Clarke Posted August 11, 2015 Posted August 11, 2015 For the record, 1.25 lakh per month is classified as affluent in India. Its certainly not middle or upper middle class by Indian standards. Everyone here is generally top 1-2% of the population hence the big numbers, and its suitable to mention it in this thread since OP is an NRI but most Indians don't really need that much to be content. http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/business/india-business/Average-annual-income-of-Indias-affluent-is-Rs-1-5m-Visa/articleshow/47897196.cms A lot does depend on the location in India .. there's good tier 2 cities (which I hope to move to in the future) where 15-20k is sufficient as rent while in maximum city it varies from 20k+ in Borivali to more than a lakh in the upscale places.
swatpulla Posted August 11, 2015 Posted August 11, 2015 Recently was in Delhi. 3 people, few whisky pegs and middle class restaurant. Bill came around 5K+. Next day evening, in a middleclass resturant in Noida, Bill came just about 5K. On both occasions we didnt had dinner. Just drinks, that too not much because we were to drive home. Assuming your turn to pay comes twice a week thats 10K per week i.e. 45K per month Your habits scream affluence and quite clearly, you are an upper-middle class guy. My estimates were for a true Desi middle class who thinks twice before spending heavy. I would visit such places maybe twice a month at most. Middle class people cannot afford your lifestyle.
Clarke Posted August 11, 2015 Posted August 11, 2015 Recently was in Delhi. 3 people, few whisky pegs and middle class restaurant. Bill came around 5K+. Next day evening, in a middleclass resturant in Noida, Bill came just about 5K. On both occasions we didnt had dinner. Just drinks, that too not much because we were to drive home. Assuming your turn to pay comes twice a week thats 10K per week i.e. 45K per month Your habits scream affluence and quite clearly, you are an upper-middle class guy. My estimates were for a true Desi middle class who thinks twice before spending heavy. I would visit such places maybe twice a month at most. Middle class people cannot afford your lifestyle. 45k per month on booze :hysterical: :hysterical: :hysterical: Affluence is an understatement.
swatpulla Posted August 11, 2015 Posted August 11, 2015 Its funny that some of you guys spend 45K a month on dining out and I have to settle for Soy and egg protein because Whey is too expensive. :cantstop:
Kalia_Test Posted August 11, 2015 Posted August 11, 2015 For the record, 1.25 lakh per month is classified as affluent in India. Its certainly not middle or upper middle class by Indian standards. Everyone here is generally top 1-2% of the population hence the big numbers, and its suitable to mention it in this thread since OP is an NRI but most Indians don't really need that much to be content. http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/business/india-business/Average-annual-income-of-Indias-affluent-is-Rs-1-5m-Visa/articleshow/47897196.cms A lot does depend on the location in India .. there's good tier 2 cities (which I hope to move to in the future) where 15-20k is sufficient as rent while in maximum city it varies from 20k+ in Borivali to more than a lakh in the upscale places. These studies vary a lot. Middle class in a village is a lot different to middle class in Mumbai. If we take global definition and adjust for PPP, then as per Pew Research, 18K per month is middle class in India http://www.business-standard.com/article/opinion/india-s-middle-class-underperformance-115072500778_1.html To Indians, the global middle-income threshold of $10 means living on Rs 150 per day. For an Indian family of four, attaining middle-income status requires bringing home more than Rs 18,200 monthly or about Rs 220,000 annually. (The conversions are done at 2011 purchasing power parity rates, which are exchange rates adjusted for differences in the prices of goods and services across countries, and expressed in 2011 prices.) We can clearly agree that, for a family of 4, 18K per month will no way give you a "middle class" lifestyle in any Indian metro. It would have been good if the surveys/research is done at city level.
randomGuy Posted August 11, 2015 Posted August 11, 2015 These studies vary a lot. Middle class in a village is a lot different to middle class in Mumbai. If we take global definition and adjust for PPP, then as per Pew Research, 18K per month is middle class in India http://www.business-standard.com/article/opinion/india-s-middle-class-underperformance-115072500778_1.html We can clearly agree that, for a family of 4, 18K per month will no way give you a "middle class" lifestyle in any Indian metro. It would have been good if the surveys/research is done at city level. you have to be frugal but you can manage quite well in 18k. just 2 things - 1. you MUST own a house. 2. your savings will be zero. so you must hv a contingency fund or paid-up insurance etc.
Kalia_Test Posted August 11, 2015 Posted August 11, 2015 you have to be frugal but you can manage quite well in 18k. just 2 things - 1. you MUST own a house. 2. your savings will be zero. so you must hv a contingency fund or paid-up insurance etc. We can probably live but in no way will it be a 'middle-class' lifestyle ( atleast as per what the OP mentioned - mid range car and urban 'lifestyle' ). My estimates of barest of bare expenses in a city for even lowest of low middle class of family of 4 ( 2 kids ) Groceries - INR 2500 Milk - 500 Vegetables - 500 Travel ( to and fro office in 2 -wheeler ) - 2000 Electricity - 2000 Mobile - 1000 Landline/Internet - 1000 Cable TV - 500 School expenses ( including transport,etc for 2 kids ) - 4000 Random medical expenses ( fever, tests,etc) - 1000 Total = 15000 at a bare minimum. I have not even accounted for clothes, shoes, uniforms, eating out, an odd movie, repairs of house, TV,fridge, computer, buying phone, newspaper, maintenance of house ( even if you own an Apt, you pay maintenance ). I humbly suggest - 18K is NOT enough - certainly not for a middle-class lifestyle.
Book_Worm Posted August 11, 2015 Posted August 11, 2015 Me and my hubby made sure before coming to india for good that we had sufficient savings and all well as our own house and property. Makes life easy.
randomGuy Posted August 11, 2015 Posted August 11, 2015 Inline IMHO, it'll be difficult but one will manage esp.. if he/she owns a house and has a contingency fund.We can probably live but in no way will it be a 'middle-class' lifestyle ( atleast as per what the OP mentioned - mid range car and urban 'lifestyle' ). My estimates of barest of bare expenses in a city for even lowest of low middle class of family of 4 ( 2 kids ) Groceries - INR 2500 Milk - 500 Vegetables - 500 Travel ( to and fro office in 2 -wheeler ) - 2000 Electricity - 2000 1000 Mobile - 1000 500 Landline/Internet - 1000 600 Cable TV - 500 300 School expenses ( including transport,etc for 2 kids ) - 4000 1000 (send them to govt. school, I went to one, didn't turn out to be the worst) Random medical expenses ( fever, tests,etc) - 1000 Total = 15000 10000 at a bare minimum. I have not even accounted for clothes, shoes, uniforms, eating out, an odd movie, repairs of house, TV,fridge, computer, buying phone, newspaper, maintenance of house ( even if you own an Apt, you pay maintenance ). I humbly suggest - 18K is NOT enough - certainly not for a middle-class lifestyle.
Detonator Posted August 11, 2015 Posted August 11, 2015 Hyderabad isn't as costly as I expected. One of my cousin is staying in Begumpet in a 2bhk duplex house. rent is only 14k. He said he can manage with 50k in Hyd
Kalia_Test Posted August 11, 2015 Posted August 11, 2015 Inline IMHO' date= it'll be difficult but one will manage esp.. if he/she owns a house and has a contingency fund. OK. Fair enough. I think the main disagreement is what exactly is middle-class. My lowest estimate is higher than yours. So, we can imagine how much disparity exists in the definition itself. Wants vs needs. If we had to make a list of expenses 15 yrs ago, mobile and internet would not even have featured in them and a decade prior to that, no cable TV.
randomGuy Posted August 11, 2015 Posted August 11, 2015 Hyderabad isn't as costly as I expected. One of my cousin is staying in Begumpet in a 2bhk duplex house. rent is only 14k. He said he can manage with 50k in Hyd I was in Koti in guest house initially. there the apples were just 15/- per piece and banana (large ones) for 3/-, ultra cheap mangoes and Anaars(pomegranate) as well. 25/- for coconut water and 20/- road-side idly wada etc.... IT areas are a bit expensive (relative to inner city) . the inner city - things are very cheap.
swatpulla Posted August 11, 2015 Posted August 11, 2015 500 a month for milk and vegetables? What world are you living in randomGuy? A family of 4, surviving on 300gm of milk per day, spending Rs 16 on daily vegetables, no expenses on fruits..no expenses on gas cylinders? Is this your definition of middle-class? I lived in Chandigarh, spent a bare minimum as a single college student (shared room, cooked my own food etc), and the very least I required every month was 10K. Think about now, its been 3 years since, and prices are a lot higher.
randomGuy Posted August 11, 2015 Posted August 11, 2015 OK. Fair enough. I think the main disagreement is what exactly is middle-class. My lowest estimate is higher than yours. So, we can imagine how much disparity exists in the definition itself. Wants vs needs. If we had to make a list of expenses 15 yrs ago, mobile and internet would not even have featured in them and a decade prior to that, no cable TV. cable tv, mobile, internet all etc are probably nominal expenditure. Children of middle-class people too go to govt. schools in Delhi atleast (and turn out ok). if they go to private schools the cost is substantially higher i concede.
swatpulla Posted August 11, 2015 Posted August 11, 2015 Maids in Delhi have an overall family income of Rs 15,000+ a month, and I know how difficult it is for them to make ends meet (and thats when people give them so much stuff for free).
randomGuy Posted August 11, 2015 Posted August 11, 2015 500 a month for milk and vegetables? What world are you living in randomGuy? A family of 4, surviving on 300gm of milk per day, spending Rs 16 on daily vegetables, no expenses on fruits..no expenses on gas cylinders? Is this your definition of middle-class? I lived in Chandigarh, spent a bare minimum as a single college student (shared room, cooked my own food etc), and the very least I required every month was 10K. Think about now, its been 3 years since, and prices are a lot higher. my house consumes 3 lts milk (full cream, used for curd as well) in 2 days for 4 people = ~150/- . so yeah, monthly milk expenditure is 2200/- edit: so I should have edited the milk and veg. expenditure as well in Kalia's post for my calculations. As mentioned, its gonna be tough, no doubt. I still feel one would manage.
Kalia_Test Posted August 11, 2015 Posted August 11, 2015 I was in Koti in guest house initially. there the apples were just 15/- per piece and banana (large ones) for 3/-, ultra cheap mangoes and Anaars(pomegranate) as well. 25/- for coconut water and 20/- road-side idly wada etc.... IT areas are a bit expensive (relative to inner city) . the inner city - things are very cheap. If we have a Rythu Bazaar near us ( like I do ), costs fall dramatically. Onions are 50 rupees per KG today with "bandi" vendors. In Rhythu bazaar, it is 20 rupees per KG today. BTW - 20 rupees for road-side Idly is high. In Kukatpally ( where I sometimes eat on my way ), roadside Idlies ( 2 big ones with chutney and Sambar ) is 15 and self-service stalls ( for Bangalore people - the equivalent is the xyz- hasini or similar stalls) is 18. If it is Idly-wada i.e 2 idlies and 1 wada - you got a good deal :two_thumbs_up:
randomGuy Posted August 11, 2015 Posted August 11, 2015 If we have a Rythu Bazaar near us ( like I do ), costs fall dramatically. Onions are 50 rupees per KG today with "bandi" vendors. In Rhythu bazaar, it is 20 rupees per KG today. BTW - 20 rupees for road-side Idly is high. In Kukatpally ( where I sometimes eat on my way ), roadside Idlies ( 2 big ones with chutney and Sambar ) is 15 and self-service stalls ( for Bangalore people - the equivalent is the xyz- hasini or similar stalls) is 18. If it is Idly-wada i.e 2 idlies and 1 wada - you got a good deal :two_thumbs_up: cool. I go to reliance fresh or a place called 'manikanta hypermarket' :cantstop: 2 idly+ 2 small vada for 20/- (no sambar, 2 types of chutneys):D. I eat out, 60-80 per meal (in the IT areas). have also got a vendor who gives north indian food home delivery for 55/-.
dial_100 Posted August 11, 2015 Posted August 11, 2015 So with 30L package (haha..that's the word I hear all the time in India), what should be the net in India?? Take-home how we say in India.
sscomp32 Posted August 11, 2015 Posted August 11, 2015 Its 50k to 60 k here in Patna. And thats a comfortable life in main town .
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