rkt.india Posted December 16, 2013 Posted December 16, 2013 He is quick. But not as quick as Johnson or AKhtar or Lee on a consistent basis. Johnson was not backed when he was spraying . Infact he was ridiculed. He is doing well because he is accurate now. Even with accuracy he hasn't threatened their top order much in this match. I don't think any countries encourage spray guns. Because they always have another bowler who can bowl almost fast enough. If Johnson was encouraged he would have played in the Ashes in England. One day series in India ' date=' Pattnison's injury helped his cause. Umesh is definitely the fastest in India. That is the only reason he is even in the squad. So he does get a bit of backing. In Tests unlike one dayers Dhoni cannot underuse him. He will have a chance. When he gets a chance he should try to bowl as fast as possible.[/quote'] Johnson was backed by him team and board. Only others ridiculed him, He did not play in Ashes because he was coming back from injury and they had Pattinson, Starc, etc. Regarding ODIs, how many ODIs have Pattinson played. Even a guy like Morkel used to be very wayward but still backed. Umesh can bowl as quick as Johnson. Even in last ODI, he was clocking 91mph without much effort, averaging speeds in 87-88 mph range and that is consistent pace and that is when he was certainly bowling within himself. Every genuine fast bowlers starts being erratic but they are backed because they are a rare commodity. Even in Australia, there is only one bowler who can clock 145K as consistently and that is Cummins who too is injury prone. Problem with MSD is, he has no clue to how to handle a fast bowlers. You cannot expect Umesh to bowl like Zaheer. He will have to calk out a different play to use Umesh. Umesh even when he is not hitting three-quarter lengths can be used as an aggressive option and enforcer and ask others to compliment him with accurate bowling. Johnson and his partners are doing the same here. Johnson is not hitting 150 plus. He is mostly around 142-148K most times. Yadav hits the same pace.
vvvslaxman Posted December 16, 2013 Posted December 16, 2013 Johnson was backed by him team and board. Only others ridiculed him, He did not play in Ashes because he was coming back from injury and they had Pattinson, Starc, etc. Regarding ODIs, how many ODIs have Pattinson played. Even a guy like Morkel used to be very wayward but still backed. Umesh can bowl as quick as Johnson. Even in last ODI, he was clocking 91mph without much effort, averaging speeds in 87-88 mph range and that is consistent pace and that is when he was certainly bowling within himself. Every genuine fast bowlers starts being erratic but they are backed because they are a rare commodity. Even in Australia, there is only one bowler who can clock 145K as consistently and that is Cummins who too is injury prone. Problem with MSD is, he has no clue to how to handle a fast bowlers. You cannot expect Umesh to bowl like Zaheer. He will have to calk out a different play to use Umesh. Umesh even when he is not hitting three-quarter lengths can be used as an aggressive option and enforcer and ask others to compliment him with accurate bowling. Johnson and his partners are doing the same here. Johnson is not hitting 150 plus. He is mostly around 142-148K most times. Yadav hits the same pace. I am sorry man You are forcing Umesh to be someone who he clearly is not. With his short stature and reasonably flattish trajectory he is much closer to be an Akhtar or Waqar than a Johnson or Brett Lee. He should focus on pitch it up and try to find edges. If you are going to use a 145k bowler as an intimidatory force result will be :fail: . 150k minimum is needed consistently . That too with accuracy. That is a big big call. Akhtar despite raw pace rarely erred in accuracy. So was Waqar. Unless Umesh exhibit a terrific stock delivery that can get batsman out day in day out he should forget about chasing dreams like "being an intimidating fast bowler". That will only ruin his career.
Old guy Posted December 16, 2013 Posted December 16, 2013 umesh's stock ball is his swing he should actually bowl full and his natural variation of seam will get wickets its when he bowls short he looks ordinary
rkt.india Posted December 16, 2013 Posted December 16, 2013 I am sorry man You are forcing Umesh to be someone who he clearly is not. With his short stature and reasonably flattish trajectory he is much closer to be an Akhtar or Waqar than a Johnson or Brett Lee. He should focus on pitch it up and try to find edges. If you are going to use a 145k bowler as an intimidatory force result will be :fail: . 150k minimum is needed consistently . That too with accuracy. That is a big big call. Akhtar despite raw pace rarely erred in accuracy. So was Waqar. Unless Umesh exhibit a terrific stock delivery that can get batsman out day in day out he should forget about chasing dreams like "being an intimidating fast bowler". That will only ruin his career. Even Johnson is hitting only 145K and is not a tall bowler by any means. Regarding Akhtar and Waqar, Akhtar has intimidated batsmen more than Johnson has. OTT, I am not saying only ot use that way. It is one way. He a very good outswinger. I am only talking when you need such a strategy. Umesh has most of his wickets when he bowls fuller lengths anyway and that is his real strength.
adi B Posted December 16, 2013 Posted December 16, 2013 So why not bowl at 60mph? As remember pace is not important. Just be accurate ? In fact why 60' date=' bowl at 50 mph![/quote'] :cantstop:
express bowling Posted January 5, 2014 Posted January 5, 2014 Umesh can be a much better bowler if he gets the backing of his captain and coach. Given his medium height and 140 to 150 k pace ( same as Morkel, Steyn )..... His stock delivery should be good length channel. But, he can be used as an intimidating pacer from time to time. He cannot do it always but from time to time when the situation warrants. He should be encouraged to bowl really quick and aim for top of off stump with a few bouncers as variation and for intimidation. Forget about everything else. Then, he will be a different bowler.
King Tendulkar Posted January 5, 2014 Posted January 5, 2014 ^ Absolutley And those saying he is not as quick as him and him of other countries, miss the point. He is the uickest indian bowler and a good 10 mph quicker then BK and Vinnay and Unad**** Also MJ and co. Do you think they rocked up and eliverd instantly. No Aussies backed, groomed and played the qicks. They understand importance of pace and told them yes be accurate, move it etc BUT NOT AT COMPROMISE OF PACE. Our attitude a game or 2 when ball is not on string for a yadav type, o cut down yaa,r just be accurate, whats the point indians cant be fast.
King Tendulkar Posted January 5, 2014 Posted January 5, 2014 By the way Yadav has bowling average of 32 which is a lot better the BK and Ishant. And he has weapons to really develop and become a force So based on stats not just that he has skill in pace to be test match bowle,r he should be in side. Maybe he needs to sleep with dhobi and be done with it
express bowling Posted January 5, 2014 Posted January 5, 2014 By the way Yadav has bowling average of 32 which is a lot better the BK and Ishant. And he has weapons to really develop and become a force So based on stats not just that he has skill in pace to be test match bowle,r he should be in side. That is the funny part. Those who criticize hum for his inaccuracy forget that in tests he has a strike rate of 46 ( excellent by international standards ) and average of 32 ( good by Indian standards ). Yet, BK and Ishant with 38 + averages and 65 + SR are preferred over him. So, basically, we are preferring 2 slower and non wicket taking pacers over a fast wicket taking pacer.
King Tendulkar Posted January 5, 2014 Posted January 5, 2014 That is the funny part. Those who criticize hum for his inaccuracy forget that in tests he has a strike rate of 46 ( excellent by international standards ) and average of 32 ( good by Indian standards ). Yet, BK and Ishant with 38 + averages and 65 + SR are preferred over him. So, basically, we are preferring 2 slower and non wicket taking pacers over a fast wicket taking pacer. Welcome to india:--D The land which admires other countries 90mph bowlers but does everything to hinder and stop any fast bowlers we have:giggle: Remember up and coming indian semaers. Dont worry about pace, just bowl nice accurate line with some out swing at anything under 80 mph
Vijy Posted January 5, 2014 Posted January 5, 2014 Yadav should be playing, and so should Shami. However, the third pacer should be someone who can bowl dry a la Siddle
King Tendulkar Posted January 5, 2014 Posted January 5, 2014 Yadav should be playing' date=' and so should Shami. However, the third pacer should be someone who can bowl dry a la Siddle[/quote'] What the 3rd seamer who bowls a lot of his spells in 84 to 88mph range. yeah i would be happy with that:two_thumbs_up:
Vijy Posted January 5, 2014 Posted January 5, 2014 What the 3rd seamer who bowls a lot of his spells in 84 to 88mph range. yeah i would be happy with that:two_thumbs_up: Yep, a third seamer that good would be ideal.:giggle:
express bowling Posted January 5, 2014 Posted January 5, 2014 First, let us get our second seamer right. :--D
Vijy Posted January 5, 2014 Posted January 5, 2014 First' date=' let us get our second seamer right. :--D[/quote'] Secondly, lets focus on ensuring that the first seamer does not degenerate into trundler.:giggle:
Scarves Posted January 5, 2014 Posted January 5, 2014 I find it that more people outside of India rate Yadav more than his own country. The guy is quick, bowls good short stuff and takes wickets.
express bowling Posted January 5, 2014 Posted January 5, 2014 Secondly' date=' lets focus on ensuring that the first seamer does not degenerate into trundler.:giggle:[/quote'] Yep.
King Tendulkar Posted January 5, 2014 Posted January 5, 2014 I find it that more people outside of India rate Yadav more than his own country. The guy is quick' date=' bowls good short stuff and takes wickets.[/quote'] When we play other countries, you see the other comms being really impressed by Yadav, prasing his pace and how india have found one here to go with. They are almost shocked when they see him clock 90mph plus and against england I remeber some of the eng comms being very suprised and saying he was quickest bowler in match. Same went for aaron in his few games. Yet we dont want them and moan when hit for a 4 trying to bowl quick. We will never get it OR not untill we have a skipper who gets it and ignores the trundling lobby
rkt.india Posted January 6, 2014 Posted January 6, 2014 Umesh can be a much better bowler if he gets the backing of his captain and coach. Given his medium height and 140 to 150 k pace ( same as Morkel, Steyn )..... His stock delivery should be good length channel. But, he can be used as an intimidating pacer from time to time. He cannot do it always but from time to time when the situation warrants. He should be encouraged to bowl really quick and aim for top of off stump with a few bouncers as variation and for intimidation. Forget about everything else. Then, he will be a different bowler. Here is what Umesh can do too. 13.1 Yadav to Warner, OUT, didn't take long coming, that wicket, after the break. Yadav's sent Warner on his way. This was a set-up, and Warner couldn't resist. Square leg went back, suggesting there could be a bumper round the corner. It came immediately, it was quite pacy, it wasn't outside off like the last time, and Warner couldn't quite slot the hook away. He was cramped for room, but still went for it with hard hands. It lobbed off the glove to the leg side, and Dhoni took it easy. DA Warner c †Dhoni b Yadav 37 (59m 49b 4x4 1x6) SR: 75.51
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