Has budget constraint ( $1.8B ) helped ISRO's frugal innovation ? China's space agency has a budget that is 10X ( $18.5B )

[rangeelaraja]

ISRO has been forced to literally boot strap by creating income through commercial launches - given the extremely frugal budget.

 

It is beyond shameful how poorly funded ISRO has been - every mission just has to succeed - don't know if this is a blessing in disguise. 

 

China's economy is 4.5X times India's size currently and the difference will shrink fast.  I expect India's GDP to be 80 % of China's by 2047. 

 

The least we can expect is to have a $4B budget for ISRO - to make it proportional and so that we can launch more dual use satellites and do even heavier launches.

 

ISRO is one organization that has delivered almost year after year, almost always overachieving- unlike DRDO.

Edited December 27, 2025 by rangeelaraja

[rangeelaraja]

Lets be honest increasing ISRO's budget by 3-4 billion dollars is a chump change for the govt. 

 

Deeply disappointed at the present govt - expected much better - atleast from this govt.  

[G_B_]

China runs a budget surplus; India does not.

 

While I agree that the budget of ISRO needs to be updated to 4-5 billion, the truth is India simply does not raise as much tax. India tax to GDP ratio is around 11-12% while China the figure sits at 23%.

 

Blaming the government is very easy. Indians have a reform but not at my expense mentality. If you run a referendum on if taxes need to be raised to fund defence ISRO etc. It will be defeated with the most common refrain being, why dont you tax XYZ.

 

 

I mean look at the whole ethanol fuel debate. Its very clear the policy will aid india in reducing dependence on oil and significantly reduce our imports.Its true, there will be teething issues in which some people will take a financial hit. Mostly the middle class. But India as a country will gain in the long run. So much resistance.

 

 

 

[kepler37b]

42 minutes ago, rangeelaraja said:

Lets be honest increasing ISRO's budget by 3-4 billion dollars is a chump change for the govt. 

 

Deeply disappointed at the present govt - expected much better - atleast from this govt.  

I am not sure if ISRO has the required man power.

 

The best have been absorbed by our ever expanding private sector and immigration.

 

Call me a pessimist, but chinks have vastly superior talent pool at every section of the intellectual pyramid. Especially when compared to us. 

[kepler37b]

20 minutes ago, G_B_ said:

China runs a budget surplus; India does not.

 

While I agree that the budget of ISRO needs to be updated to 4-5 billion, the truth is India simply does not raise as much tax. India tax to GDP ratio is around 11-12% while China the figure sits at 23%.

 

Blaming the government is very easy. Indians have a reform but not at my expense mentality. If you run a referendum on if taxes need to be raised to fund defence ISRO etc. It will be defeated with the most common refrain being, why dont you tax XYZ.

 

 

I mean look at the whole ethanol fuel debate. Its very clear the policy will aid india in reducing dependence on oil and significantly reduce our imports.Its true, there will be teething issues in which some people will take a financial hit. Mostly the middle class. But India as a country will gain in the long run. So much resistance.

 

 

 

 

The issue is that the duty must be shared across the spectrum. here is the middle class that is paying by reduced mileage and reduced life of vehicles, in addition to paying exorbitant taxes on petrol, road tax, GST etc.,.

 

Hence the resistance.

 

 

[G_B_]

5 minutes ago, kepler37b said:

 

The issue is that the duty must be shared across the spectrum. here is the middle class that is paying by reduced mileage and reduced life of vehicles, in addition to paying exorbitant taxes on petrol, road tax, GST etc.,.

 

Hence the resistance.

 

 

My friend, most of the middle class dont own a car...

 

 

[kepler37b]

22 minutes ago, G_B_ said:

My friend, most of the middle class dont own a car...

 

 

That is a fair point.  Car owners are actually a rich class. As per Indian standards. 

 

Even then, it is unethical to force the ethanol mix. Give options.  Offer ethanol and pure petrol.  

 

The current policy of ethanol is nothing less than adulteration.  

[rangeelaraja]

47 minutes ago, kepler37b said:

I am not sure if ISRO has the required man power.

 

The best have been absorbed by our ever expanding private sector and immigration.

 

Call me a pessimist, but chinks have vastly superior talent pool at every section of the intellectual pyramid. Especially when compared to us. 

 

I don't think that is true.  ISRO pays peanuts, China pays US level compensation at China's cost of living. Plus massive perks and benefits.

 

This is why all of ISROs stalwarts are from regional southern engineering colleges not the IITs.

 

Who do you expect to attract better talent with such disparity in compensation ? There are over a 100 space start ups in India, so talent is not the issue - funding is. 

 

I've been in the US for nearly 20 years - our talent pool in the West on the contrary is superior in very large numbers - and way more strategic minded. 

 

Top US tech companies are filled with 30-40 % Indian talent.  Chinese govt has been able to incentivize and bring home their top talent  from the west- we have not because of $$$

 

 

Edited December 27, 2025 by rangeelaraja

[rangeelaraja]

58 minutes ago, G_B_ said:

China runs a budget surplus; India does not.

 

While I agree that the budget of ISRO needs to be updated to 4-5 billion, the truth is India simply does not raise as much tax. India tax to GDP ratio is around 11-12% while China the figure sits at 23%.

 

Blaming the government is very easy. Indians have a reform but not at my expense mentality. If you run a referendum on if taxes need to be raised to fund defence ISRO etc. It will be defeated with the most common refrain being, why dont you tax XYZ.

 

 

I mean look at the whole ethanol fuel debate. Its very clear the policy will aid india in reducing dependence on oil and significantly reduce our imports.Its true, there will be teething issues in which some people will take a financial hit. Mostly the middle class. But India as a country will gain in the long run. So much resistance.

 

 

 

 

 

No. Almost every major country runs on a budget deficit including China, India and US.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_government_budget

 

Both China and India are running at  budget deficit that is about 7.5 % of GDP based on 2024 data.

 

Govt has been spending  dozens of billions of dollars on revaadi schemes to win local and national elections. It is money in the drain as it disincentivizes people. 

 

 

[raki05]

1 hour ago, rangeelaraja said:

Lets be honest increasing ISRO's budget by 3-4 billion dollars is a chump change for the govt. 

 

Deeply disappointed at the present govt - expected much better - atleast from this govt.  

BC entire eco system is more involved in free bees and political branding of parties. They dont even have funds to clear IT returns and you are expecting them to invest in innovation and science. We definetely need few visionaries in bjp to take over. Modi or Shah ji sirf baniya giri me lagey hai, apna dhandga chalta bhaand mey jaye janta. Also day by day we are seeing loss on various inportant front, be it info war loss after OP sindoor or diplomatic failure to protect Sheikh Hasina government in bd. Modiji is busy collecting highest civilian awards from some unknown african countries.

[rangeelaraja]

3 minutes ago, raki05 said:

BC entire eco system is more involved in free bees and political branding of parties. They dont even have funds to clear IT returns and you are expecting them to invest in innovation and science. We definetely need few visionaries in bjp to take over. Modi or Shah ji sirf baniya giri me lagey hai, apna dhandga chalta bhaand mey jaye janta. Also day by day we are seeing loss on various inportant front, be it info war loss after OP sindoor or diplomatic failure to protect Sheikh Hasina government in bd. Modiji is busy collecting highest civilian awards from some unknown african countries.

 

 

Not only that -- he is present at every single inauguration. The logic given is that all of this inauguration business and publicity around is important psychologically to impress upon the common man and gets so deeply ingrained when he goes out to vote - that it is Modi ji and his govt who is behind every development - it is part of the marketing machinery. I will not argue against that.  My biggest angst is that they have not done enough ( not even close ) despite having massive mandate. 

[kepler37b]

33 minutes ago, rangeelaraja said:

 

I don't think that is true.  ISRO pays peanuts, China pays US level compensation at China's cost of living. Plus massive perks and benefits.

 

This is why all of ISROs stalwarts are from regional southern engineering colleges not the IITs.

 

Who do you expect to attract better talent with such disparity in compensation ? There are over a 100 space start ups in India, so talent is not the issue - funding is. 

 

I've been in the US for nearly 20 years - our talent pool in the West on the contrary is superior in very large numbers - and way more strategic minded. 

 

Top US tech companies are filled with 30-40 % Indian talent.  Chinese govt has been able to incentivize and bring home their top talent  from the west- we have not because of $$$

 

 

I am not saying indian youth lacks in raw IQ and commitment. There are several talented young men rotting away in Villages. We need quality institutions like colleges, universities to train them properly. This is where we are lacking. 

 

Govt needs to first invest heavily in improving the school education. That will improve talent in Universities. And this will have multiplier effects. Long road ahead.

 

ISRO can hike the pay out by 5x tomorrow. But do we have well trained aeronautical engineers, PhD's available for employment at the right expertise level? I think not. ISRO needs to wait till they are available.

Edited December 27, 2025 by kepler37b

[rangeelaraja]

Just now, kepler37b said:

I am not saying indian youth lacks in raw IQ and commitment. There are several talented young men rotting away in Villages. But we need quality institutions like colleges, universities to train them properly. This is where we are lacking. 

 

Govt needs to first invest heavily in improving the school education. That will improve talent in Universities. And this will have multiplier effects. Long road ahead.

 

ISRO can hike the pay out by 5x tomorrow. But do we have well trained aeronautical engineers, PhD's available for employment at the right expertise level? I think not. They need to wait till they are available.

 

 

Bhai tell me what kind of talent can ISRO to attract to get with this kind of compensation ? 

 

https://www.ndtv.com/education/isro-invites-applications-for-over-300-positions-monthly-salary-up-to-rs-56-100-8521520

 

INR 56,000 / month plus benefits.  Yet, ISRO achieves. It is a joke. People join for the prestige and experience. Even ISRO entrance exams are several notches lower in difficulty compared to many competitive exams. 

 

China pays million dollar salaries and hires even the best of foreign talent. 

 

You cannot expect to attract world class talent  ( even local, let alone global ). unless the pay is competitive 

 

 

[kepler37b]

14 minutes ago, raki05 said:

BC entire eco system is more involved in free bees and political branding of parties. They dont even have funds to clear IT returns and you are expecting them to invest in innovation and science. We definetely need few visionaries in bjp to take over. Modi or Shah ji sirf baniya giri me lagey hai, apna dhandga chalta bhaand mey jaye janta. Also day by day we are seeing loss on various inportant front, be it info war loss after OP sindoor or diplomatic failure to protect Sheikh Hasina government in bd. Modiji is busy collecting highest civilian awards from some unknown african countries.

 

Modiji wanted to save on defense projects and fund the surplus for PM Awaas yojana

 

https://www.hindustantimes.com/india-news/pm-key-panel-seekoverhaul-of-indiandefence-production-101706033980638.html

 

 

"

it is understood that Modi asked those present to look at the long-term future of defence manufacturing, not merely the present, and conduct an audit of the platforms already with the armed forces before asking for more. He wanted accountability for cost overruns and delays in defence projects running into hundreds of crores and tens of years at a time when his government is keen to ensure the money saved can go into welfare programmes such as the PM Awas Yojana, which builds houses for the underprivileged."

[kepler37b]

11 minutes ago, rangeelaraja said:

 

Bhai tell me what kind of talent can ISRO to attract to get with this kind of compensation ? 

 

https://www.ndtv.com/education/isro-invites-applications-for-over-300-positions-monthly-salary-up-to-rs-56-100-8521520

 

INR 56,000 / month plus benefits.  Yet, ISRO achieves. It is a joke. People join for the prestige and experience. Even ISRO entrance exams are several notches lower in difficulty compared to many competitive exams. 

 

China pays million dollar salaries and hires even the best of foreign talent. 

 

You cannot expect to attract world class talent  ( even local, let alone global ). unless the pay is competitive 

 

 

You are right in a way. Chinki elite are something else. They see space for bragging rights and practical benefit next. As project of civilizational glory. They are able to pour funds into it in liberal doses. 

 

That unfortunately is not possible in a democracy. 

 

We need to follow the US model. Improve universities to get many more trained engineers that can work at this level of pay by ISRO.  

 

For example starting pay for NASA engineers is $60k to $80k, while silicon valley will pay them atleast $150k.

Edited December 27, 2025 by kepler37b