How would Kohli have played against Ashwin on this type of wicket - who would have won the battle ?

[MCcricket]

That would be one mouth watering contest, both on top of their game n best in their fields, both temperamentally strong n smart, a bowler has to illicit just one mistake from the batter n that could be the last n sometimes the batter survives with edges close calls, so we don't know

[Muloghonto]

Kohli would probably we owned. It does not matter how great a batman you are- if you cannot/do not step out to spinners well on spinning wickets, its just a matter of time before you are toast. And Kohli is a 'play from the crease' kind of guy, ala Dravid. 

This was demonstrated very well in the 90s vs Australia : all our batsmen were beasts against spinners coz they could step out at will and batsmen like Tendulkar,Azhar & Sidhu destroyed Warne coz they stepped out at will and hammered him to throw his rhythm off. 

Aussies played from crease, went deeper, tried everything but step out and got owned by Kumble repeatedly.

 

[narenpande1]

3 minutes ago, Muloghonto said:

Kohli would probably we owned. It does not matter how great a batman you are- if you cannot/do not step out to spinners well on spinning wickets, its just a matter of time before you are toast. And Kohli is a 'play from the crease' kind of guy, ala Dravid. 

This was demonstrated very well in the 90s vs Australia : all our batsmen were beasts against spinners coz they could step out at will and batsmen like Tendulkar,Azhar & Sidhu destroyed Warne coz they stepped out at will and hammered him to throw his rhythm off. 

Aussies played from crease, went deeper, tried everything but step out and got owned by Kumble repeatedly.

 

 

Agree .

[MCcricket]

24 minutes ago, Muloghonto said:

Kohli would probably we owned. It does not matter how great a batman you are- if you cannot/do not step out to spinners well on spinning wickets, its just a matter of time before you are toast. And Kohli is a 'play from the crease' kind of guy, ala Dravid. 

This was demonstrated very well in the 90s vs Australia : all our batsmen were beasts against spinners coz they could step out at will and batsmen like Tendulkar,Azhar & Sidhu destroyed Warne coz they stepped out at will and hammered him to throw his rhythm off. 

Aussies played from crease, went deeper, tried everything but step out and got owned by Kumble repeatedly.

 

I was thinking about that but there R few things that Kohli does which changes the equation, he is able to rotate strike very easily against spinners and uses his wrist on both front n backfoot, he either goes front or fully back decisively, he has wide range of Stokes, has power game now n also subtle touch.

Ashwin would first have trouble keeping him on strike for long enough

Ashwin if pitches the ball short or slightly short of good length Kohli can flick it either on from or backfoot on leg side n or guide it to third man or Play square.

Ashwin pitching it up or good length Kohli can drive on , of straight irrespective of line.

Does Virat need to step out, don't think so, stepping out is a go to option if you cannot rotate strike.

Also Virat is nimble on his feet n its not that he cannot step out, he can do that, but he doesn't need to as he has everything to counteract spin using depth of crease, sweep, front n backfoot game plus mainly ability to take singles at will

Edited December 11, 2016 by MCcricket

[narenpande1]

2 minutes ago, MCcricket said:

I was thinking about that but there R few things that Kohli does which changes the equation, he is able to rotate strike very easily against spinners and uses his wrist on both front n backfoot, he either goes front or fully back decisively, he has wide range of Stokes, has power game now n also subtle touch.

Ashwin would first have trouble keeping him on strike for long enough

Ashwin if pitches the ball short or slightly short of good length Kohli can flick it either on from or backfoot on leg side n or guide it to third man or Play square.

Ashwin pitching it up or good length Kohli can drive on , of straight irrespective of line.

Does Virat need to step out, don't think so, stepping out is a go to option if you cannot rotate strike.

Also Virat is nimble on his feet n its not that he cannot step out, he can do that, but he doesn't need to as he has everything to counteract spin using depth of crease, sweep, front n backfoot game plus mainly ability to take si goes at will

 

Against offies , Kohli has a propensity to work it towards midwicket with the spin as PLAN A or cover drive against the spin as PLAN B

 

Ashwin with his height and mixture of top spinners and carrom balls would have got him to lob the ball in the air many times.

 

 

[MCcricket]

8 minutes ago, narenpande1 said:

 

Against offies , Kohli has a propensity to work it towards midwicket with the spin as PLAN A or cover drive against the spin as PLAN B

 

Ashwin with his height and mixture of top spinners and carrom balls would have got him to lob the ball in the air many times.

 

 

Cricket is a cat n mouse game, when u have people who played successfully against likes of Ajmal and Murali who were getting an u fair advantage n turning a mile both ways, don't you think Kohli or some other batters have the skill to score of Ashwins, well they certainly do, Rashid was turning it a mile n ball was jumping of the track yesterday n he bowled well, still Kohli dominated him on a helpful track, because he can tKe singles n counter attack with min risk, n that combination is tough for any bowler , even Warne , Murali, Been anyone.

[GautiMaan]

Ashwin has got the better of Sangakkara,Williamson,Root etc he would have found a way against Kohli

[Muloghonto]

3 hours ago, MCcricket said:

I was thinking about that but there R few things that Kohli does which changes the equation, he is able to rotate strike very easily against spinners and uses his wrist on both front n backfoot, he either goes front or fully back decisively, he has wide range of Stokes, has power game now n also subtle touch.

Ashwin would first have trouble keeping him on strike for long enough

Ashwin if pitches the ball short or slightly short of good length Kohli can flick it either on from or backfoot on leg side n or guide it to third man or Play square.

Ashwin pitching it up or good length Kohli can drive on , of straight irrespective of line.

Does Virat need to step out, don't think so, stepping out is a go to option if you cannot rotate strike.

Also Virat is nimble on his feet n its not that he cannot step out, he can do that, but he doesn't need to as he has everything to counteract spin using depth of crease, sweep, front n backfoot game plus mainly ability to take singles at will

Rotating strike against a spinner is simply delaying the inevitable. It will help you hang on a bit but you will still end up with a low score and get out with 25 off of 70 balls kinda stuff that used to happen to Dravid- also a good rotator of strike in his second half. But if you cant step out to a spinner and throw off his rhythm, you are simply delaying the inevitable. 

 

Virat also has a bad habit to drive length balls against the spin against off-spinners, which is doomed to failure on a raging turner against a world class spinner.

[Cricketics]

2 minutes ago, Muloghonto said:

Rotating strike against a spinner is simply delaying the inevitable. It will help you hang on a bit but you will still end up with a low score and get out with 25 off of 70 balls kinda stuff that used to happen to Dravid- also a good rotator of strike in his second half. But if you cant step out to a spinner and throw off his rhythm, you are simply delaying the inevitable. 

 

Virat also has a bad habit to drive length balls against the spin against off-spinners, which is doomed to failure on a raging turner against a world class spinner.

Not really. Virat has already scored enough runs with the same method and on raging turners too. Thing is that people assume that every bowl which Ashwin will bowl to Virat will be unplayable. We have heard how good bowlers set up batsman, but some batsmen also ensure that bowlers lose their line. This is what Kohli does to some really good bowlers. He flicks them on the balls where the bowlers expect the batsman to drive on off etc. This changes and makes the bowler think twice before he bowls his next delivery. Virat just toils with the bowlers too much and converts some singles into doubles and will hit a odd boundary and in no time he will be 8 runs of 4 balls. He can then negotiate a good solid over of the bowler and then back again he will be doing the same stuff all over again.

 

Virat is currently in a different league. Ashwin too is bowling the best he has every bowled and is world class currently, but Kohli is not the batsman he can easily fox.

[Muloghonto]

11 minutes ago, Cricketics said:

Not really. Virat has already scored enough runs with the same method and on raging turners too. Thing is that people assume that every bowl which Ashwin will bowl to Virat will be unplayable. We have heard how good bowlers set up batsman, but some batsmen also ensure that bowlers lose their line. This is what Kohli does to some really good bowlers. He flicks them on the balls where the bowlers expect the batsman to drive on off etc. This changes and makes the bowler think twice before he bowls his next delivery. Virat just toils with the bowlers too much and converts some singles into doubles and will hit a odd boundary and in no time he will be 8 runs of 4 balls. He can then negotiate a good solid over of the bowler and then back again he will be doing the same stuff all over again.

 

Virat is currently in a different league. Ashwin too is bowling the best he has every bowled and is world class currently, but Kohli is not the batsman he can easily fox.

maybe because i spent a lot of time seeing 3 of the best spinners i've ever seen- Warne, Kumble and Murali, that i've seen over the years that against them, on a spin-friendly wicket, you have no hope if you can't step out. That was the difference between Azhar/Tendulkar/Sidhu/Ganguly and a Dravid. 
Sure, you could argue that VVS didnt step out much either and he did just fine against Warney but he did get owned by Murali precisely because he doesnt step out. Can Kohli succeed against top class spinners without stepping out on a turner ? I don't think so- the odds are heavily stacked against him. And we have not seen Kohli against a world class spinner on a raging turner either, so we don't know. 

 

[Vijy]

5 minutes ago, Muloghonto said:

maybe because i spent a lot of time seeing 3 of the best spinners i've ever seen- Warne, Kumble and Murali, that i've seen over the years that against them, on a spin-friendly wicket, you have no hope if you can't step out. That was the difference between Azhar/Tendulkar/Sidhu/Ganguly and a Dravid. 
Sure, you could argue that VVS didnt step out much either and he did just fine against Warney but he did get owned by Murali precisely because he doesnt step out. Can Kohli succeed against top class spinners without stepping out on a turner ? I don't think so- the odds are heavily stacked against him. And we have not seen Kohli against a world class spinner on a raging turner either, so we don't know. 

 

I agree - there are not many in Kohli's own lifetime, and he hasn't played them on raging turners.