Shami ahmed-First impression..!!!

[Old guy]

Bhuvi was bowling brilliantly earlier but looks like he has lost 5 k in pace' date=' with the pace he also lost seam movement, he bowled 130 to 137 earlier and got good seam movement, he is young and should develop rather then regress, he should look at Hilfy who has a similar action and worked hard and upped his pace from 130 to 140 k and changed as a bowler.[/quote'] pace is not problem..he is mainly a swing bowler and there was no swing here.. i can assure you he was still doing everything like before..now ofc if conditions are cooler and pitches help you bend your back a little and on flatter conditions you try to contain more than attack..

[MCcricket]

pace is not problem..he is mainly a swing bowler and there was no swing here.. i can assure you he was still doing everything like before..now ofc if conditions are cooler and pitches help you bend your back a little and on flatter conditions you try to contain more than attack..

I see a difference in his bowling for sure also with the way he is bowling he is not in my test 11 for sure.

[Crookbond]

vo kon hai ?

Australia - he was a medium pacer and bowled quite a lot at the death with http://www.espncricinfo.com/India/content/player/5597.html

He clubs a few runs here and nails the odd wicket there while going for around five an over, which is better than it sounds given that he bowls always in the rush hour.

[Lord]

vo kon hai ? yeah guy south africa try to bowl out at start ?

he has bowled at death whenever I've seen :blink:

[SLICKR392]

bk will again do fine on tracks which provide help .. before this series started i just asked has he ever played on pattas and people thought i was trolling but truth is he has been lucky with tracks and conditions .. he needs to develop further and get stronger too

He still went under 6 RPO and bowled well in the end in the last game. Excluding the 1st Test, he bowled better than the Aussies with the new ball in the series earlier this year. Got us crucial breakthroughs and they weren't the best wickets for a quick. On these roads, I feel its important to have someone with good pace and seam movement and Shami had it all. McKay had good seam movement as well but he lacked pace.

[Old guy]

I see a difference in his bowling for sure also with the way he is bowling he is not in my test 11 for sure.

well lets give him one test atleast ?

Australia - he was a medium pacer and bowled quite a lot at the death with http://www.espncricinfo.com/India/content/player/5597.html

so australia's vinay kumar :two_thumbs_up:

he has bowled at death whenever I've seen :blink:

owling against pak does not counts ..

He still went under 6 RPO and bowled well in the end in the last game. Excluding the 1st Test, he bowled better than the Aussies with the new ball in the series earlier this year. Got us crucial breakthroughs and they weren't the best wickets for a quick. On these roads, I feel its important to have someone with good pace and seam movement and Shami had it all. McKay had good seam movement as well but he lacked pace.

mohali def had help for bowlers and siddle and pattinson were much better then him on occasions bhuvi was decent and got those hacks out quickly on 2 occasions from what i remember ..

[express bowling]

I don't think you can say that without becoming pretty hardcore in support of a statistical based approach to selection. Things like height and release speed cannot be really called genuine objective factors considering height is only valuable in terms of bounce and release speed in terms of the difficulty for the batsmen to react.

Firstly, just release speed or height , by themselves, do not become the basis for selection. A host of factors are looked at including release speed, height/bounce, actual performance , ability to seam and swing, temperament, control, whether he bowls to a plan, ability to bowl yorkers, bouncers, slower deliveries etc. etc. Height contributes to not only bounce but a steeper trajectory of the ball from a bowler's hand which makes it more awkward for the batsmen. As 90% of all good pacers have had either decent release speed or height, it seems logical to make atleast one of them to be a very high priority. A bowler, even a spinnner, must have some tool to hurry the batsman. If it is not release speed or bounce, then it should be late movement or zip off the pitch. Vinay has nothing.

[Old guy]

btw going under 6 rpo is fine and all but this is one guy dhoni did not bowl at death much and he picked up one wicket in this series ..there is no excuse for just picking one wicket when shami showed you can get help from track and there were plenty of hacks in aussie line up who suck against swing

[NareshK]

Its funny how someone is saying Bhuvi is bowling at 130 and therefore not as effective as when he is bowling 135. As someone made a thread about it earlier, most of us don't have a clue about seam bowling and still talk as if we know everything. According to them, if the speedometer shows 140, he is a good bowler, otherwise he is not good. :facepalm:

[Old guy]

Its funny how someone is saying Bhuvi is bowling at 130 and therefore not as effective as when he is bowling 135. As someone made a thread about it earlier' date=' most of us don't have a clue about seam bowling and still talk as if we know everything. According to them, if the speedometer shows 140, he is a good bowler, otherwise he is not good. :facepalm:[/quote'] like i said pace was not problem..he just did not get swing in air which made him lethal and one 1 wicket in series show this ..

[msb1991]

give me on example of bowler in world who is good at death but lacks pace ? :hmmm:

A good death bowler in flat pitches is probably just Malinga.

[Lord]

owling against pak does not counts .. /QUOTE] what about SL in SL?Has done it many times v India too

[Old guy]

please show me links of matches as i honestly do not see any more sri lanka matches and with india he bowled with new ball only

[Lord]

McKay has bowled well at death too except this series

[Old guy]

A good death bowler in flat pitches is probably just Malinga.

definition of good must change now anyone who goes for less than 10 rpo is good :cantstop:

[NareshK]

like i said pace was not problem..he just did not get swing in air which made him lethal and one 1 wicket in series show this ..

This series was played on flat batting pitches. You hardly get any swing either in air or off the pitch and hence he couldnt get movement. He was still the pick of Indian seamers and bowled at an economy rate around 5 when other bowlers from either sides were going close to 8.

[Old guy]

This series was played on flat batting pitches. You hardly get any swing either in air or off the pitch and hence he couldnt get movement. He was still the pick of Indian seamers and bowled at an economy rate around 5 when other bowlers from either sides were going close to 8.

best indian seamer was shami infact he was probably best from either sides . and he got plenty of movement of pitch atleast.

[NareshK]

best indian seamer was shami infact he was probably best from either sides . and he got plenty of movement of pitch atleast.

He was good too. He got some decent movement in the game only at Ranchi which Bhuvi didnt play and he would have been very effective there. In the 6th ODI, Bhuvi did better than him on a flat track. In the final ODI, Bhuvi kept it tight and bowled at a decent economy rate given the conditions and the overall scoring rate.

[Old guy]

He was good too. He got some decent movement in the game at Ranchi which Bhuvi didnt play and he would have been very effective there.

what about last game ? again he picked wickets and bhuvi did not bhuvi kept bowling on leg stump of hughes and even with haddin he did not bowl in right areas to me he is bowling too short

[Forever Indian]

best indian seamer was shami infact he was probably best from either sides . and he got plenty of movement of pitch atleast.

Shami got seam movement, nobody got swing in this series barring Ranchi to some extent early on. Shami is a seam and swing bowler, none of the other bowlers on either side are seam bowlers. Seam bowler will be effective on pitches which has bit of pace. Even Johnson relied on pace and bounce rather than seam to get his wickets. This series is not a place to judge bowlers, as only certain type of bowlers can survive on this. We saw in the England tour of India ODIs where Shami and Bhuvi opened the attack as to who was more effective. So we should not forget Bhuvi's contribution till date and judge him on one series which have been a graveyard for most bowlers.