Bumper Posted March 3, 2009 Posted March 3, 2009 A failed nation is not attributable to just a failed leadership. Its as much to do with its failed citizens. One good look at the rival boards frequented by Pak citizens tells you the tale. Most of its citizens are expressing condolences and praying to Allah for the Lankan cricketers and their families. Fair enough. Others are cussing at the terrorists for denying them their beloved game for the forseeable future. But is anyone thinking about the BIG picture ? Obviously NOT! You cant fight isolated incidents to quell terrorism. You have to go after its roots. And it starts with acknowledging that there is a problem. And where does it all start ? It has to start with the citizens, as public opinion plays a big rolein public policies in Pakistan, esp, in events such as these. After Mumbai attacks, the entire country was busy denying its links, inspite of the compelling evidence that was emerging.Even now, there is no sight of any punishment meted out to the perpetrators who were behind the Mumbai mayhem. And all the while the great citizens of Terroristan were shabashing its govt's stand & how they didnt get bullied by the Indian govt. Did anyone say big picture ? Shhhh! And what do we see after what is arguably one of the most pathetic attacks of recent times ? Its icons such as Imran Khan appearing on national television & suggesting that Tamil Tigers could have played a hand in this. Failed citzens maketh a failed nation.
suraj Posted March 3, 2009 Posted March 3, 2009 A failed nation is not attributable to just a failed leadership. Its as much to do with its failed citizens. One good look at the rival boards frequented by Pak citizens tells you the tale. Most of its citizens are expressing condolences and praying to Allah for the Lankan cricketers and their families. Fair enough. Others are cussing at the terrorists for denying them their beloved game for the forseeable future. But is anyone thinking about the BIG picture ? Obviously NOT! You cant fight isolated incidents to quell terrorism. You have to go after its roots. And it starts with acknowledging that there is a problem. And where does it all start ? It has to start with the citizens, as public opinion plays a big rolein public policies in Pakistan, esp, in events such as these. After Mumbai attacks, the entire country was busy denying its links, inspite of the compelling evidence that was emerging.Even now, there is no sight of any punishment meted out to the perpetrators who were behind the Mumbai mayhem. And all the while the great citizens of Terroristan were shabashing its govt's stand & how they didnt get bullied by the Indian govt. Did anyone say big picture ? Shhhh! And what do we see after what is arguably one of the most pathetic attacks of recent times ? Its icons such as Imran Khan appearing on national television & suggesting that Tamil Tigers could have played a hand in this. Failed citzens maketh a failed nation. Well said Bumper!!
King Tendulkar Posted March 3, 2009 Posted March 3, 2009 A failed nation is not attributable to just a failed leadership. Its as much to do with its failed citizens. One good look at the rival boards frequented by Pak citizens tells you the tale. Most of its citizens are expressing condolences and praying to Allah for the Lankan cricketers and their families. Fair enough. Others are cussing at the terrorists for denying them their beloved game for the forseeable future. But is anyone thinking about the BIG picture ? Obviously NOT! You cant fight isolated incidents to quell terrorism. You have to go after its roots. And it starts with acknowledging that there is a problem. And where does it all start ? It has to start with the citizens, as public opinion plays a big rolein public policies in Pakistan, esp, in events such as these. After Mumbai attacks, the entire country was busy denying its links, inspite of the compelling evidence that was emerging.Even now, there is no sight of any punishment meted out to the perpetrators who were behind the Mumbai mayhem. And all the while the great citizens of Terroristan were shabashing its govt's stand & how they didnt get bullied by the Indian govt. Did anyone say big picture ? Shhhh! And what do we see after what is arguably one of the most pathetic attacks of recent times ? Its icons such as Imran Khan appearing on national television & suggesting that Tamil Tigers could have played a hand in this. Failed citzens maketh a failed nation. Exactly
King Tendulkar Posted March 3, 2009 Posted March 3, 2009 All this talk of paks being victims of terrorism must stop. They created the monster which has turned on them. Also the pak people must also not be allowed to be potrayed as innocent victims. Many have supported the jihadis for decades in all senses, some just morally, others in more pro active ways. They were quite happy when they were hitting non pak citizens.
beetle Posted March 3, 2009 Posted March 3, 2009 A failed nation is not attributable to just a failed leadership. Its as much to do with its failed citizens. One good look at the rival boards frequented by Pak citizens tells you the tale. Most of its citizens are expressing condolences and praying to Allah for the Lankan cricketers and their families. Fair enough. Others are cussing at the terrorists for denying them their beloved game for the forseeable future. But is anyone thinking about the BIG picture ? Obviously NOT! You cant fight isolated incidents to quell terrorism. You have to go after its roots. And it starts with acknowledging that there is a problem. And where does it all start ? It has to start with the citizens, as public opinion plays a big rolein public policies in Pakistan, esp, in events such as these. After Mumbai attacks, the entire country was busy denying its links, inspite of the compelling evidence that was emerging.Even now, there is no sight of any punishment meted out to the perpetrators who were behind the Mumbai mayhem. And all the while the great citizens of Terroristan were shabashing its govt's stand & how they didnt get bullied by the Indian govt. Did anyone say big picture ? Shhhh! And what do we see after what is arguably one of the most pathetic attacks of recent times ? Its icons such as Imran Khan appearing on national television & suggesting that Tamil Tigers could have played a hand in this. Failed citzens maketh a failed nation. So true......
Ram Posted March 3, 2009 Posted March 3, 2009 what goes around, comes around. For years, Pakistan blissfully manouvred Islamic terorrism to serve as an instrument of state policy of cross-border terrorism. Now, the same chicks that they help hatch are back to lay more eggs and they're simply clueless as to what to do.
Holysmoke Posted March 3, 2009 Posted March 3, 2009 The first step to solving a problem is admitting you have one.
Sachinism Posted March 3, 2009 Posted March 3, 2009 They're too busy living in denial and playing victim to actually get to the root, its a shame.
cochise Posted March 3, 2009 Posted March 3, 2009 They have to deny the true reality...if they were to take an honest appraisal of themselves, the facade of an identity that they have constructed for themselves would come crashing down...at root, they suffer from an identity crisis. They exist in a Catch-22 world...if they are honest with themselves, the Pak identity as it stands will collapse and if they are not honest with themselves, the Pak nation as it stands will collapse. One or the other will soon give.
cowboysfan Posted March 3, 2009 Posted March 3, 2009 the problem is one of the greatest this world faced in more than 50 years.how do you fight an enemy who is not afraid to die and actually welcomes it.If the pakistan government doesnt do some thing about it (some tangible action)than the world would be forced to take more direct action instead of some drones hitting nameless terrorists.the tipping point has not been reached but the terrorists will ensure that it will and pakistan will see more collateral damage than ever before.
The Outsider Posted March 3, 2009 Posted March 3, 2009 As I wrote in another thread their leadership is striking deals with the Taliban - ok that's failed leadership for you, but what about the citizens. There have hardly been any protests against a decision of this magnitude. The problem is that for last 20 years they were keeping quiet blissfully watching their country export terror to us in the name of helping their Kashmiri "brothers". What they did not realize is that this kind of fundamentalist mentality can never be controlled. Unless crushed the hardliners and Taliban will not stop till they have their hands on the most prized possession of the Islamic world - the nuclear bomb.
cochise Posted March 3, 2009 Posted March 3, 2009 the problem is one of the greatest this world faced in more than 50 years.how do you fight an enemy who is not afraid to die and actually welcomes it. What you are describing is a suicidal enemy, not a fearless enemy...there is a subtle distinction. With such an enemy, the demise is assured of it's own course...what needs to be done is limiting the damage to others.
beetle Posted March 3, 2009 Posted March 3, 2009 Pakistan is a country on a suicide mission.Unfortunately we are it's neighbour.
cowboysfan Posted March 3, 2009 Posted March 3, 2009 What you are describing is a suicidal enemy, not a fearless enemy...there is a subtle distinction. With such an enemy, the demise is assured of it's own course...what needs to be done is limiting the damage to others. how do you figure that?-they are suicidal and they have never ending recruits.the 1st step will be cut off the source-money and madrassas and training camps for the terrorists.The taliban should be eliminated from this earth.their version of islam if implemented in more parts of pakistan will be a disaster for india.
veer Posted March 3, 2009 Posted March 3, 2009 indeed true..ordinary citizens wanna support hardliners in UK, they wanna support bravado of those in Waziristan, they wanna support militants in kashmir, they wanna deny Mumbai attacks... but they dont see the link between this THINKING, THE MIND SET, THE DENIAL.. with these attacks.... religion is also the culprit... yeahh deny it all you want.. and dont even start on their govt playing double game infront of world.. they think world is not seeing that.. the country has done no good for this world... just destruction n more destruction... I heard on BBC this morning .. a foreign minister to UK was asked.. isnt it shame that you can not protect foreigners in your country.. his answer was ''look there is no country in world guarantee foreigner's security.. its just not pakistan..'' i mean WAT THE ___
vroomfondel Posted March 3, 2009 Posted March 3, 2009 So why the sudden hyperbole about Pakistan? Did we not know this since pre-kargil, pre-kashmir '89? Or is it now that cricketers instead of normal people have been hit that we can safely say that Pak is going to the dogs. Btw, I see a lot of self-congratulation around. You know, the "look at us, woh kahaan hum kahaan", but all that is unfounded. If (or when ) Pakistan splits up or goes haywire, India and Afghanistan will be the only two countries that will pay the immediate cost. It is a huge strategic failure on India's part to let this happen. All we do have done is sit around letting our military rot and scoring self-goals left and right, making pretty dossiers about evidence that Pak is screwy and air-mailing it to three successive US administrations. By luck or by chance, or pakistani incompetence, we have managed to survive the onslaught but the ante is going to be upped and I'm not sure what kind of toll it will take on India. Shouldn't this be in chit-chat btw? let's keep at least this board politics-free...
The Outsider Posted March 3, 2009 Posted March 3, 2009 The security turned out to be a huge farce - fine you cannot intercept all plans beforehand to foul them, but how the hell do people loaded with guns, bombs, and ammunition get within a few meters of a presidential level security target? And what's more all of them escape - not a single one killed or arrested out of 12-14. Even Mendis would have managed to bring down a few if he had gun. The only people who come out good in this is those guards who put their lives on the line to save the cricketers.
vroomfondel Posted March 3, 2009 Posted March 3, 2009 The security turned out to be a huge farce - fine you cannot intercept all plans beforehand to foul them' date=' but how the hell do people loaded with guns, bombs, and ammunition get within a few meters of a presidential level security target? And what's more all of them escape - not a single one killed or arrested out of 12-14. Even Mendis would have managed to bring down a few if he had gun. The only people who come out good in this is those guards who put their lives on the line to save the cricketers.[/quote'] Dude, the whole point is that there are ppl inside pakistan with differing agendas. There are ppl who want to secure, and a significant majority that want to use the violence to gain power. This has nothing to do with security arrangements or ability to secure. It is the will that is missing. Imagine this: The bus got blown up by RPGs and many ppl perished. What do you think would have happened? Military coup? Probably. As it stands, I would expect the civilian govt to consolidate power by a) blaming India and b) creating a border crisis or attack in India (not even sure the civilian govt has the ability to do it, but assuming it still has some power left)
Dhondy Posted March 3, 2009 Posted March 3, 2009 Btw, I see a lot of self-congratulation around. You know, the "look at us, woh kahaan hum kahaan", but all that is unfounded. If (or when ) Pakistan splits up or goes haywire, India and Afghanistan will be the only two countries that will pay the immediate cost. It is a huge strategic failure on India's part to let this happen. ...but the ante is going to be upped and I'm not sure what kind of toll it will take on India. Cliche. South Korea , West Germany and the Republic of Ireland have lived with turbulence at their borders for decades and remain (or remained) stable and relatively untouched. Besides, Pakistan is as unstable as it gets. This is the nadir.
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