Why can't , or don't, we bat like this

[lemsip]

For all the bazball hype, the entire English innings lasted 51 overs compared to India's 70. England rarely last till the 80th over in tests in any situation.

This is a one trick pony. When it comes off and they get away with the risks they take it looks great but over time and in different conditions, they continue to be a mediocre batting side. It is just that most people in England don't really base their entire lives around the fortunes of the English cricket team and fans just shrug off the odd defeat. The environment cannot be compared to India where people start wrist slitting at the drop of a hat.

[vvvslaxman]

10 hours ago, lemsip said:

For all the bazball hype, the entire English innings lasted 51 overs compared to India's 70. England rarely last till the 80th over in tests in any situation.

This is a one trick pony. When it comes off and they get away with the risks they take it looks great but over time and in different conditions, they continue to be a mediocre batting side. It is just that most people in England don't really base their entire lives around the fortunes of the English cricket team and fans just shrug off the odd defeat. The environment cannot be compared to India where people start wrist slitting at the drop of a hat.

It also makes your bowlers tired. Batting time has a lot of advantages. You get fresher bowlers.  

[Lord]

10 hours ago, lemsip said:

For all the bazball hype, the entire English innings lasted 51 overs compared to India's 70. England rarely last till the 80th over in tests in any situation.

This is a one trick pony. When it comes off and they get away with the risks they take it looks great but over time and in different conditions, they continue to be a mediocre batting side. It is just that most people in England don't really base their entire lives around the fortunes of the English cricket team and fans just shrug off the odd defeat. The environment cannot be compared to India where people start wrist slitting at the drop of a hat.

Are you still watching from the ground? What's the forecast tomorrow? 

[lemsip]

2 hours ago, Lord said:

Are you still watching from the ground? What's the forecast tomorrow? 

Didn't watch today. Forecast for tomorrow is some rain between 4 and 5 pm but dry otherwise. I would expect play not to be significantly affected by rain breaks as they can play till 730 pm

[Lord]

We went at over 4 RPO. Hope @Sooda bhai is happy

[Sooda]

Yes much better 

 

All hinges upon the only batsman who could do it : Jaiswal 

 

But For me it's not about doing it only when it's easy to bat

 

But when conditions are against us, any ball can get you out , need to be proactive in these cases: don't hang back in crease waiting for that one which will kill you. Need aggression to throw them off 

 

Easier said than done Vs 6 foot plus guys bowling 85+ mph but standing outside the creas and taking a few paces down the crease also…if it does seam back in, there’s a second defence of either 1) if it hits the pads, could be struck outside off stump, 2) if it does hit the pads in line, the distance between pad and stumps is a lot, with the ball angling in, could survive with the ball going down leg 3) being down the pitch, the umpire less likely to give it out, so if do get hit in line, can survive an umpires call if the ball clips the stumps 4) if far down the crease, then over 3m, automatically becomes umpires call

 

There was times when Survival is impossible on this pitch. Especially when seamers are bowling full length; every ball lbw, bowled and edge in play.

 

The only way you can survive is if the bowlers drag their length back

 

 The only thing a batsman can do to force the bowlers to go short, is to stand outside the crease and walk down.

[Sooda]

On 8/1/2025 at 2:07 PM, vvvslaxman said:

Suddenly we are sucking up to ENgladn's bazball facade. They do that because they  are allowed to do that. THey don't have good defense. That is the team philosophy. Failure will be forgiven within the set up. There was so much criticism about Crawley after first 3 tests. THey persisted with him . WIll Indian team back players who take risks and get out. Our fans will go after the family members of players. We have to be realistic.

 

Yes ; culture needs to change - it is not better to hang back in the crease and nick to keeper than it is to reverse scoop and get caught 

 

It's not a facade when they mow down 300+ targets for fun in fourth innings whilst we can't even scrape to 200  

 

 

[Sooda]

20 hours ago, lemsip said:

For all the bazball hype, the entire English innings lasted 51 overs compared to India's 70. England rarely last till the 80th over in tests in any situation.

This is a one trick pony. When it comes off and they get away with the risks they take it looks great but over time and in different conditions, they continue to be a mediocre batting side. It is just that most people in England don't really base their entire lives around the fortunes of the English cricket team and fans just shrug off the odd defeat. The environment cannot be compared to India where people start wrist slitting at the drop of a hat.

 

Yes culture and mentality needs to change 

 

But, our batting is mediocre too usually, let's not get fooled by the roads we've been gifted here.

 

Not a one trick pony when they mow down 300+ targets for fun in fourth innings whilst we can't even scrape to 200  

 

 

[vvvslaxman]

13 minutes ago, Sooda said:

 

Yes ; culture needs to change - it is not better to hang back in the crease and nick to keeper than it is to reverse scoop and get caught 

 

It's not a facade when they mow down 300+ targets for fun in fourth innings whilst we can't even scrape to 200  

 

 

 

India's failure to chase down 200 had nothing to do with a lack of Bazball cricket. It was a lack of common sense and nerve handling. Sehwag did that way back in 2011 chasing 383. Most recently, we mowed down 330 at the Gabba against the ATG bowling unit. 

Even when you want to be aggressive, there has to be a method. Jaiswal went after a wide high ball. That set off the collapse. England bats deep precisely for this reason. They want to continue aggression even when wickets fall. Sometimes it fails Sometimes it works. When it fails nobody will go after them. For instance in NZ they were only 55 away from win with 5 wickets in hand. Arrogant shot attempt from Stokes and Root cost their wickets back to back. They imploded from that point and lost by 1 run. It doesn't always work

[vvvslaxman]

23 minutes ago, Sooda said:

 

Yes culture and mentality needs to change 

 

But, our batting is mediocre too usually, let's not get fooled by the roads we've been gifted here.

 

Not a one trick pony when they mow down 300+ targets for fun in fourth innings whilst we can't even scrape to 200  

 

 

 

England is the biggest FTBs. When they had to bat out 103 overs on good batting track they couldn't even play out the overs backing their defense. 

[Chaos]

We have kelaball… no bc can best that. 

[Sooda]

2 hours ago, vvvslaxman said:

 

India's failure to chase down 200 had nothing to do with a lack of Bazball cricket. It was a lack of common sense and nerve handling. Sehwag did that way back in 2011 chasing 383. Most recently, we mowed down 330 at the Gabba against the ATG bowling unit. 

Even when you want to be aggressive, there has to be a method. Jaiswal went after a wide high ball. That set off the collapse. England bats deep precisely for this reason. They want to continue aggression even when wickets fall. Sometimes it fails Sometimes it works. When it fails nobody will go after them. For instance in NZ they were only 55 away from win with 5 wickets in hand. Arrogant shot attempt from Stokes and Root cost their wickets back to back. They imploded from that point and lost by 1 run. It doesn't always work

 

But we go into our shells, all defensive when chasing like mental midgets

 

I know We don't have to be bazball, we can't

 

If we just showed positive intent that'd be great. It's rare

 

[Trichromatic]

https://www.espncricinfo.com/series/england-in-pakistan-2024-25-1442205/pakistan-vs-england-2nd-test-1442216/full-scorecard

 

England were chasing 297 and folded in 33 overs.

[Sooda]

25 minutes ago, Trichromatic said:

https://www.espncricinfo.com/series/england-in-pakistan-2024-25-1442205/pakistan-vs-england-2nd-test-1442216/full-scorecard

 

England were chasing 297 and folded in 33 overs.

 

Not a great example because it was on a reused pitch deliberately so that Pak spinners could cause mayhem. Plus England are not great Vs spin. 

[Sooda]

4 hours ago, vvvslaxman said:

 

England is the biggest FTBs. When they had to bat out 103 overs on good batting track they couldn't even play out the overs backing their defense. 

 

Yes you could argue that the old fashioned playing a day out skill is lost with England 

 

And yeah they openly admit they're FTB with the kinds of pitches they're preparing now

[Sooda]

On 8/1/2025 at 2:09 PM, vvvslaxman said:

 

If i am right Sundar lost his wicket both times when he took on the deep fielder. Otherwise looked ungetouttable. If you have solid defense and you can bat all day you prefer that. English players don't have good defense. That is why they failed to survive even for 103 overs against a bumrahless attack. THey were forced to survive because task was too big.

 

Yes on flat pitches if we can grind them down and give our own bowlers a break that is great 

 

But when ball is moving around we need to be proactive otherwise we are sitting ducks 

[Trichromatic]

That's why Pant needs to bat at 6 where he can change the momentum of the game. Jadeja, Sundar etc can hold the fort.

[Sooda]

Brooks 80 of 70 right now