When McGrath mastered the Master

[harmuk]

How are they better batsmen? Firstly their strike rate is nowhere in the ballpark of Sehwag. Secondly, the number of influential innings they have played in comparison to Sehwag are lesser. If Sehwag's average sucks in South Africa, how much has Pietersen averaged there? At least Sehwag has a century there. What about Pakistan? Both Cook and Pietersen were made to look ordinary by Pakistan in UAE as well as Pakistan. Sehwag has a stranglehold on Pakistan - has b!tchslapped them so many times.

Test cricket and S/R? I do not attest much importance to S/R in Test cricket. Coming back to influential knocks, I am sure Cook and KP have their share of them. But that is not the point. Where Shewag sucks is, he being an almost a non-factor in the team 2nd innings, when many a time players are needed to put their hands up and be counted and play as per team needs. He has virtually no game there to curb the attacking game and button it down if needed, as his mediocre 30, 2nd innings average suggests. In fact in the 8000 club with the exception of Stewart, I do not think any sensible person would pick Shewag, when they consider all things needed to pick a solid Test batsman.

[Number]

Test cricket and S/R? I do not attest much importance to S/R in Test cricket. Coming back to influential knocks, I am sure Cook and KP have their share of them. But that is not the point. Where Shewag sucks is, he being an almost a non-factor in the team 2nd innings, when many a time players are needed to put their hands up and be counted and play as per team needs. He has virtually no game there to curb the attacking game and button it down if needed, as his mediocre 30, 2nd innings average suggests. In fact in the 8000 club with the exception of Stewart, I do not think any sensible person would pick Shewag, when they consider all things needed to pick a solid Test batsman.

Steve Waugh also avg 30 in the 2nd innings. Another addition to your glorious 'overrated' list. :two_thumbs_up:

[harmuk]

acc to him Lara, Sachin, Sehwag, Warne all are overrated. Just VVVVVVVVVVVVVVS Laxman is underrated.

Look you do not seem to have enough know-how to get the other persons point of view. And for the record VVS Laxman is indeed underrated. For god's sake he might have played the two best Test knocks in Indian cricket history. Kolkata,2001 (do I need to say anything?) and Durban 2011 when he scored a near century and we won, when none of the players from either teams in both innings combined (40 wickets) crossed a score of 40. And secondly Shewag does not belong in the same sentence where names like SRT, Warne, Lara, Laxman are brought up, when one considers the overall domain of Test cricket.

[vvvslaxman]

Test cricket and S/R? I do not attest much importance to S/R in Test cricket. Coming back to influential knocks, I am sure Cook and KP have their share of them. But that is not the point. Where Shewag sucks is, he being an almost a non-factor in the team 2nd innings, when many a time players are needed to put their hands up and be counted and play as per team needs. He has virtually no game there to curb the attacking game and button it down if needed, as his mediocre 30, 2nd innings average suggests. In fact in the 8000 club with the exception of Stewart, I do not think any sensible person would pick Shewag, when they consider all things needed to pick a solid Test batsman.

How many openers have 150 plus in their careers.. If someone is going to score 150 he invariably sets up a game. For the record Virendar sehwag has highest number of 150s for an opener. 14 of them. Next is Gavaskar 11. Hutton follows him with 10. Amiss 8. Almost scored 3 triple tons. You seriously think those are achievable by "ordinary" batsmen. He has his own weaknesses much like any other batsmen. But he has some gifts that very very few in cricketing history has possessed. If you had forced all those guys (Tendulkar, Lara.. ) to open we will see how exactly they would have shined again shiny red cherry.

[harmuk]

Steve Waugh also avg 30 in the 2nd innings. Another addition to your glorious 'overrated' list. :two_thumbs_up:

He still averages more than 2 points than Shewag. Doesn't he? Considering he never started as a batsman he ended up as, if anyone followed the career graph of Waugh would know, that is not surprising at all. I would take Waugh over Shewag any day of the week when I take into account that Test cricket is played for 5 days and 2 innings with varying intricacies, where a batsman may need to hold up an end for a session for example, where runs are of not the top priority.

[The Outsider]

Test cricket and S/R? I do not attest much importance to S/R in Test cricket. Coming back to influential knocks, I am sure Cook and KP have their share of them. But that is not the point. Where Shewag sucks is, he being an almost a non-factor in the team 2nd innings, when many a time players are needed to put their hands up and be counted and play as per team needs. He has virtually no game there to curb the attacking game and button it down if needed, as his mediocre 30, 2nd innings average suggests. In fact in the 8000 club with the exception of Stewart, I do not think any sensible person would pick Shewag, when they consider all things needed to pick a solid Test batsman.

Test matches are set up in the first innings with first innings being much more important than second. Steve Waugh also sucks, then? Anyhow it's not like Pietersen is some trailblazer in the 2nd innings with an average of 38.

[harmuk]

How many openers have 150 plus in their careers.. If someone is going to score 150 he invariably sets up a game. For the record Virendar sehwag has highest number of 150s for an opener. 14 of them. Next is Gavaskar 11. Hutton follows him with 10. Amiss 8. Almost scored 3 triple tons. You seriously think those are achievable by "ordinary" batsmen. He has his own weaknesses much like any other batsmen. But he has some gifts that very very few in cricketing history has possessed.

Why should I go by 150 scores alone? In tougher conditions even a 70 is more important than perhaps a 150 scored on flat tracks in the sub-continent, essentially where bulk of Shewag's 150+ scores have come. Now when one wants a batsman to play out a session on the 5th day, Shewag is the worst possible candidate there is in the 8000 club. Net net all things considered he is not a great batsman in my opinion, and why over his career he was dropped 2 times well into his career.

[vvvslaxman]

http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/match/221840.html This is ICC world XI vs Australia.. How exactly you think his 76 more invaluable compared to his second innings. Just look at the strike rate of him amidst struggles against Aussie bowlers from other batsmen.

[saneindian]

In a thread on Mcgrath mastering the master, calling Sehwag as overrated is blasphemy. Sehwag was one batsman who was in complete control vs Mcgrath in that 2004 series in India. The 155 he hit at Chennai is perhaps one of the innings of that decade, just when he looked set to take the team to a win in the 2nd innings chase of 215 rain washed out day 5.

[vvvslaxman]

Why should I go by 150 scores alone? In tougher conditions even a 70 is more important than perhaps a 150 scored on a flat tracks on a sub-continent track, essentially where bulk of Shewag's 150+ scores have come. Now when one wants a batsman to play out a session on the 5th day, Shewag is the worst possible candidate there is in the 8000 club. Net net all things considered he is not a great batsman in my opinion, and why over his career he was dropped 2 times well into his career.

uh.. Galle 201 is not tough conditions.. in Bangalore test Virendar sehwag was in a different planet when guys like Tendulkar, Ganguly, Dravid were playing even the likes of Afridi, Kaneria like they were grenades. Nobody denies he has weaknesses. Impulsive cricketer. But a genuine game changer. Seriously i respect your opinion. In my opinion every one has some weakness. Some temperamental, some technical. Despite all those weaknesses he has achieved this much. He repeatedly said he wanted to play in the middle order. This was even when he was scoring triple hundreds. He is basically a middle order batsman thrown under the bus. By gods grace he didn't disappoint us like 100s of openers we have tried. So respect.

[vvvslaxman]

In a thread on Mcgrath mastering the master' date=' calling Sehwag as overrated is blasphemy. Sehwag was one batsman who was in complete control vs Mcgrath in that 2004 series in India. The 155 he hit at Chennai is perhaps one of the innings of that decade, just when he looked set to take the team to a win in the 2nd innings chase of 215 rain washed out day 5.[/quote'] True.. what an innings that was. Gilespie was in top flight too in that series.

[Number]

He still averages more than 2 points than Shewag. Doesn't he? Considering he never started as a batsman he ended up as, if anyone followed the career graph of Waugh would know, that is not surprising at all. I would take Waugh over Shewag any day of the week when I take into account that Test cricket is played for 5 days and 2 innings with varying intricacies, where a batsman may need to hold up an end for a session for example, where runs are of not the top priority.

What are Laxman and Sehwag's avges ?

[vvvslaxman]

What are Laxman and Sehwag's avges ?

Laxman's struggles against Pakistan is well documented.. Full pitched yorkers. he was the only one besides Dravid saved us time and against against Pakistan. Otherwise Paksitan still would have had upperhand over us.

[harmuk]

What are Laxman and Sehwag's avges ?

What are they? and what about them?

[BeautifulGame]

In a thread on Mcgrath mastering the master' date=' calling Sehwag as overrated is blasphemy. Sehwag was one batsman who was in complete control vs Mcgrath in that 2004 series in India. The 155 he hit at Chennai is perhaps one of the innings of that decade, just when he looked set to take the team to a win in the 2nd innings chase of 215 rain washed out day 5.[/quote'] In that test alone there was a better century than Sehwag's .So to call it one of the innings of the decade is a bit of a stretch.Damn good knock though. If any innings deserved to be called as one of the innings of the decade from that test then it definitely was Martyn's.Privilaged to watch both innings live tbh

[harmuk]

In a thread on Mcgrath mastering the master' date=' calling Sehwag as overrated is blasphemy. Sehwag was one batsman who was in complete control vs Mcgrath in that 2004 series in India. The 155 he hit at Chennai is perhaps one of the innings of that decade, just when he looked set to take the team to a win in the 2nd innings chase of 215 rain washed out day 5.[/quote']If I keep listing knocks of any player who had played over 170-180 Test innings,there will be many such gems for each player. That is not the point. For a player to be considered great one has to on top of those such gems need to have flourished in all other situations test cricket demands. And Shewag fails badly in certain categories overall in comparison to others, as I explained in many posts of my mine above.

[BeautifulGame]

Laxman's struggles against Pakistan is well documented.. Full pitched yorkers. he was the only one besides Dravid saved us time and against against Pakistan. Otherwise Paksitan still would have had upperhand over us.

Yuvi was funnily one of our best batsmen against Pak.

[saneindian]

In that test alone there was a better century than Sehwag's .So to call it one of the innings of the decade is a bit of a stretch.Damn good knock though. If any innings deserved to be called as one of the innings of the decade from that test then it definitely was Martyn's.Privilaged to watch both innings live tbh

155 hit at a SR of 70 vs the best team and the toughest bowling attack of that time will always get you those extra points. Martyn also played a great knock but for me Sehwag's innings was a shade better.

[MCcricket]

Tendulkar was MCGRATHS BUNNY BUT ALSO THE UMPIRING IN Australia ON TOURS EARLIER WERE VERY VERY POOR AS BEST BATSMEN WERE TARGETTED AND GIVEN OUT, Cronje, Fannie also got him into much trouble. I personally feel Sehwag is a better test match winner then Sachin, no doubt about it.

[NareshK]

Laxman's struggles against Pakistan is well documented.. Full pitched yorkers. he was the only one besides Dravid saved us time and against against Pakistan. Otherwise Paksitan still would have had upperhand over us.

Laxman only played against Pakistan in the early part of his career and also as an opener when he was not really consistent. He was doing well mostly against Australia back then. He became a much better batsman later on in his career when he became lot more selective in shot making and his average got better. He didnt have a reputation of saving or winning games for India in the early part of his career. But after a few years, he got some maturity and started playing patiently and responsibly and also learned how to bat in the middle order in the team.