P.I.E language homeand

[Muloghonto]

1 hour ago, rish said:

Thou slewest noseless Dasyus with thy weapon, and in their home 
o'erthrewest hostile speakers.

 

Wonder how this mulo guy will spin everything to suit his false narrative

 

The false narrative is from you. 

As i said, Dasyu are indo-iranian people and this is the split of the arya and the avestan pantheon. This is citable from hinduphobic Michael Witzel himself. 
The names of the Dasyu kings are Iranic, the Dasyu became the Dahae in Iranic with the typical s-->h transliteration ( sindh to hindh for eg). 

Do you want me to cite this or what lol.

1 hour ago, rish said:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indigenous_Aryanism

 

The last line is telling...the indigenist position is a part of a "lunatic fringe" against mainstream migrationist model.

 

You guys can keep pumping each other in this thread now.

 

I am out.

 

Wiki is not a source. The mainstream model is part of the western imperialistic fringe. You keep saying you are out but are not out. lol

 

[Vijy]

9 hours ago, Muloghonto said:

@Vijy

[quote]If I recall correctly, Heggarty et al. 2023 posit an indo-european origin south of caucasus, right? More and more work is casting doubt on the simplistic notion of central asia being the root of everything holy and mighty[/quote]

 

The model proposed by Hegarrty et al 2023 is that PIE is in Armenian highlands, with two waves of migrations.

 

The first migration happens into the pontic steppe around 4000 BCE, where a branch moves into Europe, that is the proto Indo-German-Celtic, with Celtic & Germanic divisions coming later, with a second branch moving later into tarim basin by 2000 BCE. 
 

The second is Indo-Iranic, which comes as Indo-Iranic into Indus Valley by 3000 BCE, where it splits into Indo-Aryan and then Indo-Iranian, with Indo-Iranian migrating back into the iranian plateau.

 

yes, I had glanced through the paper last year, but didn't remember all the specifics. thanks for the summary :)

[Real McCoy]

pie homeland is in yorkshire

 

 

[coffee_rules]

On 5/5/2024 at 1:19 AM, rish said:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indigenous_Aryanism

 

The last line is telling...the indigenist position is a part of a "lunatic fringe" against mainstream migrationist model.

 

You guys can keep pumping each other in this thread now.

 

I am out.

 

It started with Invasionistic model to suit their justification of colonialism. Now, with genetic data of a few 100 samples, they theorize it to migration model just to match the theory of again outsiders coming into India. The idea from the beginning was to divide the notions of Vedic culture not indigenous to India. They distort Harappan's away from Indic culture and delink any of the continuity of culture (Pashupati, yoga, priest-king, fire alters) from Vedic culture .  
 

The genetic mixture shows maximum diversity of strains among Indians and there is research showing the such diverse variations should be root. Such research gets defunded , but the ones David Reich and others are popularized by hacks like Tony Joseph, because it can used to justify the Steppe ancestry. Even if we have such ancestry, it’s per archeology we don’t have any traces left there.  Tje connection of theories of Ashwamedha horses being sacrificed and eaten by Brahmins has been debunked by Sanskrit scholars as distortions by western indology. Also, there is no language gene to prove that Sanskrit originated from Eastern european region, so, any development of the language in India was totally indigenous, forget about where it might have originated, it was nourished and flouruished in India.
 

The mainstream migration model is a hypothesis and they have linguistic and genetic evidence as proof. But linguists have initially supported out of India theory as well. Some research by Talageri and others shows holes in the migration model and supports reverse migration out of India. Recently some researchers have arrived at Iranian region as homeland ! That’s pretty close to Akhand Bharat’s territory. 
 

I thought you had strong material than the likes of Tony Joseph for all the name-calling you do

 

 

 

 

Edited May 6 by coffee_rules

[Real McCoy]

1 hour ago, coffee_rules said:

The genetic mixture shows maximum diversity of strains among Indians and there is research showing the such diverse variations should be root. Such research gets defunded , but the ones David Reich and others are popularized by hacks like Tony Joseph, because it can used to justify the Steppe ancestry.

 

You wonder why. Almost all western research are always done to further the interests of their ruling class. Researchers will come close to Iran but there will be a time when westerners will not trust their own research and look to India for spiritual guidance. They will reject all "research" and come to realize vedic civilization is entirely of Indian origin. We should say the right things when some westerner asks about India and vedic civilization. Not like this guy who lets western researchers pump into him and talks like a western controlled robot.

[Muloghonto]

4 hours ago, coffee_rules said:

It started with Invasionistic model to suit their justification of colonialism. Now, with genetic data of a few 100 samples, they theorize it to migration model just to match the theory of again outsiders coming into India. The idea from the beginning was to divide the notions of Vedic culture not indigenous to India. They distort Harappan's away from Indic culture and delink any of the continuity of culture (Pashupati, yoga, priest-king, fire alters) from Vedic culture .  
 

The genetic mixture shows maximum diversity of strains among Indians and there is research showing the such diverse variations should be root. Such research gets defunded , but the ones David Reich and others are popularized by hacks like Tony Joseph, because it can used to justify the Steppe ancestry. Even if we have such ancestry, it’s per archeology we don’t have any traces left there.  Tje connection of theories of Ashwamedha horses being sacrificed and eaten by Brahmins has been debunked by Sanskrit scholars as distortions by western indology. Also, there is no language gene to prove that Sanskrit originated from Eastern european region, so, any development of the language in India was totally indigenous, forget about where it might have originated, it was nourished and flouruished in India.
 

The mainstream migration model is a hypothesis and they have linguistic and genetic evidence as proof. But linguists have initially supported out of India theory as well. Some research by Talageri and others shows holes in the migration model and supports reverse migration out of India. Recently some researchers have arrived at Iranian region as homeland ! That’s pretty close to Akhand Bharat’s territory. 
 

I thought you had strong material than the likes of Tony Joseph for all the name-calling you do

 

 

 

 

 

 

Ashwamedha horse sacrifice does not make sense for steppe pastoralists, where horses are commonplace. It makes sense for regions who do not have horses but have to import horses - Ashwamedha is the definition of a high status symbol sacrifice ritual. Steppe people, where the average nomad owns 1-3 horses each, would not consider said sacrifice to be a high status symbol exercise. Its not high status to sacrifice the one thing that everyone has. 
It would make sense for cultures like India, southern China, SE Asia, etc, where horses are not native to, struggle to survive and must be imported into. 

Indeed, not a SINGLE steppe culture in recorded history ( meaning, those whom we have historical records of) show horse sacrifice ritual. Not mongols, not oghuz, not sarmatians, alans, kipchaks, cumans, huns, xinognu, etc. NOT ONE  in the last 2500 years of recorded cultures of steppe people ! 

But steppe people do on occasion eat horses. So now two horse remains found in shintashta, a steppe culture of no historical record, suddenly are ashwmedha sacrifice. 

This is the level of forgery western agenda driven historians can get to.

 

[Mariyam]

On 5/5/2024 at 5:59 AM, Muloghonto said:

 

India has little to no steppe cultural influence prior to historic times, with Sakas being the first. This has already been proven in Heggarty et al 2023

Indus valley being indic language group ( as shown by heggarty et al 2023) and Rig veda clearly mentioning its homeland at the core heartland of Indus valley makes it pretty decisive that earliest origin of sanskrit is in India itself. What the origin of pre-sanskrit indo-european languages are, is irrelevant. 

 

Heggarty et al can't be taken seriously here. Influence of the Sakas in evident even 2000+  years after their demise.

 

Case in point , even Anil Kapoor can't stop mentioning them to this date.

 

 

Edited May 7 by Mariyam