akshayxyz Posted April 1, 2011 Posted April 1, 2011 Convicting some one of ****.. that too someone as rich as Shiney ( I m sure he must have tried is level best so far) can mean only two things : a) there is some irrefutable ( or very very strong) evidence. b) The maid is very clever and has some strong back up.
Mariyam Posted April 1, 2011 Posted April 1, 2011 Mariyam, you make some good points about the technicality. So since you seem to be a lawyer in the making, how does the law differentiate between ra.pe and consent? Do they do a lie-detector test or simply take the words of the woman on face value? Coz I guess they simply take it on face-value and put 2 and 2 together. I read about a case a few years back, similar case. The guy was thrown in prison for 12 years and then the woman's lie came to the notice of the police. She destroyed a man and his family's life. Achilles, in that earlier post I have linked a pdf, which explains what kind of forensic tests can confirm ****. There are tests which can distinguish between consensual sex and non consensual sex. I don't think anyone goes for a lie detector unless explicitly stated by the court. And in the current Indian set up, the results of a lie detector/ polygraph alone are not enough to convict someone. For eg, One fine day Mariyam gets angry and whacks YoungIndia on the head with a candlestick killing him on the spot. YoungIndia's good friend, Achilles has a hunch and tells the cops that it could be Mariyam, who have been utterly unable to make any inroads into the murder case. There is no circumstantial evidence or anything linking her to the murder and if you administer a polygraph test on Mariyam and find that she has indeed murdered YoungIndia, you cannot go ahead and punish her. However, along with some other evidence/ witness reports, you can use the results of a polygraph as the clincher. Here too, if the polygraph was used, it was used in conjunction with some strong evidence. What Shiney did was quite ridiculous. But there is a massive difference between ra.pe and consensual sex. The stigma attached with ra.pe can haunt a man equally all his life. Agreed' date=' he screwed up. But where is the evidence that the woman is not trying to get back to him or something?[/quote'] The evidence apparently is in the results of the forensic tests. I don't think at all that there is any 'framing' being done here. I haven't missed Mood I or Malhar for the last 5-6 years.
straighttalk Posted April 1, 2011 Posted April 1, 2011 any kind of intercourse cause very minor abrasions in the vagina. the direction as well as the degree of these abrasions vary when the woman willingly lets a man in and when she resists. that is how forceful entry is differentiated. then angle of the womans body varies when she resists a man and when she enjoys it.
DomainK Posted April 2, 2011 Posted April 2, 2011 any kind of intercourse cause very minor abrasions in the vagina. the direction as well as the degree of these abrasions vary when the woman willingly lets a man in and when she resists. that is how forceful entry is differentiated. then angle of the womans body varies when she resists a man and when she enjoys it. See, the problem with **** cases is that it does not leave bodily injuries in every case. For example, blackmail. If a woman is blackmailed into consenting to sleep with the blackmailer, it would amount to **** as consent given under duress or undue pressure is not valid consent. Also, sometimes the woman is too scared to put up a physical fight. Fear/trauma can render a human being helpless to the extent of unconsciousness. Then you have cases of physical torture that does not leave injuries behind. There can be several cases where a woman is forced into sex without proper consent, but not necessarily involving physical force. In such cases the prosecution will not find bodily injuries. **** cases are always very complicated for this very reason- the intercourse is easy to prove, but the lack of consent is not.
straighttalk Posted April 2, 2011 Posted April 2, 2011 i am not fully aware of the law..but if the consent is given under blackmail, it may not be construed as **** unless the blackmail was some kind of video of compromising situation. i am not condoning it and it is unethical but the woman has the free will to say no and face the consequences or say yes, which is unfortunate.
Guest Gunner Posted April 3, 2011 Posted April 3, 2011 how does the law differentiate between ra.pe and consent? Do they do a lie-detector test or simply take the words of the woman on face value? The same way as you and I do. The fact that you are a young man in your 20s and you need to ask this question is just appalling. It continues to reinforce my belief that India is an immature country at best.
punjabi_khota Posted April 3, 2011 Posted April 3, 2011 i am not fully aware of the law..but if the consent is given under blackmail' date= it may not be construed as **** unless the blackmail was some kind of video of compromising situation. i am not condoning it and it is unethical but the woman has the free will to say no and face the consequences or say yes, which is unfortunate. Wrong. It is ****.
Mariyam Posted April 3, 2011 Posted April 3, 2011 There can be several cases where a woman is forced into sex without proper consent, but not necessarily involving physical force. In such cases the prosecution will not find bodily injuries. **** cases are always very complicated for this very reason- the intercourse is easy to prove, but the lack of consent is not. True. But forensics are not the be all and end all of such cases. In the cases you mention the victim's testimony, circumstantial evidence and what witnesses (if any) or people present in the vicinity at the time have to say holds a lot of value. And generally, the defense lawyers will grill the victim on the exact conditions of black mail/ duress etc. It is not easy to fabricate an entire story based on a blackmail and convincingly lie about it in a foolproof manner. Generally by the second or third time a person is grilled, the incongruence in the statements (if any) are found out.
Guest Gunner Posted April 3, 2011 Posted April 3, 2011 True. But forensics are not the be all and end all of such cases. In the cases you mention the victim's testimony' date=' circumstantial evidence and what witnesses (if any) or people present in the vicinity at the time have to say holds a lot of value. [b']And generally, the defense lawyers will grill the victim on the exact conditions of black mail/ duress etc. It is not easy to fabricate an entire story based on a blackmail and convincingly lie about it in a foolproof manner. Generally by the second or third time a person is grilled, the incongruence in the statements (if any) are found out. You mean put the victim on trial.
CSK Fan Posted April 4, 2011 Author Posted April 4, 2011 The same way as you and I do. The fact that you are a young man in your 20s and you need to ask this question is just appalling. It continues to reinforce my belief that India is an immature country at best. Yep, the cases of r@.pe, abuse and molestation are so chronic in our country that we are much better off taking the women's side. If you consider the stigma and orcastration associtated with r@.pe its in the rarest of rare cases women will falsely accuse someone ofr@.peAnd in those cases its easily proved. Lets not put the victim on trial here
Guest Gunner Posted April 4, 2011 Posted April 4, 2011 Yep' date=' the cases of r@.pe, abuse and molestation are so chronic in our country that we are much better off taking the women's side. If you consider the stigma and orcastration associtated with r@.pe its in the rarest of rare cases women will falsely accuse someone ofr@.peAnd in those cases its easily proved. Lets not put the victim on trial here[/quote'] From what I see here some of the guys seem to believe it is some sort of secret weapon for women. They have no idea about the trauma and mental implications of a sexual assault, hell I am not even talking baout society here. I am just shocked we still talk like this.
DomainK Posted April 28, 2011 Posted April 28, 2011 Shiney now gets bail based on the points we were discussing: 1. The appeal in the higher court will take a long time. 2. The victim has categorically said that she was not raped. 3. Lack of injuries. 4. Lack of medical proof. (it seems the medical officer in charge messed up. I have no idea how they keep messing up on such basic routine things). If the above four are true, I have no idea how he was convicted and I can not see how the higher court will uphold the sentence.
Anonymous Posted April 28, 2011 Posted April 28, 2011 From what I see here some of the guys seem to believe it is some sort of secret weapon for women. They have no idea about the trauma and mental implications of a sexual assault' date=' hell I am not even talking baout society here. I am just shocked we still talk like this.[/quote'] Exactly...there is more to sexual assault than just temporary physical trauma..Heck, even minor assaults can have a huge impact on a woman's psyche.... Speaking from personal experience, a dutch friend who had come to India on a tour called another friend of mine in India in the middle of the night after two men forcibly entered her room and tried to assault her. She locked herself up in the toilet and called for help. This was in Mahabalipuram near Chennai and she was in India to teach poor kids at a NGO run school. I was shattered because I had recommended that she visit India. It was so traumatic that she left India the next day. For **** sake when will some of us ever grow up and not look at every caucasian woman as a pornstar....Its an altogether a different story for women in India as they face these kind of traumatic incidents day in and day out, especially on public transport...
rahulrulezz Posted April 29, 2011 Posted April 29, 2011 Exactly...there is more to sexual assault than just temporary physical trauma..Heck, even minor assaults can have a huge impact on a woman's psyche.... Speaking from personal experience, a dutch friend who had come to India on a tour called another friend of mine in India in the middle of the night after two men forcibly entered her room and tried to assault her. She locked herself up in the toilet and called for help. This was in Mahabalipuram near Chennai and she was in India to teach poor kids at a NGO run school. I was shattered because I had recommended that she visit India. It was so traumatic that she left India the next day. For **** sake when will some of us ever grow up and not look at every caucasian woman as a pornstar....Its an altogether a different story for women in India as they face these kind of traumatic incidents day in and day out, especially on public transport... Seriously sad and angry after reading this... Balls of these freaking tharkis should be choppped off!!
fineleg Posted April 29, 2011 Posted April 29, 2011 especially on public transport... There are indeed lots of hooligans on a day to day basis on public transport. They need to be jailed and thrashed.
zen Posted April 29, 2011 Posted April 29, 2011 What's Shiney's wife reaction on this? Is she ok with her hubby raping/sleeping with a maid?
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