Whose Retirement has or will leave the biggest hole in Indian cricket

[CSK Fan]

He rarely plays Odis. And we win ODIs without him with ease. He wont be missed one bit in ODIs.

Wait till the nxt time we play ODIs outside the sub-continent, we all know Dhoni's immense contributions there and who did what in last 10 ODI series abroad

[Crookbond]

Wait till the nxt time we play ODIs outside the sub-continent' date= we all know Dhoni's immense contributions there and who did what in last 10 ODI series abroad

Seriously? I think you are confusing between formats. He was the highest run scorer in the ODI series in England from both sides [1]. You are asking from objectivity from others but losing that yourself. [1] http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/records/batting/most_runs_career.html?id=6114;type=series

[Trichromatic]

There you go again. I can bring countless examples in the past where from the same "dominating" position we easily lost the test. Give some credit to the rest of the batsmen too who scored some 250 runs otherwise that start would have just remained a start like in the 100s of time in the past and would have only changed the orgasms you have every time Sehwag's name is mentioned BTW, love the way fans think here. Sachin brings India to about 17 runs of the target and gets out in the Chennai innings. He is blamed no end for the team losing because of the incompetence of the rest of the bats. Sehwag scores a whirlwind 80 and gets out leaving us still 250+ on the last day. Sachins cores a 100, but all credit is to Sehwag who single-handedly won us the game. Yeah, right

[saneindian]

8-0 thrashings even with the big 4 in the squad have really set the bar low for the future generation. Even if we avoid a whitewash on our next away tours, that will still be seen as an improvement. Any away test win will be a cause of celebration when the test side is in the transition phase. The ODI side has moved on from the stalwarts and the test side will also do so, though it may take a little longer.

[saneindian]

Wait till the nxt time we play ODIs outside the sub-continent' date=' we all know Dhoni's immense contributions there and who did what in last 10 ODI series abroad[/quote'] Since Dhoni's debut, this is how the stats look like for ODIs played outside Asia for our batsmen http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/stats/index.html?class=2;continent=1;continent=3;continent=4;continent=5;filter=advanced;orderby=runs;spanmax1=25+Aug+2012;spanmin1=25+Aug+2004;spanval1=span;team=6;template=results;type=batting If an avg of 42 is what you term as "Dhoni's immense contributions there" wonder what you have to say about someone with an avg of 41 :winky:

[Ultimate_Game]

Seriously? I think you are confusing between formats. He was the highest run scorer in the ODI series in England from both sides [1]. You are asking from objectivity from others but losing that yourself. [1] http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/records/batting/most_runs_career.html?id=6114;type=series

Since Dhoni's debut, this is how the stats look like for ODIs played outside Asia for our batsmen http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/stats/index.html?class=2;continent=1;continent=3;continent=4;continent=5;filter=advanced;orderby=runs;spanmax1=25+Aug+2012;spanmin1=25+Aug+2004;spanval1=span;team=6;template=results;type=batting If an avg of 42 is what you term as "Dhoni's immense contributions there" wonder what you have to say about someone with an avg of 41 :winky:

Dhoni has been our best odi batsman since his debut and the way we have started chasing without nerves and have become one of the better odi sides is not a coincidence. We set a record for 18 consecutive successful chases after Dhoni broke through in the team and we all know how India used to be at chasing before Dhoni :giggle: Anything over 220 and there was no guarantee we would win and anythng over 250 was almost game over for us. The way Dhoni is slated here despite playing one of the best innings under pressure to chase the highest total in A World Cup final proves the saying "ghar ki murgi daal barabar". People act as if Dhoni hasn't done much and can be replaced easily when all the evidence suggests to the contrary. Simply look at our stats for 90s and before Dhoni while chasing and you will get the answer. Now the match isn't over at the toss and we don't have to bat first and put up a total to win the match like we used to.

[Sid]

Looks like uber pwnage has been served worth two cents.

[The Outsider]

There you go again. I can bring countless examples in the past where from the same "dominating" position we easily lost the test. Give some credit to the rest of the batsmen too who scored some 250 runs otherwise that start would have just remained a start like in the 100s of time in the past and would have only changed the orgasms you have every time Sehwag's name is mentioned

Where did anyone take any credit away from Tendulkar? Just because Sehwag's innings, which BTW was the Man of the Match innings in a match where another batsman scored two centuries, is being praised that's a slight to Tendulkar? Can you tell me any other occasion when a genuine attempt to chase a similar target was made by India rather than settling for a draw in recent years? The last such attempt I remember was the '87 tied test.

BTW, love the way fans think here. Sachin brings India to about 17 runs of the target and gets out in the Chennai innings. He is blamed no end for the team losing because of the incompetence of the rest of the bats. Sehwag scores a whirlwind 80 and gets out leaving us still 250+ on the last day. Sachins cores a 100, but all credit is to Sehwag who single-handedly won us the game. Yeah, right

You have completely lost it. Person A says that India lost because of Tendulkar at Chennai. Person B praises Sehwag's innings without making any comment on the Chennai '99 innings of Tendulkar. And you start your fanboy war cry - "Oh look at these fans. The standards of ICF are going down. Tendulkar's credit is being usurped. What idiots". At the very minimum learn to discuss what person A says with person A and what person B says with person B rather than lumping them together into some imaginative monolith of a common mouthpiece.

[Ultimate_Game]

There you go again. I can bring countless examples in the past where from the same "dominating" position we easily lost the test. Give some credit to the rest of the batsmen too who scored some 250 runs otherwise that start would have just remained a start like in the 100s of time in the past and would have only changed the orgasms you have every time Sehwag's name is mentioned BTW, love the way fans think here. Sachin brings India to about 17 runs of the target and gets out in the Chennai innings. He is blamed no end for the team losing because of the incompetence of the rest of the bats. Sehwag scores a whirlwind 80 and gets out leaving us still 250+ on the last day. Sachins cores a 100, but all credit is to Sehwag who single-handedly won us the game. Yeah, right

Why do you have to bring Tendulkar into every discussion and are so defensive about Tendulkar? The poster simply said that the win over England wouldn't have been possible if Sehwag hadn't taken on England as scoring 387 in 110 overs on Day 4 & 5 pitch is not that easy. He didn't say anything whether Tendulkar's contribution was or wasn't important. He was simply putting forth case for Sehwag so can't really see how that post can be construed anti-Tendulkar :dontknow: Between Tendulkar being criticised for getting out 17 runs before th target shows the high bar people have set for him. People expect him to deliver as the best batsman in the world as he was at the time. Knowing fully well he was playing in a team of Kumble/Srinath/Prasad he should have taken us to safety but anyhow that's history. But to be fair that knock is considered his best Test innings and one of the best ever. The reason Sehwag isn't criticised for such indiscretions is as he isn't considered as ood as Tendulkar. Secondly in this case Sehwag opened the innings and he wasn't expected to be unbeaten chasing a target of 400 whereas Tendulkar bats at 4 and it's not unrealistic to have been there at the end while chasing a target of 270 odd.

[Sidhoni]

Wait till the nxt time we play ODIs outside the sub-continent' date=' we all know Dhoni's immense contributions there and who did what in last 10 ODI series abroad[/quote'] Well you have already been pwned by stats. But still, I had to ask this, Why do you bring in MS in every discussion?

[Raghav_12]

Back on topic. I am surprised to see that there is only one vote for Gavaskar. After Gavaskar we still have to find an opener whom we can rely outside India and people don't think his retirement has left any hole.. and fighting for the case of inclusion of Dhoni in the list :hysterical:. For me Kapil and Gavaskar should be the top two choices and in that order. Then rest of the lot.

[rkt.india]

Back on topic. I am surprised to see that there is only one vote for Gavaskar. After Gavaskar we still have to find an opener whom we can rely outside India and people don't think his retirement has left any hole.. and fighting for the case of inclusion of Dhoni in the list :hysterical:. For me Kapil and Gavaskar should be the top two choices and in that order. Then rest of the lot.

Agree completely.

[PaceAttack]

Zak. I just hope we give opportunities to bowlers like Ishant, Umesh and Varun who can develop and lead our Pace Attack in the future.

[Ultimate_Game]

Back on topic. I am surprised to see that there is only one vote for Gavaskar. After Gavaskar we still have to find an opener whom we can rely outside India and people don't think his retirement has left any hole.. and fighting for the case of inclusion of Dhoni in the list :hysterical:. For me Kapil and Gavaskar should be the top two choices and in that order. Then rest of the lot.

To be fair Gavaskar was the first batsman on my list. But there's no way Gavaskar can be ahead of Kapil, Kumble & Zak coz it' the bowlers who primarily win you matches and wkt taking bowlers are worth their weight in gold.

[Vilander]

Gentlemen the OP states " ever to play for India " Tendulkar was MVP for the longest period and was even better than RD in tests for some period as well, definitly longer than Dhoni's MVP position in ODI till WC after which Kohli seems to have taken over.

[Vilander]

Zak. I just hope we give opportunities to bowlers like Ishant' date= Umesh and Varun who can develop and lead our Pace Attack in the future.

add Shami to that..:two_thumbs_up: i love fast bowling.

[Raghav_12]

Naah I would go with Hobbs to partner Gavaskar with no room for Hutton My All Time XI team... Gavaskar Hobbs Bradman © Tendulkar Richards Sobers Gilchrist (wk) Warne Marshall Ambrose McGrath Kallis, Garner, Wasim and Murali to be the other players in the 15 man squad.

I'll go for Hutton ahead of Hobbs, otherwise my XI would be 100% same..:two_thumbs_up:

[Crookbond]

Naah I would go with Hobbs to partner Gavaskar with no room for Hutton My All Time XI team... Gavaskar Hobbs Bradman © Tendulkar Richards Sobers Gilchrist (wk) Warne Marshall Ambrose McGrath Kallis, Garner, Wasim and Murali to be the other players in the 15 man squad.

I will replace Ambrose and McGrath, with Lillee and Wasim Akram. I will also certainly have Ray Lindwall in my 15.