India struggling to find quality spinners-Laxman

[Feed]

Buried under a standout performance by the Karnataka new ball bowlers and a scintillating Ranji Trophy final is a chilling fact. There are just two spinners — Mumbai’s Iqbal Abdullah and UP’s Piyush Chawla — in the list of top 10 wicket-takers in the Elite Division. Take a look beyond the top 10 and signs aren’t much encouraging either, reports Atreyo Mukhopadhyay. More... Where have all the spinners gone? Atreyo Mukhopadhyay, Hindustan Times Kolkata, January 26, 2010 Buried under a standout performance by the Karnataka new ball bowlers and a scintillating Ranji Trophy final is a chilling fact. There are just two spinners — Mumbai’s Iqbal Abdullah and UP’s Piyush Chawla — in the list of top 10 wicket-takers in the Elite Division. Take a look beyond the top 10 and signs aren’t much encouraging either. Does it mean India’s spin bowling stocks are dwindling? Does it mean pitches in India are becoming less helpful for them? Does it mean Indian batsmen are playing spin better than before? Is there any other reason? Or is it that the spinners aren’t being properly groomed because of which many get reported for suspect action every year? HT spoke to a few people in the know of things to try and find an answer. A national selector, who didn’t want to be named because he isn’t authorized to speak to the media, blamed it on the dearth of options. “We simply don’t have any. The situation is so bad, that if we have to replace any of the three spinners now touring Bangladesh for the series against South Africa, we won’t have any. You may take names, but they are not good enough to make an impact at the highest level.” The selector’s words were echoed by Paras Mhambrey, who has seen domestic cricket from close as coach of Maharashtra, Bengal and Baroda apart from being a pillar of the Mumbai team in his playing days. “It’s particularly bad when it comes to left-arm spinners and leg-spinners. We (Baroda) had to look for a left-armer when Rajesh Pawar was called for chucking, but didn’t find any. Sunil Joshi is still around, but he’s too old. Even the only genuine off-spinner Ramesh Powar isn’t getting younger.” Tamil Nadu coach W.V. Raman said it’s a combination of things. “We have seen a few spinners emerging, but how a captain handles a spinner is also very important. Young spinners should play longer games. I don’t think talent is a problem.” Mumbai coach Praveen Amre offered a slightly different take. Lack of talent, he said, isn’t the problem; grooming them is. “Abdullah was among the wickets this season, Delhi left-armer Vikas Mishra had a match haul of 10 against us, Tamil Nadu teenager R. Aushik Srinivas took seven wickets in an innings against us too. Then, our Harmeet Singh too was impressive.” Amre said these bowlers are all below 20 and the fact that they have taken wickets against quality sides even at a time when the emphasis on preparing seam-friendly wickets, means there’s hope. “Most teams are preparing pitches to suit fast bowlers so that they can force results. That some young spinners have still done well means the talent is there.” The former India batsman’s next statement was pivotal and unlikely to please those who run Indian cricket. “There is too much emphasis on T20, which can impede the development of young spinners. They should be exposed to T20 judiciously.” Whether a legacy in Indian cricket continues to survive, might depend on that.

[Feed]

"We don't rely on spin" : Srikkanth India’s selection committee chairman, Kris Srikkanth, talks to Kadambari Murali Wadeahead of the big series against South Africa next week. More... INTERVIEW KRIS SRIKKANTH - We don't rely on spin Kadambari Murali Wade India's selection committee chairman, Kris Srikkanth, talks to HT ahead of the big series against South Africa next week. It's good to see Zaheer in form on what's been a batting wicket? It's been really good. It's very, very important for us that our best bowlers are in form and rhythm ahead of facing South Africa and Zaheer has been our strike bowler for the last couple of years. He has had some major fitness problems, but has got himself back in shape and shaped up very well. Is the lack of spinning options a worry? (Pauses) Spinning options... well, we at least have variety and whoever's come in has delivered. It's a good thing that we don't depend on spin now. But we have a good bunch of pacemen and honestly, as long as the combination works, it's not a worry. We're consistently combining well (pace and spin) and that's what matters. One criticism of India is that they let the opposition get away, like when Tamim Iqbal and Junaid Siddique were batting on Tuesday. Sometimes you have to give credit to the opposition. Tamim batted very well. We have to accept that every now and then, there is going to be resistance from the opposition. As long as we're able to finish it, we are doing okay. Injuries are a serious issue ahead of taking on a strong South Africa unit. Yes, injuries are a big problem and a major cause for concern. I'll know more about who exactly is available when I get to the meeting (in Mumbai on Thursday), but the good thing is that our bench strength has been slowly rising. Whether they are fresh faces or known reserves, they have been able to step in and deliver consistently. That's been a big plus for us. But will someone be able to step in for say, a Rahul Dravid? A guy like Rahul Dravid or a Tendulkar is an all-time great, so no, it's not easy to replace good cricketers. Till such time that Rahul regains fitness, we have some choices and it's always good to have a situation where people are fighting for places through the domestic circuit. What we'll look for is someone who can step in and do reasonably well as a standby. Now, this has to be asked. Is Dhoni's fitness a worry -- especially with his on-off back issues? I don't know, I can't really comment on that. After all, when you're playing so much cricket, everyone's cricket, everyone's bound to develop som niggles. But it's something he'll (Dhoni) have to take a call on himself and find out what kind of rest he needs. Take someone like Zaheer. He decided he needed a break, took it and came back fitter and stronger. Sehwag went through a break. But it has to be a decision made by a player himself. It's up to what's in a player's mind and his individual choice. Traditionally, there's no vicecaptain for an India series. But are we looking at grooming someone young with a longterm view? No, not at the moment. Sehwag has done a very good job for us whenever he's been called upon to step in (for Dhoni). He's captained well, so we're going to continue with that for now.

[thevortex]

Srikkanth neatly sidestepped the 'spin' question :). Nevertheless India should be very worried at the sparseness of the serious spinners. This is a time like no other. It is very good for a nation traditionally strong in spin to lust after and persevere to produce quality fast bowlers. But that should not be at the cost of the spin strength! ________ LIVE SEX WEBSHOWS

[Lord]

India struggling to find quality spinners-Laxman VVS Laxman, the Indian batsman, has expressed concern over the lack of quality spinners on India's domestic circuit, a problem he feels will be a "worrying factor" for the Indian team. Speaking on Cricinfo's latest video show Opening Up, Laxman was more optimistic about India's batting reserves and was bullish on the survival of Test cricket. However, his comments on India's spin talent pool will cause concern, given how large spinners loom in India's Test legend. Speaking on the gap between international and domestic cricket in India, Laxman said: "The Indian cricket team is struggling to find some quality spinners, apart from the guys who are playing. You will find that there is no bench strength as far as spinners are concerned. So definitely the quality of domestic cricket has come down in terms of the bowling department." Later, speaking about young talent, Laxman repeated his concern. "I am really not happy with the bowlers I am seeing. I think the quality of bowlers, especially the spinners will definitely be a worrying factor for the Indian team." Laxman was optimistic, however, about India's talent in batting, the likes of Suresh Raina and Rohit Sharma, who've had international experience, and Ambati Rayudu of Hyderabad. But he emphasised the key to success lay in the ability to play long innings. "I think Rohit and Raina are very good. Ambati Rayadu from Hyderabad has got very good potential," he said. "It's good that he has come back now, after playing in the ICL. It's just a matter of time; if he plays to his potential then he will make it to the higher grade. Rahul Dravid keeps mentioning about some players from Bangalore who are very talented. So it is a good future for India, as far as batting is concerned. "I think for any youngster, you have to practice right from the younger days to [play a] long innings. And that's something that I don't see nowadays in the Ranji Trophy. I don't see too many double-hundreds, too many big hundreds. When we started off, there were lot of double-hundreds, not only from the Test cricketers but also domestic cricketers. I would definitely advice them to play long innings in the four-day format. And once they have the temperament, they can adapt to any form of the game." Amid the growing popularity of the Twenty20 format, Laxman said Test cricket still remained the most sought-after version in the eyes of the players and dismissed any threats over its future. He added that the current generation of cricketers still rated Tests as the best determinant of one's quality. Instead, he expressed doubt over the survival of the 50-over version with the advent of Twenty20 cricket. "Test cricket is still a very important form of cricket for all cricketers," Laxman said. "Even though Tests are becoming fewer, all cricketers, even the present generation, want to play more Tests. Everyone knows Test cricket remains the real test of a player's character, skill and temperament. "Irrespective of how many runs they get in Twenty20 or one-day cricket, everyone feels that only when they do well in Tests will they have a stature in the game. Everyone knows that their ultimate reputation is in Test cricket." The dwindling interest in 50-over cricket among fans and players alike, Laxman said, was an issue of concern. "I think one-day cricket will be under threat, because people want to watch good quality of cricket," he said. "Over five days they will watch some quality players playing against each other, so definitely Test cricket will stay. But one-day cricket will be under pressure, especially after the advent of Twenty20. I am sure ICC will take necessary steps to make it more interesting."

[cowboysfan]

once again we have the BCCI and team selection to blame.Mishra who is in the squad cant seem to nail down a spot in test matches in subcontinent even when he peforms.the pattafication of wickets in India are not helping the spinners either.Nobody wants to be just a spinner anymore,there is no real value for them in limited overs cricket as we are seeing more allrounders take up their spots.the future is indeed bleak.

[Sir john]

A country of spin bowler is struggling.

[Sachinism]

its true we lack a top class spinner, every spinner we have now is mediocre

[Ram]

Out b4 the proponents of 'fast bouncy pitches in India' come in and shout their throats hoarse for such pitches so that we can produce fast bowlers. If our pitches are slow and low now, why arent we producing enough quality spinners as VVS claims? :winky:

[graphic23]

Morris, how many spinners do you know that enjoy bowling slow, low, flat pattas that remain the same over the span of 5 days?

[vvvslaxman]

Indian spinners are better than spinners around the world. But we are bad compared to our own spinners from the past. But if you look at it apart from Kumble we had no decent spinners in the last 15 years if you ignore Bhajji who is a massive failure against Asian teams. I still think wrist spin always has value even if it is not exactly world class. Chawla and Mishra must capitalize on the lack of decent leggies around the world.

[Ram]

Morris' date=' how many spinners do you know that enjoy bowling slow, low, flat pattas that remain the same over the span of 5 days?[/quote'] The pitches are reportedly slow and low only now, but what about the 90s and early 2000s? Back then, nobody was complaining our pitches were getting slower and lower. But, how many quality spinners did we produce in the 1990-2005 time-frame? Anil Kumble, Harbhajan Singh? Would you like to know which bowler was the 3rd highest wicket in the 2000s decade, among all Indian spinners? Sachin Tendulkar.. Nuff said. As opposed to that, the 90s and 2000s saw the emergence of Srinath, Zak, Irfan, Sreesanth, Agarkar, Ishant and a host of other fast bowlers. Fact is, there's no direct evidence that co-relates certain type of pitches producing certain type of bowlers.

[vvvslaxman]

Wadekar-Azhar period was the worst i think between 1993-1997. They started having these crumblers after twin debacle in Australia and SA. Kumble would be unplayable then 1993-1997 home tests 70% of the wickets went to spinners. http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/engine/stats/index.html?class=1;home_or_away=1;spanmax1=31+Dec+1997;spanmin1=01+Jan+1993;spanval1=span;team=6;template=results;type=bowling

[thevortex]

Morris' date=' how many spinners do you know that enjoy bowling slow, low, flat pattas that remain the same over the span of 5 days?[/quote'] For a spinner, at least 50 % of the work is done in the air. Only for the rest should he depend on the surface. Please note I said 'at least 50%'. The really good ones, often do almost 80% of their work leading up to the batsman's dismissal in the air. Very clearly, there is no spinner in India currently who likes to give the ball air. A shame. Even Powar who loved that is now pushing the ball through like the rest.

[vvvslaxman]

This Srilankan guy Suraj. I liked his willingness to flight the ball even in ODIs without worrying about batsmen hitting him out of the park. I like to see how other young spinners bowl.

[The Outsider]

The pitches are reportedly slow and low only now, but what about the 90s and early 2000s? Back then, nobody was complaining our pitches were getting slower and lower. But, how many quality spinners did we produce in the 1990-2005 time-frame? Anil Kumble, Harbhajan Singh? Would you like to know which bowler was the 3rd highest wicket in the 2000s decade, among all Indian spinners? Sachin Tendulkar.. Nuff said.

Kartik, Sarandeep, Powar, Raju were all decent spinners who would been the first or second best spinners in all countries except Australia for most of that time period. They did not play much for India because only 2 spinners play at the most, 1 abroad.

Fact is, there's no direct evidence that co-relates certain type of pitches producing certain type of bowlers.

That is one of the most absurd statements I've read. I don't even know where to start to rebut this but can you explain why New Zealand and England have not produced any wrist spinners or Australia any good finger spinners for starters?

[saneindian]

In Bhajji, Ojha, Mishra, Chawla, Ashwin, Powar we have got enough spin talent in the country to cover the base for next 8-10 years. Then there is the younger lot of Vikas Mishra, Abdullah, Srinivas and Harmeet Singh who with proper guidance will become better spinners. Thats a pool of about 10 spinners we are talking about. How about getting some of them into a spin clinic run by someone like Bedi, Prasanna and Chandra and help them hone their skills? Also give any of the spinners in bolded letters a spinning track like we used to have in the 80s and 90s and trust me they will bundle out the opposition as easily as Kumble used to do at home in the 90s. On the north vs south bias in team India, well give me 15 players from Tripura Meghalaya , Pondicheryy or even Andaman and Lakhshwadeep all capable of doing well for the country and I will have no problem at all in supporting them. Can't quite understand what the fuss is all about.

[achilles]

On the north vs south bias in team India' date=' well give me 15 players from Tripura Meghalaya , Pondicheryy or even Andaman and Lakhshwadeep all capable of doing well for the country and I will have no problem at all in supporting them. Can't quite understand what the fuss is all about.[/quote'] Exactly. Pick players on talent. Not because they hail from a particular part of India the Chief Selector is from. This is the INDIAN NATIONAL TEAM, not some Regional team where you pick 6 players and justify it by making comparisons to the past selection committee's. If you run someone over and say, "So what, there are around 1lakh people who run over people in a year", it doesn't make you look smart, coz its a stupid argument.

[graphic23]

Do you think Ojha is that useless that bias is the only way he'll get in? The Chief Selector SHOULD have chosen Vijay over Yuvraj for the past couple of tests then. That didn't happen. He SHOULD've chosen Abhinav Mukund, R Ashwin, and a bunch of other south zone players. He didn't. Mishra's been part of the squad for a while now. Unless you've got proof that Dhoni is biased (apart from Yuvraj, I dont see any obvious ones here), keep your conspiracy theories to yourself.

[saneindian]

Do you think Ojha is that useless that bias is the only way he'll get in? The Chief Selector SHOULD have chosen Vijay over Yuvraj for the past couple of tests then. That didn't happen. He SHOULD've chosen Abhinav Mukund' date= R Ashwin, and a bunch of other south zone players. He didn't. Mishra's been part of the squad for a while now. Unless you've got proof that Dhoni is biased (apart from Yuvraj, I dont see any obvious ones here), keep your conspiracy theories to yourself.

Didn't Yuvraj score 67 and 68 in the first 2 tests vs SL with his knock in the 1st innings coming at a very crucial time in the first test when we were 4 down for nothing? What makes you think he should have been dropped after those two performances? Just because he failed in the 3rd test vs SL? That would have been unjust.

[Pak_Forever]

Mishra should be given an extended run. Out of all he's the only one who looks threatening and someone for the future.