Faf du Plessis unavailable for Boxing Day Test

[Vijy]

12 minutes ago, putrevus said:

You may lose but if you go down fighting you can accept, for India to win lot of things have to go right and rain should have say in at least in one test.

 

This nonsense that India has seam attack to win in SA which all former players saying in press is ridiculous. 

 

I have been saying the samething to extrapolate our seamers SR and Avg from India to overseas is a big mistake.In India they are supporting act where they have become leading acts in SA and I don't think they are capable of it.I hope I am wrong but I don't how Pandya will magically become better bowler or Ishant/Shami will all of sudden become strike bowlers and run thru sides.

i find there is overconfidence about the batting more than the bowling.

[sandeep]

42 minutes ago, Vijy said:

yes, and if SA overdoes rhe green tracks, I can see us winning a test. however, I feel our best chance to win overseas is Oz, Eng and SA in thar order.

Eng, SA, Oz for me.  

[Vijy]

2 minutes ago, sandeep said:

Eng, SA, Oz for me.  

in principle, this is correct. however, i bumped eng down in my list since in players have shown some weird psychological wobbliness against them. rather like post-lords 2014, etc. i think the bell, anderson, etc. episodes got into their heads too much.

[sandeep]

8 minutes ago, Vijy said:

in principle, this is correct. however, i bumped eng down in my list since in players have shown some weird psychological wobbliness against them. rather like post-lords 2014, etc. i think the bell, anderson, etc. episodes got into their heads too much.

Naah.  It was the perennial lack of depth in the bowling unit, and shaky openers.   Apart from Bhuvi, the rest of the bowling simply wasn't incisive enough that series.  The reason I'm so optimistic about our chances in all 3 tours, perhaps overly so, is because I feel that the current team has addressed both those issues to a large extent.  

[sandeep]

35 minutes ago, putrevus said:

I have been saying the samething to extrapolate our seamers SR and Avg from India to overseas is a big mistake.In India they are supporting act where they have become leading acts in SA and I don't think they are capable of it.I hope I am wrong but I don't how Pandya will magically become better bowler or Ishant/Shami will all of sudden become strike bowlers and run thru sides.

Fair point.  But expectation is not the same as extrapolation.  

 

 

[Vijy]

2 minutes ago, sandeep said:

Naah.  It was the perennial lack of depth in the bowling unit, and shaky openers.   Apart from Bhuvi, the rest of the bowling simply wasn't incisive enough that series.  The reason I'm so optimistic about our chances in all 3 tours, perhaps overly so, is because I feel that the current team has addressed both those issues to a large extent.  

Unless the pitches favour the bowlers, our 5th bowler will be crucial and I don't think Pandya is a good enough 5th bowler for Tests. this could prove to be a real stumbling block on flatter pitches in Oz. however, lot of speculation at this point of course.

 

another reason why I put Oz ahead of Eng and SA is because most of our batsmen can handle Oz pitches (provided they are the same as they have been in recent times). I expect Eng to use home advantage to whatever degree they can, and not many batsmen in this team convince me against swing.

[sandeep]

8 minutes ago, Vijy said:

Unless the pitches favour the bowlers, our 5th bowler will be crucial and I don't think Pandya is a good enough 5th bowler for Tests. this could prove to be a real stumbling block on flatter pitches in Oz. however, lot of speculation at this point of course.

 

another reason why I put Oz ahead of Eng and SA is because most of our batsmen can handle Oz pitches (provided they are the same as they have been in recent times). I expect Eng to use home advantage to whatever degree they can, and not many batsmen in this team convince me against swing.

If England "use home advantage"  I don't think the likes of Malan, Vince, Stoneman, etc are that much better against swing than Rahane, Pujara, Vijay.   

 

Pandya's bowling has got a long way to go, he's a 6th bowler at this point.   But you are underestimating the value he would add by reducing the work-load on the top 3 pacers.  The likes of Moeen and Stokes aren't that great with the ball either - if you take a close look, they are only able to take wickets when the top bowlers are doing well.   Test teams win by putting up performances greater than the sum of their individual parts.  And I believe our team, this team is capable of doing just that.   Not saying its going to happen, but the odds are decent.   

[Vijy]

Just now, sandeep said:

If England "use home advantage"  I don't think the likes of Malan, Vince, Stoneman, etc are that much better against swing than Rahane, Pujara, Vijay.   

 

Pandya's bowling has got a long way to go, he's a 6th bowler at this point.   But you are underestimating the value he would add by reducing the work-load on the top 3 pacers.  The likes of Moeen and Stokes aren't that great with the ball either - if you take a close look, they are only able to take wickets when the top bowlers are doing well.   Test teams win by putting up performances greater than the sum of their individual parts.  And I believe our team, this team is capable of doing just that.   Not saying its going to happen, but the odds are decent.   

don't know about malan, but stoneman has played mostly at durham which has some of the most swing-friendly conditions. vince on the other hand is very loose and can become a walking wkt. similarly, I would not put chepu along with rahane and vijay. he can block fine, but the problem is that he gets stuck and one good ball can dismiss him in the 20s and 30s after playing 100 balls or so. as a whole, I think the eng batting is certainly weak but I expect the greater experience of bronderson will come into the picture despite the fact that barbie is far past his best.

 

Not easy to compare pandya and ali, but comparing him with stokes is easier. I think stokes is the better test bowler for now (although by no means as good as eng press claims). the reason mostly comes down to more bowling experience (both in FC and tests). pandya for me is a 6th bowler as you said, whereas I would consider stokes a 5th bowler. I see him as someone who can get 5-wkt hauls, esp if others apply pressure but pandya has not reached that stage.

[King Tendulkar]

3 hours ago, Gollum said:

If they play Steyn, Morkel, Rabada, Philander and Maharaj in the XI will this be the greatest bowling attack (at least on paper if not on form) against us in the last 15-20 years? 

Yep and it will make it even sweeter when man of the match is ishant

[rkt.india]

12 hours ago, Vijy said:

Unless the pitches favour the bowlers, our 5th bowler will be crucial and I don't think Pandya is a good enough 5th bowler for Tests. this could prove to be a real stumbling block on flatter pitches in Oz. however, lot of speculation at this point of course.

 

another reason why I put Oz ahead of Eng and SA is because most of our batsmen can handle Oz pitches (provided they are the same as they have been in recent times). I expect Eng to use home advantage to whatever degree they can, and not many batsmen in this team convince me against swing.

actually, Pandya will be a better test bowler than LOIs. dont judge his bowling based on LOIs. 

[Vijy]

7 hours ago, rkt.india said:

actually, Pandya will be a better test bowler than LOIs. dont judge his bowling based on LOIs. 

we will find out soon enough.

[Vilander]

23 hours ago, Gollum said:

Keh ke lenge hamaari yeh log. Have such negative vibes before this series, last time I felt this hopeless was before touring UK in 2014. 

most negative poster after fineleg. 

[Gollum]

2 hours ago, Vilander said:

most negative poster after fineleg. 

She's a pessimist, I am a realist, big difference.

[Vijy]

47 minutes ago, Gollum said:

She's a pessimist, I am a realist, big difference.

for some reason, people mix up these 2 categories.