Philander brings an end to Steyn's 186-match run as No. 1 Test bowler

[I6MTW]

Philander hasn't played in India yet. Personally, I find philander to be a bit overrated. Yes, he is useful and capable of being potent. But, he's not as deadly has people make him out to be. He has struggled when conditions don't favor him.

[Old guy]

They are not at all similar bowlers. BK is a swing bowler who mostly releases the ball' date=' Philander is a hit the deck bowler. Both have completely different bowling actions as well. BK is predominant inswing action. Philander a bit round armish. Philander bowls from so close to the stumps that he always hits 4th stump line and ball seams away both ways from there.[/quote'] people dont get these differences and irony is they make same mistake which they accuse so called fast bowlers fans off that judging bowlers by pace :winky:

[vvvslaxman]

people dont get these differences and irony is they make same mistake which they accuse so called fast bowlers fans off that judging bowlers by pace :winky:

+1 We equate Umesh to Johnson :cantstop:

[Old guy]

+1 We equate Umesh to Johnson :cantstop:

he is totally different kind of bowler but still closer comparison that bhuvi and philander :giggle: cos he did bang up lots of heads while in australia and he is jsut as wayward as johnson was and just as lethal at perth :haha:

[vvvslaxman]

he is totally different kind of bowler but still closer comparison that bhuvi and philander :giggle: cos he did bang up lots of heads while in australia and he is jsut as wayward as johnson was and just as lethal at perth :haha:

I am going to name some of our fans as CSA ( Not cricket south africa) clock speed addicts :cantstop: . Whatever you see there be it is Ranji trophy or under 19 their orgasm level is directly proportional to clock speed. Even if the batsman get so much time to thrash you around as long as it is 150 k they are fine with it. Ashwin sometimes clocks as high as Ajmal at normal speed. But aJmal is much quicker.

[Old guy]

I am going to name some of our fans as CSA ( Not cricket south africa) clock speed addicts :cantstop: . Whatever you see there be it is Ranji trophy or under 19 their orgasm level is directly proportional to clock speed. Even if the batsman get so much time to thrash you around as long as it is 150 k they are fine with it. Ashwin sometimes clocks as high as Ajmal at normal speed. But aJmal is much quicker.

i just care about wicket taking ability in tests if speed helps it then so be it and if you can it without speed then too perfect would take ishant who bowls at 130k but picks wickets over ishant who bowled 150 k in australia for no wickets but one thing do but if you have similar skill and more pace ..more pace is always better:winky:

[vvvslaxman]

i just care about wicket taking ability in tests if speed helps it then so be it and if you can it without speed then too perfect would take ishant who bowls at 130k but picks wickets over ishant who bowled 150 k in australia for no wickets but one thing do but if you have similar skill and more pace ..more pace is always better:winky:

I believe the same wicket taking ability is first and foremost. Mohammad Asif, Mcgrath, Pollock were not really express pace bowlers. Zak was also not one. If you are bowler good enough to create doubts in batsman's mind there you get the extra pace albeit imaginary. If the batsman is in doubt even slow pace will look quicker. On slow pitches they might be found wanting. But even good pacers will be found wanting there. By hook or crook take wickets.. don't care what speed you bowl.

[Old guy]

I believe the same wicket taking ability is first and foremost. Mohammad Asif' date=' Mcgrath, Pollock were not really express pace bowlers. Zak was also not one. If you are bowler good enough to create doubts in batsman's mind there you get the extra pace albeit imaginary. If the batsman is in doubt even slow pace will look quicker. On slow pitches they might be found wanting. But even good pacers will be found wanting there. By hook or crook take wickets.. don't care what speed you bowl.[/quote'] my argument is zack would have been even better bowler if he bowled quicker not that he is bad he is awesome.. hope you see what i am saying but also see the fact even with all his skill zack averages so high and same for anderson mcgrath is atg but there are many quick bowlers who are atg too more over people forget its team game...an attack should consist of every type of bowler to be perfect mcgrath had steyn and other fast bowlers backing him same with pollock who had donald who was even better no? ..but that is ideal scenario right now competition was between umesh yadav and bhuvan...its not really yadav vs mcgrath thats all i am saying..

[vvvslaxman]

I also like to see Umesh in the side. But i am cautious about expectations. Still unfinished. The record he has should not be extrapolated into a future great. I am just basing my opinion on his basic bowling skills. Good luck to him. If at all he gets picked he will be used in short spells like 3 or 4 overs full steam. So India will once again be down to 3 bowlers filling the quota.. That is where i think Umesh is losing a bit of favor.

[Old guy]

I also like to see Umesh in the side. But i am cautious about expectations. Still unfinished. The record he has should not be extrapolated into a future great. I am just basing my opinion on his basic bowling skills. Good luck to him. If at all he gets picked he will be used in short spells like 3 or 4 overs full steam. So India will once again be down to 3 bowlers filling the quota.. That is where i think Umesh is losing a bit of favor.

he is probably fittest guy fast bowling does not means short spells he can bowl more than zack easily @ 80 percent pace and still be as quick as ishant if not more

[vvvslaxman]

he is probably fittest guy fast bowling does not means short spells he can bowl more than zack easily @ 80 percent pace and still be as quick as ishant if not more

It is not about being fit. If you are going to allow your bowler to go all out, it is hard to maintain intensity for 6 overs unless you are some freak like Johnson. But onus is on Umesh to provide strike.

[Old guy]

It is not about being fit. If you are going to allow your bowler to go all out' date=' it is hard to maintain intensity for 6 overs unless you are some freak like Johnson. But onus is on Umesh to provide strike.[/quote'] that is true for any bowler na ? just because his max is 150 does not means other guy is not putting his all while bowling at 140k ! this is myth people have, he bowls fast cos his body can and cos he is fit so even if he goes all out its same as zack going all out at his pace and bowling at full intensity you can bowl him normally too or you can bowl shami and yadav in short spells and ishant and zack in little longer totally depends on ur strategy they all can bowl short spells if needed ..

[Ram]

Philander does not have any real great skills like swing of Steyn or Anderson' date=' but he is metronomic in the mold of McGrath. Does not swing the ball much but keeps it in the area just around off stump consistently. Key here is consistency and hitting the deck hard and with his wobbly seam, batsmen find it difficult to assess which way the ball will move after pitching and here he troubles them and he is not really slow, bowls around 130-135 which can be good enough in test cricket if you can bowl with that much consistency and this is what most bowlers cannot do.[/quote'] Being accurate is not a skill? :dontknow:

[MCcricket]

Philander is a glorified trundle and only the likes of his type are successful in SA, NZ, ENG, his best days are over, works for their attack with Steyn, Morkel as the attacking bowlers but, Philander, Tsotsobe, Kleinveldt would make a poor attack, SA are short of good back up bowlers it seems

[f.b.m]

Being accurate is not a skill? :dontknow:

Bowling phaasht is a skill too.

[vvvslaxman]

Bowling phaasht is a skill too.

Not really. VRV singh, Tino Best , Mohammad Sami (Pak) bowl fast :cantstop:

[CG]

I also like to see Umesh in the side. But i am cautious about expectations. Still unfinished. The record he has should not be extrapolated into a future great. I am just basing my opinion on his basic bowling skills. Good luck to him. If at all he gets picked he will be used in short spells like 3 or 4 overs full steam. So India will once again be down to 3 bowlers filling the quota.. That is where i think Umesh is losing a bit of favor.

No you aren,t.Its just ridiculous when a guy who has done well is treated like that.

[rkt.india]

I am going to name some of our fans as CSA ( Not cricket south africa) clock speed addicts :cantstop: . Whatever you see there be it is Ranji trophy or under 19 their orgasm level is directly proportional to clock speed. Even if the batsman get so much time to thrash you around as long as it is 150 k they are fine with it. Ashwin sometimes clocks as high as Ajmal at normal speed. But aJmal is much quicker.

It is because of trajectory. Ajmal is a short guy, so he has lower trajectory which gives you less time to react, Ashwin being a tall guy has a higher trajectory. He will have to bowl much quicker than Ajmal to hurry batsmen.

[rkt.india]

Not really. VRV singh' date=' Tino Best , Mohammad Sami (Pak) bowl fast :cantstop:[/quote'] Sami still averages more than most Indian bowlers in ODIs. Success does not depend only on one thing. Pace is an added advantage, it wont make you world class, but it depends upon how do you use that pace to good effect. Even the fastest bowler will have to bowl in the right areas. Wrt, VRV, it is unfair to ridicule him because he was very young and raw at that time and could not play enough matches as he was never fit. He still has an SR of 40 in FC.

[rkt.india]

Being accurate is not a skill? :dontknow:

Even the fastest bowler will have to be accurate to be successful. It is an essential part of bowling. Philander lacks pace so has to concentrate more on accuracy. While quicker bowlers like Steyn can get away with lesser accuracy because if extra pace. Both are difficult things to achieve. Pace is mostly in-born while accuracy is a result of hard work in the nets.