Chinaman bowler in India

[tweaker]

left arm leg spinners r known as Chinaman bowlers.Are there any chinaman bowlers in Indian domestic cricket

[tweaker]

ithink the most fomous chinaman bowler in International cricket was Brad Hogg and Michael Bevan

[Sean Bradley]

ithink the most fomous chinaman bowler in International cricket was Brad Hogg and Michael Bevan

Paul Adams before M. Azharuddin showed up.

[rkt.india]

Kuldeep Yadav from UP, selected for India U19 team.

There is a buzz in cricketing circles about left-arm spinner Kuldeep Yadav. The Kanpur-born 17-year-old, who has been included in the Mumbai Indians squad for IPL-V, is talked of as a future India prospect. Not long ago, Abey Kuruvilla, chairman of the BCCI junior national selection committee went lyrical on Yadav's ability to bowl hood-winking ‘chinaman' deliveries. Yadav, however, is not training with the MI team at the Wankhede Stadium. He has been selected in the India under-19 team for the quadrangular series to be played in Australia from April 5 to 15. Yadav has been part of the Uttar Pradesh junior teams since he made his debut in the BCCI's Polly Umrigar Trophy in the 2007-08 season. He has impressed the selectors quite regularly. After playing in the Vijay Merchant and Vinoo Mankad Trophy tournaments, Yadav was seen for the first time in action in this season's Cooch-Behar Trophy and he took 26 wickets.

http://www.thehindu.com/sport/cricket/a-chinaman-bowler-for-mi/article3263591.ece http://www.indianexpress.com/news/kuldeep-shines-with-the-ball-in-u16-vijay-merchant-trophy/722395/

[Khalpat]

left arm leg spinners r known as Chinaman bowlers.Are there any chinaman bowlers in Indian domestic cricket

I don't think this is the definition of Chinaman bowler, all left arm leg spinners cannot be termed as chinaman. When a Left Arm Leg Spinner bowls an off spin delivery then that ball is known as Chinaman. This is equivalent to the term googly bowled by right hand leg spinner. Till date only few bowlers like Paul Adams, Hogg etc were able to bowl this effectively. Even though Ravi Shastri, Venkatpati Raju were left arm leg spinner they cannot be termed as Chinaman bowlers.

[rkt.india]

I don't think this is the definition of Chinaman bowler, all left arm leg spinners cannot be termed as chinaman. When a Left Arm Leg Spinner bowls an off spin delivery then that ball is known as Chinaman. This is equivalent to the term googly bowled by right hand leg spinner. Till date only few bowlers like Paul Adams, Hogg etc were able to bowl this effectively. Even though Ravi Shastri, Venkatpati Raju were left arm leg spinner they cannot be termed as Chinaman bowlers.

Shashtri and Raju left arm leg spinner? When did you see them bowl left arm leg spin? They both were left arm orthodox spinner.

[Khalpat]

Shashtri and Raju left arm leg spinner? When did you see them bowl left arm leg spin? They both were left arm orthodox spinner.

Very simple, I have seen there bowl turning from leg towards off stump for a right hander, hence I always considered him Leg Spinner. BTW, in which way the ball turns for an Orthodox spinner.

[rkt.india]

Very simple, I have seen there bowl turning from leg towards off stump for a right hander, hence I always considered him Leg Spinner. BTW, in which way the ball turns for an Orthodox spinner.

but they aren't called leg spinners. They are left arm off spinners. Chinamen is called left arm leg spin.

[Crookbond]

but they aren't called leg spinners. They are left arm off spinners. Chinamen is called left arm leg spin.

Yup - Left Arm Leg Spinners are called chinaman or left arm unorthodox bowlers. Michael Bevan was another chinaman bowler from from Australia. Recently, I remember Dave Mohammed from the West Indies.

[Khalpat]

I think I need to confirm this, as far as I know(it was told to me by my coach in the year 1993, not sure if the rules or terminologies have changed): This is the ball bowled as surprise delivery by Left Arm Spinners using wrist: If the china men is bowled to right handed batsman it exactly resembles as off break to him. Similarly if the china men is bowled to left handed batsman it exactly resembles as leg break to him.

[Khalpat]

Here is what I have got in one of the site as the originating of this terminology: Charlie "Buck" Llewellyn, a South African allrounder who played circa the end of the 19th century, laid claim to inventing the delivery. But the term is more traditionally believed to have originated with the former West Indian spinner Ellis "Puss" Achong. In the 1933 Old Trafford Test, Achong, a left-arm orthodox spinner and the first Test cricketer of Chinese ancestry, bowled an unexpected wrist-spin delivery that turned from off to leg, and had the English batsman Walter Robins stumped. Legend has it that Robins, as he walked back to the pavilion, remarked, "Fancy being done by a bloody Chinaman." That is the reason I was saying it is not a usual style of bowling whereas it is just the surprise delivery bowled by Left Arm Orthodox.

[Crookbond]

^ No - the rules have not changed. Read this article to know about chinaman bowlers before 1993.

The left-arm chinaman is a mirror image of the right-arm leg break – bowled by turning the wrist so that the ball turns the opposite way to left-arm finger spin. When bowled back of the hand, it becomes the googly, it turns the other way.

http://www.espncricinfo.com/blogs/content/story/616263.html

[Khalpat]

^ No - the rules have not changed. Read this article to know about chinaman bowlers before 1993. http://www.espncricinfo.com/blogs/content/story/616263.html

This is exactly what I also said, mirror image of right hand leg spinner also means it spins in to the right-hand batsman and away from the left-hander - from left to right on a TV screen. right? So we both are on the same page as far as bowling style is concerned the only thing is I always believed that Chinaman is not a bowling style like usual leg break or offbreak by which we recognize a spin bowler whereas it is just a surprise delivery bowled by Left Arm Orthodox bowlers similar to what a Right Arm Leg spinner bowls a googly.

[philcric]

This is exactly what I also said, mirror image of right hand leg spinner also means it spins in to the right-hand batsman and away from the left-hander - from left to right on a TV screen. right? So we both are on the same page as far as bowling style is concerned the only thing is I always believed that Chinaman is not a bowling style like usual leg break or offbreak by which we recognize a spin bowler whereas it is just a surprise delivery bowled by Left Arm Orthodox bowlers similar to what a Right Arm Leg spinner bowls a googly.

No. Chinaman bowler is left arm wrist spinner. As simple as that.

[saneindian]

Right am wrist spin - Leg Spinner v, Left arm wrist spinner - Chinaman Right arm finger spinner - Off Spinner, Left arm finger spinner- SLA Orthodox Spinner Thats my understanding, could be wrong.

[philcric]

Right am wrist spin - Leg Spinner v, Left arm wrist spinner - Chinaman Right arm finger spinner - Off Spinner, Left arm finger spinner- SLA Orthodox Spinner Thats my understanding, could be wrong.

That's correct. They could have classified spinners as simply finger or wrist, instead of off, leg, orthodox, chinaman etc.

[moniker]

^IMO it shouldn't be classified as wrist/finger spinners. Murali and Ajmal use their wrists to bowl off spinners.

[tweaker]

In the history of Indian Cricket,i don't think there was any chinaman bowler.Also there r none from Pakistan and Srilanka.

[The Outsider]

Wrist spin is a difficult skill to have control over and what makes right arm wrist spinners much more common is simply the fact that most batsmen are right handed. So even with less control, they pose a threat because they take the ball away from the batsman. A left arm wrist spinner will bring the ball into the batsman, and with less control is easy pickings most of the time. Moreover, the percentage of right hand batsmen is much more at school/club level than in international cricket so it's even more difficult for a left arm wrist spinner to have an impact.

[maniac]

I thought this thread was about a North-east cricketer......Was going to condemn the racial tone of this thread