock, in 1971 we didnt use it defensively, we used it to attack east Pakistan (bangladesh). So you cannot say 'we need aircraft carriers for defence'. And you still have not answered my question as to why we need fancy new toys for the military- which it doesnt use- over dedicating more money to law and order first. Gollum 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mariyam Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 On 5/15/2017 at 2:17 PM, Muloghonto said: You are talking out of your rear end. Talking about law and order doesn't make one a leftist. It makes one a nationalist, because you can't claim to be 'pro nation' and not prioritize implementation of the SAME NATION's legal code on its citizenry. And yes, state government can pump up police, if central government can provide extra funding- which they can easily do by cutting back on high end arms acquisitions that are not used in its lifetime. Give another 5-6 years and Sukhois will be requiring extended refits to 'extend their lifecycle' - i.e., nearing retirement without seeing combat. We don't absolutely-must need an aircraft carrier either. It is only ever used in aggressive action against a nation and we are not in the business of breaking up foreign nations. Atleast, not for a long-long while. We already got 1. Building one more. We sure as hell don't need 3, because we are sure as hell not going to have WWIII versus China. Aircract carriers overall, end up costing 10-15 billion dollars per. Before you jump up and down going 'but it only costs 5 billion to make one', i am talking entire lifecycle cost of 1600-2000 personnel, cost of all the jets on it, fuel, parts, etc. Surely, the third one can wait, before our police has enough resources to BLOODY IMPLEMENT THE LAW !!!!! And besides, law and order doesnt need to be a state purview either. The BJP - once it has RS majority, can implement an RCMP/FBI type national police-force. Or at the very least, turn CBI into one. I don't expect Yogi government to enforce an America level policing. Just like i don't expect little girls from India to stop being peddled for sex slavery anytime soon. But one can hope. Yours is the 'making excuses/chalta-hai' attitude, that is the cancer of the nation. The CBI is an investigative agency, bulk of whose work revolves around unearthing financial irregularities. You'd find more accountants and CAs in the CBI than shooting from the hip policemen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mishra Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 (edited) On 15/05/2017 at 8:35 PM, Muloghonto said: Answer my question - how many great powers have existed in the last 150 years that is incapable of punishing mob violence ? Yes, defence spending is in relative terms to your neighbourhood. But WHAT you acquire has to be justified. There is no valid reason to get 3 aircraft carriers, unless we want to invade someone- aircraft carriers are *NOT* defensive weapons, they are offensive weapons. We won 1965 with the aircraft carrier in dry-dock, in 1971 we didnt use it defensively, we used it to attack east Pakistan (bangladesh). So you cannot say 'we need aircraft carriers for defence'. And you still have not answered my question as to why we need fancy new toys for the military- which it doesnt use- over dedicating more money to law and order first. See mate. You are talking nonsense and even you know it. What do you mean by fancy toys. Do you think a nation having nuclear deterrent cant be attacked and boundries cant be redrawn? Do you think a nation having missile sheild cant be attacked? Think again! Fnd a nswer to Why do India is spending so much at maintaining and running Siachen post? Look at state of Japan. Those buggers gave up on offensive weapon system and end result is China is annexing every part which is unoccupied. Every other day atleast 2-3 Chinese jets invade the Japanese territory. Just like people, There is no boundries or end to a nations hunger for land and power. If you dont have offensive weapon, nations will will attack you as there is no fear of reciprocal action. This attack doesnt mean attack by fancy toys only. Boundries are easily redrawn. Indian navy is a source of concern to China. And it is already militarising Indian waters and standing right in face, be it Maldives, Bangladesh, Pakistan Srilanka. Why the hell do you think Chinese are doing it. I can rant on and on at your stupid argument. But I cant cant make you more enlightened as you seem to already be a enlightened one. Edited May 19, 2017 by mishra Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haarkarjeetgaye Posted May 19, 2017 Author Share Posted May 19, 2017 4 hours ago, mishra said: See mate. You are talking nonsense and even you know it. What do you mean by fancy toys. Do you think a nation having nuclear deterrent cant be attacked and boundries cant be redrawn? Do you think a nation having missile sheild cant be attacked? Think again! Fnd a nswer to Why do India is spending so much at maintaining and running Siachen post? Look at state of Japan. Those buggers gave up on offensive weapon system and end result is China is annexing every part which is unoccupied. Every other day atleast 2-3 Chinese jets invade the Japanese territory. Just like people, There is no boundries or end to a nations hunger for land and power. If you dont have offensive weapon, nations will will attack you as there is no fear of reciprocal action. This attack doesnt mean attack by fancy toys only. Boundries are easily redrawn. Indian navy is a source of concern to China. And it is already militarising Indian waters and standing right in face, be it Maldives, Bangladesh, Pakistan Srilanka. Why the hell do you think Chinese are doing it. I can rant on and on at your stupid argument. But I cant cant make you more enlightened as you seem to already be a enlightened one. A nation having nuclear power cannot be attacked. If you think otherwise, then you are thinking nonsense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mishra Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 16 minutes ago, Haarkarjeetgaye said: A nation having nuclear power cannot be attacked. If you think otherwise, then you are thinking nonsense Who attacked USSR? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haarkarjeetgaye Posted May 19, 2017 Author Share Posted May 19, 2017 (edited) 5 minutes ago, mishra said: Who attacked USSR? Only know of Germany in the world war. Not in the Cold War period. Can you today attack a country with nuclear power. It cannot happen unless it is a nuclear war. What stops any country from attacking Pakistan today? Edited May 19, 2017 by Haarkarjeetgaye Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mishra Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Haarkarjeetgaye said: Only know of Germany in the world war. Not in the Cold War period. Can you today attack a country with nuclear power. It cannot happen unless it is a nuclear war. What stops any country from attacking Pakistan today? But it survived German attack. I cant find it on map anymore. Nothing but UN stops a country attacking directly Pakistan . American went inside, use to bomb Pakistan every other day. India can not do same becuse their firepower is comparable to ours. And if you understand technology you will know that Ideally we can declare no fly zone over Pakistan, If only we are sure that UN will accept and China wont give some ammunition which can do better than ours. Edited May 19, 2017 by mishra Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haarkarjeetgaye Posted May 19, 2017 Author Share Posted May 19, 2017 Just now, mishra said: But it survived German attack. I cant find it on map anymore. Was that a weapon based attack or a Cold War? Can anyone capture Pakistan today by attacking it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haarkarjeetgaye Posted May 19, 2017 Author Share Posted May 19, 2017 2 minutes ago, mishra said: But it survived German attack. I cant find it on map anymore. Nothing but UN stops a country attacking directly Pakistan . American went inside, use to bomb Pakistan every other day. India can not do same becuse their firepower is comparable to ours. Can one capture Pakistan.That way even Pakistani terrorists enter India and bomb us Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haarkarjeetgaye Posted May 19, 2017 Author Share Posted May 19, 2017 No matter what you say, I do not believe a nuclear country can be captured today. UN is an excuse. The real reason is Pakistan has nukes. The day they are gone, Pakistan will be captured Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mishra Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 2 minutes ago, Haarkarjeetgaye said: Can one capture Pakistan.That way even Pakistani terrorists enter India and bomb us Blank answer, Now you can argue on it or just think over it discuss with few intellects. Forget funding terror or infiltration, If we had permanent seat in UN, Pakistan wouldnt even think about responding to our surgical strikes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haarkarjeetgaye Posted May 19, 2017 Author Share Posted May 19, 2017 3 minutes ago, mishra said: Blank answer, Now you can argue on it or just think over it discuss with few intellects. Forget funding terror or infiltration, If we had permanent seat in UN, Pakistan wouldnt even think about responding to our surgical strikes. We can agree to disagree. I firmly believe countries with nuclear power cannot be attacked with weapons. That is why world was worried about Iran. You are free to have your opinion. Everybody is an intellect. Level is different Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mishra Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 ^ Attack can happen from within, Like what happens in NE, Naga, Bodo,Ulfa,Mizo or centre like Naxal, Shiv Sena or border like Kashmir. Why do you think you need nukes to beat up a nuclear country. USSR is not left. So can easily happen in India Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haarkarjeetgaye Posted May 19, 2017 Author Share Posted May 19, 2017 Just now, mishra said: ^ Attack can happen from within, Like what happens in NE, Naga, Bodo,Ulfa,Mizo or centre like Naxal, Shiv Sena or border like Kashmir. Why do you think you need nukes to beat up a nuclear country. USSR is not left. So can easily happen in India Internal attacks yes. But you then don't need massive weaponry for that. War crafts, fighter jets for internal threats? I am talking about one country trying to capture a nuclear power. Not happening unless it is a nuclear war Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mishra Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 4 minutes ago, Haarkarjeetgaye said: Internal attacks yes. But you then don't need massive weaponry for that. War crafts, fighter jets for internal threats? I am talking about one country trying to capture a nuclear power. Not happening unless it is a nuclear war Massive weaponery contains you. Look at South China sea. Vietnam and Co won it in ICJ but China still helped itself to the waters and land. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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