Malcolm Merlyn Posted January 12, 2017 Author Posted January 12, 2017 Updated the post and those are absolute numbers. Even with overseas rights being 25% of domestic rights assumption (which is unlikely) total contribution to BCCI revenue is 10%. A fall in that 10% won't leave BCCI in financial tatters as the article in OP claimed. On a side note: BCCI lost more money due to some of the practices by BCCI officials. Simple example - Lalit Modi didn't include strategic timeouts clause in overseas media right and BCCI lost money there. Corruption and scams by BCCI babus has done more such financial damages to BCCI in past. 10% of BCCI annual revenues will run into 100s of mns over a 5 to 10 year period.The IPL television rights are supposed to be worth 3bn for 10 year tv rights and 5 year digital rights.Thats more than triple of the value of 2008.Similarly i expect the International rights to also triple from 757mn(for 6 years) to atleast 2bn for 5 years.Add to this the shirt sponsorships and other sponsorships are worth atleast 100mn a year. So 1 year BCCI revenues may be close to 700mn so 10% is 70mn a year.This is a conservative estimate as i havent included receivables from ICC. Now go through the TV broadcast rights of other boards and tell me how much do they get paid for their entire rights for a year and then the possible value of their overseas rights. BCCI will be at a loss and boards like PCB will make merry.Tell me one reason why a single penny of Indian money flow to PCB?
Trichromatic Posted January 13, 2017 Posted January 13, 2017 6 hours ago, Malcolm Merlyn said: 10% of BCCI annual revenues will run into 100s of mns over a 5 to 10 year period.The IPL television rights are supposed to be worth 3bn for 10 year tv rights and 5 year digital rights.Thats more than triple of the value of 2008.Similarly i expect the International rights to also triple from 757mn(for 6 years) to atleast 2bn for 5 years.Add to this the shirt sponsorships and other sponsorships are worth atleast 100mn a year. So 1 year BCCI revenues may be close to 700mn so 10% is 70mn a year.This is a conservative estimate as i havent included receivables from ICC. Now go through the TV broadcast rights of other boards and tell me how much do they get paid for their entire rights for a year and then the possible value of their overseas rights. BCCI will be at a loss and boards like PCB will make merry.Tell me one reason why a single penny of Indian money flow to PCB? 10% of BCCI revenue was 136 crores for 2015-16. That too when I take very high estimates. I doubt it could be more than 7-8% with total % lost by BCCI to be around 0.5-2% which is like 6-30 crores for BCCI. I am not questioning that BCCI will not be at loss or it is good at loss. I am questioning how a board making 1365 crores could be in financial tatters by losing Rs 30 crores money as it still being claimed in the article in OP and the thread title.
Mariyam Posted January 13, 2017 Posted January 13, 2017 11 hours ago, G_B_ said: And I also fail to see how cricket fans should be happy. Pooled rights or collective bargaining will mean broadcasters pay more which means fans pay more. Sent from my Wileyfox Swift using Tapatalk Why? May not be a direct co relation. Most people watch games on channels on a monthly subscription basis. Broadcasters pay more so advertisers pay more to screen their ads. So products are slightly more expensive. The end consumer pays more indirectly.
Malcolm Merlyn Posted January 13, 2017 Author Posted January 13, 2017 10% of BCCI revenue was 136 crores for 2015-16. That too when I take very high estimates. I doubt it could be more than 7-8% with total % lost by BCCI to be around 0.5-2% which is like 6-30 crores for BCCI. I am not questioning that BCCI will not be at loss or it is good at loss. I am questioning how a board making 1365 crores could be in financial tatters by losing Rs 30 crores money as it still being claimed in the article in OP and the thread title. You cannot take one year into isolation like that.You have to take the entire possible amount that BCCI can earn from 2018 to 2023.All revenues are going to go up 2.5 to 3 times when new deals ring in post in 2018. BCCI revenues depend on per match played in a year so if BCCI played 5(All sponsorship deals together are worth 10cr per match) matches in 2015-16 and got 50cr doesnt mean thats its annual revenue for next year and after that or before that.Because if BCCI plays 20 matches then revenuen quadruples.So stop sticking to one absolute number from one financial year and basing entiring argument on that. I have already told you what is the projected Tv rights revenue of BCCI from IPL from 2018 onwards.The international rights are also expected to triple.Other sponsorship amounts will also increase.The receivables from ICC will also increase.So a annual revenue of 700 to 800mn isnt to far fetched.I take your 7% to 8% as overseas rights value its still 50 to 60mn per year. How many other boards have Overseas Tv rights valued at 50 to 60mn per year? Go check.None of them.
Malcolm Merlyn Posted January 13, 2017 Author Posted January 13, 2017 Why? May not be a direct co relation. Most people watch games on channels on a monthly subscription basis. Broadcasters pay more so advertisers pay more to screen their ads. So products are slightly more expensive. The end consumer pays more indirectly. Overseas rights are for people outside India.They have to pay per view or per series or like annual India package etc etc whose charges will go up.
Trichromatic Posted January 13, 2017 Posted January 13, 2017 8 minutes ago, Malcolm Merlyn said: You cannot take one year into isolation like that.You have to take the entire possible amount that BCCI can earn from 2018 to 2023.All revenues are going to go up 2.5 to 3 times when new deals ring in post in 2018. BCCI revenues depend on per match played in a year so if BCCI played 5(All sponsorship deals together are worth 10cr per match) matches in 2015-16 and got 50cr doesnt mean thats its annual revenue for next year and after that or before that.Because if BCCI plays 20 matches then revenuen quadruples.So stop sticking to one absolute number from one financial year and basing entiring argument on that. I have already told you what is the projected Tv rights revenue of BCCI from IPL from 2018 onwards.The international rights are also expected to triple.Other sponsorship amounts will also increase.The receivables from ICC will also increase.So a annual revenue of 700 to 800mn isnt to far fetched.I take your 7% to 8% as overseas rights value its still 50 to 60mn per year. How many other boards have Overseas Tv rights valued at 50 to 60mn per year? Go check.None of them. 50-60 million. Revenues have to increase 6 times for that. Even if it is 50-60 million and BCCI and if BCCI loses some % of that and if total loss is around 2-3%, then still the same question: How a board could be in financial tatters by losing 2% money as it still being claimed in the article in OP and the thread title even though overall revenue is expected to be triple or increase 6 times for 50-60 million?
Lannister Posted January 13, 2017 Posted January 13, 2017 This new pool sharing basis seems to profit PCB off Indian market. I wouldn't mind other associate nations getting development fund, but PCB making a profit off Indian market is not tolerable. They should instead create two pools, each consisting of 5 nations and sell them separately with India and Pakistan being in different pools.
Malcolm Merlyn Posted January 13, 2017 Author Posted January 13, 2017 3 hours ago, Trichromatic said: 50-60 million. Revenues have to increase 6 times for that. Even if it is 50-60 million and BCCI and if BCCI loses some % of that and if total loss is around 2-3%, then still the same question: How a board could be in financial tatters by losing 2% money as it still being claimed in the article in OP and the thread title even though overall revenue is expected to be triple or increase 6 times for 50-60 million? 3 times not 6 times. IPL contract is now worth around 1bn USD for 10 years,exepcted to be worth 3 to 3.5bn USD for next cycle of 10 year tv and 5 year digital plus media rights(so actually total valuation may increase after digital rights are sold again after 5 years).Thats 300mn per year. International Tv rights revenue is 757mn USD for 6 year period.So like IPL this value will also triple and will be 2.2bn for next 6 years.Thats 300mn for year. I added another 100mn for receivables from ICC,shirt sponsorship,apparel sponsor,series sponsor,drinks sponsor,in stadia rights,IPL naming rights etc etc. That is 700mn per year.Taking your conservative value of 7% to 8% that is 50 to 60mn USD a year.
Trichromatic Posted January 13, 2017 Posted January 13, 2017 1 minute ago, Malcolm Merlyn said: 3 times not 6 times. IPL contract is now worth around 1bn USD for 10 years,exepcted to be worth 3 to 3.5bn USD for next cycle of 10 year tv and 5 year digital plus media rights(so actually total valuation may increase after digital rights are sold again after 5 years).Thats 300mn per year. International Tv rights revenue is 757mn USD for 6 year period.So like IPL this value will also triple and will be 2.2bn for next 6 years.Thats 300mn for year. I added another 100mn for receivables from ICC,shirt sponsorship,apparel sponsor,series sponsor,drinks sponsor,in stadia rights,IPL naming rights etc etc. That is 700mn per year.Taking your conservative value of 7% to 8% that is 50 to 60mn USD a year. How a board could be in financial tatters by losing 2% money as it still being claimed in the article in OP and the thread title even though overall revenue is expected to be triple or increase 6 times for 50-60 million?
Malcolm Merlyn Posted January 13, 2017 Author Posted January 13, 2017 1 hour ago, Trichromatic said: How a board could be in financial tatters by losing 2% money as it still being claimed in the article in OP and the thread title even though overall revenue is expected to be triple or increase 6 times for 50-60 million? 2%?Really??How? Also we are calculating revenues here.The actual profit or surplus is less.Check the surplus in that balance sheet you posted.
Late Cut Posted January 13, 2017 Posted January 13, 2017 Man some of you are allergic to facts. The sheep mentality has no boundaries.
BeautifulGame Posted January 13, 2017 Posted January 13, 2017 (edited) 15 hours ago, G_B_ said: is this goes through my bills are certainly going to rise.... The issue is not also about prices being moderate. % change increase means they will rise. Thats not certain is it.Infact there is every possibility that BT could buy rights for next tour to India with a inflated cost (like they did with Ashes recently) and then customers have pay subscription for both Sky and BT Edited January 13, 2017 by BeautifulGame
BeautifulGame Posted February 1, 2017 Posted February 1, 2017 One matter not to be found on the official ICC agenda, or in the report, but of equal significance will be that of the pooling of TV rights; that is, the effort by some boards to create a buffer against the game's reliance on the Indian broadcast market for sustenance, by pooling the overseas territory rights of their bilateral series and selling them as a bundle to broadcasters (the money from that sale divvied up equally among the participating boards). These discussions will carry on along the margins of the official meetings - CA, ECB and CSA have led the way on this and there is support from Pakistan, though the rest of the Asian bloc have been cool to it. In the case of the BCCI it is understandable, given their considerable earnings from non-bilateral cricket broadcasts like the IPL. But in theory, a smaller board such as Sri Lanka Cricket stands to earn money in such a pool from, for example, an Ashes series broadcast. Ultimately, as this is not an ICC initiative, it will not matter how many boards choose to opt in or the pace at which it progresses. Cricinfo So after all the nonsense based on TOI, as usual turns out it's typical nonsense.It isn't even part of the ICC agenda tomorrow. Though what is likely to happen tomorrow is ICC will reverse the big three revenue sharing model which Srini fought hard to achieve .And that's solely because of Shirke and Thakur allowing Mahonar to not just become ICC president but independent position as well.This despite Manohar voicing opinions against big three reforms even when he was president of BCCI .
Malcolm Merlyn Posted February 1, 2017 Author Posted February 1, 2017 27 minutes ago, BeautifulGame said: One matter not to be found on the official ICC agenda, or in the report, but of equal significance will be that of the pooling of TV rights; that is, the effort by some boards to create a buffer against the game's reliance on the Indian broadcast market for sustenance, by pooling the overseas territory rights of their bilateral series and selling them as a bundle to broadcasters (the money from that sale divvied up equally among the participating boards). These discussions will carry on along the margins of the official meetings - CA, ECB and CSA have led the way on this and there is support from Pakistan, though the rest of the Asian bloc have been cool to it. In the case of the BCCI it is understandable, given their considerable earnings from non-bilateral cricket broadcasts like the IPL. But in theory, a smaller board such as Sri Lanka Cricket stands to earn money in such a pool from, for example, an Ashes series broadcast. Ultimately, as this is not an ICC initiative, it will not matter how many boards choose to opt in or the pace at which it progresses. Cricinfo So after all the nonsense based on TOI, as usual turns out it's typical nonsense.It isn't even part of the ICC agenda tomorrow. Though what is likely to happen tomorrow is ICC will reverse the big three revenue sharing model which Srini fought hard to achieve .And that's solely because of Shirke and Thakur allowing Mahonar to not just become ICC president but independent position as well.This despite Manohar voicing opinions against big three reforms even when he was president of BCCI . Quoting selectively doesnt help. Quote Last February it was said by a Bangladesh Cricket Board official that Shashank Manohar, the ICC chairman, was mulling a 6% cut of the BCCI's share (which stood at 20.3% in the original model). That figure lowers by US$150 million the BCCI's potential earnings from ICC events in this rights cycle (to approximately US$421.25 million). Another set of figures circulating, but unconfirmed, place their earnings in this cycle as low as US$270 million, or under half of what the Big Three model promised. Quote The Big Three's model of revenue distribution drew considerable outrage when it was unveiled in 2014. In it, the BCCI (20.3%), ECB (4.4%) and CA (2.7%) assigned to themselves a 27.4% share of the total revenues the ICC would make over eight years. And they never revealed the calculations that underpinned that model. A review report commissioned by the ICC in February 2016 will put forward a new financial model. The details of it remain a closely guarded secret but it is expected that the shares of the BCCI, in particular, and maybe the ECB, will be cut. By how much is the big question - the ICC chairman Shashank Manohar once spoke of a 6% cut. Other numbers see the BCCI's share being halved. Loss estimated to be between 150mn USD to 300mn USD over 6 years.Thats 25 to 50mn a year. Quote Incidentally, there has been a partial pause on revenue distribution thus far in this rights cycle. Only one ICC event has taken place - the 2016 World T20 - and it is believed that Full Members were paid out equal distributions from it last year. The payouts based on the contribution costs calculations of the Big Three model - the bone of contention - have been held back until a new model is approved. Indeed, the smaller seven boards actually earned more from the ICC than the Big Three boards because they were also eligible for payments from the Test Cricket Fund (which was activated). All of this means that potential opposition from the BCCI would have to be overcome at the board meeting for this to move ahead. Ordinarily that might be close to impossible, but with the BCCI in such administrative flux members might sense an opening; with CA and ECB now ostensibly on the other side, if it comes to a vote, the odds are firmly stacked against the BCCI (and the more cynical observers might choose to view Giles Clarke's recent visit to Pakistan and CSA's overtures to Zimbabwe recently as part of an effort to ensure unity at the meeting).
BeautifulGame Posted February 1, 2017 Posted February 1, 2017 Loss estimated to be between 150mn USD to 300mn USD over 6 years.Thats 25 to 50mn a year. How is that selective quoting ? I specifically mentioned ICC is most likely going to roll back the BCCI reforms . And the sole reason is because BCCI let Manohar become independent ICC president despite his views on big three reforms . And all the losses that will be incurred by BCCI that you have quoted are all due to the roll back of big 3 reforms. It's the OP and toi article which was nonsense mixing roll back of reforms with tv revenue sharing of overseas rights.
Malcolm Merlyn Posted February 1, 2017 Author Posted February 1, 2017 10 minutes ago, BeautifulGame said: How is that selective quoting ? I specifically mentioned ICC is most likely going to roll back the BCCI reforms . And the sole reason is because BCCI let Manohar become independent ICC president despite his views on big three reforms . And all the losses that will be incurred by BCCI that you have quoted are all due to the roll back of big 3 reforms. It's the OP and toi article which was nonsense mixing roll back of reforms with tv revenue sharing of overseas rights. Manohar tried it earlier and could not because of BCCI's objection. Quote All of this means that potential opposition from the BCCI would have to be overcome at the board meeting for this to move ahead. Ordinarily that might be close to impossible, but with the BCCI in such administrative flux members might sense an opening; with CA and ECB now ostensibly on the other side, if it comes to a vote, the odds are firmly stacked against the BCCI (and the more cynical observers might choose to view Giles Clarke's recent visit to Pakistan and CSA's overtures to Zimbabwe recently as part of an effort to ensure unity at the meeting).
BeautifulGame Posted February 1, 2017 Posted February 1, 2017 Nowhere u have quoted mentions Manohar tried earlier and couldn't .They always had the vote. Fact is Thakur and co allowed Manohar to be independent ICC president despite his hostile views to big three reforms .That's what screwing BCCI now . I am not interested in repeating the same lol.
Malcolm Merlyn Posted February 1, 2017 Author Posted February 1, 2017 3 minutes ago, BeautifulGame said: Nowhere u have quoted mentions Manohar tried earlier and couldn't .They always had the vote. Fact is Thakur and co allowed Manohar to be independent ICC president despite his hostile views to big three reforms .That's what screwing BCCI now . I am not interested in repeating the same lol. Manohar has zilch power because BCCI controlled the votes through their politicking.Now with no one to do that,BCCI doesnt have the votes to stop this.The only solution is to boycott the CT2017. You repeated anything doesnt turn lies into facts. LOL. The quote clearly mentions that BCCI's administrative flux has created this situation.
BeautifulGame Posted February 1, 2017 Posted February 1, 2017 Manohar has zilch power because BCCI controlled the votes through their politicking.Now with no one to do that,BCCI doesnt have the votes to stop this.The only solution is to boycott the CT2017. You repeated anything doesnt turn lies into facts. LOL. The quote clearly mentions that BCCI's administrative flux has created this situation. Your actual quote : Manohar tried it earlier and could not because of BCCI's objection. Nowhere in the article it is even mentioned. So no I am not the one making up lies. And that's without even going to the OP where it was mentioned the losses will be due to the overseas television rights.Another pack of lies. BCCI could politik because it had Srini as ICC president then.They couldn't now because Manohar is ICC president .
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