rkt.india Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 (edited) 3 minutes ago, express bowling said: Not every successful pacer is an outswing bowler. He will just have to bowl more deliveries that hold their line or seam away name me one really successful inswing bowler? have not seen one in last 25 years. Edited January 25, 2018 by rkt.india Link to comment
Rightarmfast Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 34 minutes ago, rkt.india said: it is one of the reasons. Bumrah needs to take the ball away from right handers, which is not going to happen often by bowling so wide of the crease. Outswing bowlers are the most successful bowlers in these conditions. by bowling wide of the crease, you are giving batsmen an easy angle to work with. why people like Steyn, Philander, Hazlewood, even BK are so good because they do not give any angle to work with. Nobody becomes a better bowler/batsmen by leaving their own style. And I just wonder on what basis are you saying outswing bowlers are more successful in these conditions. Do you have statistics? He just needs to be better at what he does. He just needs more experience and needs to add more variety. Link to comment
Rightarmfast Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 4 minutes ago, rkt.india said: name me one really successful inswing bowler? have not seen one in last 25 years. But you have said it takes to be an outswing bowler to take wickets. So the onus of proof is on you. You need to give stats of outswing bowlers vs inswing bowlers in these conditions. Just saw Bhuvi bowls some unplayable inswing deliveries. Link to comment
rkt.india Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 2 minutes ago, Rightarmfast said: But you have said it takes to be an outswing bowler to take wickets. So the onus of proof is on you. You need to give stats of outswing bowlers vs inswing bowlers in these conditions. Just saw Bhuvi bowls some unplayable inswing deliveries. first you need to have inswing bowlers to site examples. Yes, BK bowled inswing but he is not bowling wide of the crease. he is bowler from closure to the stumps. Even Philander does the same. Because they threaten both inside and outside edges. Batsmen are never sure whether ball with come in after pitch or move away. My problem is with wide of the crease approach and angling everything in. with wide of the crease, it is very difficult to take ball away consistently, batsmen just has to counter for the ball coming in. You are not threatening outside edge consistently. take the most successful test bowlers most bowled closure to the stumps and i do not need to give any example for that or statistics. last most successful wide of the crease bowler was Ntini who averaged 29 despite playing on some of the most helpful pitches for fast bowlers in SA. Link to comment
rkt.india Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 7 minutes ago, vishalvirsingh said: Why no shammi he bowled poorly. only BK and Ishant have bowled well. Link to comment
Mosher Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 Banana inswinger from Kumar at 138k to get AB's wicket was express bowling 1 Link to comment
express bowling Posted January 25, 2018 Author Share Posted January 25, 2018 11 minutes ago, rkt.india said: name me one really successful inswing bowler? have not seen one in last 25 years. Why only inswing bowlers ? Lots successful pacers have been those who got seam movement with bounce. A good inswing bowler would be Waqar. Rightarmfast 1 Link to comment
Rightarmfast Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 2 minutes ago, rkt.india said: first you need to have inswing bowlers to site examples. Yes, BK bowled inswing but he is not bowling wide of the crease. he is bowler from closure to the stumps. Even Philander does the same. Because they threaten both inside and outside edges. Batsmen are never sure whether ball with come in after pitch or move away. My problem is with wide of the crease approach and angling everything in. with wide of the crease, it is very difficult to take ball away consistently, batsmen just has to counter for the ball coming in. You are not threatening outside edge consistently. take the most successful test bowlers most bowled closure to the stumps and i do not need to give any example for that or statistics. last most successful wide of the crease bowler was Ntini who averaged 29 despite playing on some of the most helpful pitches for fast bowlers in SA. Like I said, very simplistic analysis and understanding. Link to comment
rkt.india Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 4 minutes ago, express bowling said: Why only inswing bowlers ? Lots successful pacers have been those who got seam movement with bounce. A good inswing bowler would be Waqar. waqar was an outswing bowler Link to comment
express bowling Posted January 25, 2018 Author Share Posted January 25, 2018 SA commentator saying that Bumrah's angling in ball, when it straightens, becomes almost impossible to leave. I agree. The day Bumrah understands the exact line and length needed for his bowling style, he will run through sides. sandeep 1 Link to comment
express bowling Posted January 25, 2018 Author Share Posted January 25, 2018 3 minutes ago, rkt.india said: waqar was an outswing bowler Most of his wickets were using inswing. And what about the bouncy seam bowlers ? Link to comment
rkt.india Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 4 minutes ago, Rightarmfast said: Like I said, very simplistic analysis and understanding. The reason we say in cricket keep it simple. It is not as complicated as you think but not as simple too as you said in your reply because these are those simple things people do not understand and overlook. I look at what kind of mode of dismissals a bowler brings. the best test bowler is one who brings in most kind of dismissals. Bumrah does not do that currently. His mode of dismissals currently are either LBW or bowled and you cannot be really successful with just these two. The most important mode of dismissal overseas for pacers is outside edge, which Bumrah does not bring into play due to his prominent angle. Link to comment
rkt.india Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 1 minute ago, express bowling said: Most of his wickets were using inswing. And what about the bouncy seam bowlers ? outswing bowlers include seam bowlers too because it is not actually outswing but outseam in SA that we are getting. we normally use swing for seam too like people confuse Sreesanth as a swing bowler who actually was a seam bowler. bounce is not the biggest necessity but movement is. No one gets more bounce than Morkel but he is not the most successful bowler. Link to comment
rkt.india Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 (edited) 8 minutes ago, express bowling said: SA commentator saying that Bumrah's angling in ball, when it straightens, becomes almost impossible to leave. I agree. The day Bumrah understands the exact line and length needed for his bowling style, he will run through sides. yes, it becomes impossible to leave but it wont get many wickets. one odd ball will move away but mostly will come in. people used to say same thing about Ishant and see his career. Edited January 25, 2018 by rkt.india Link to comment
express bowling Posted January 25, 2018 Author Share Posted January 25, 2018 (edited) Bumrah bowls duPlessis with a sharply in-seaming 145 k ball Edited January 25, 2018 by express bowling Silva and Mosher 2 Link to comment
express bowling Posted January 25, 2018 Author Share Posted January 25, 2018 Just now, rkt.india said: yes, it becomes impossible to leave but it wont get many wickets. If the ball seams away, it may take the outside edge. Link to comment
Rightarmfast Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 1 minute ago, express bowling said: Bumrah bowls duPlessis with a sharply in-seaming 145 k ball I think the keyword here is 'INSWING' express bowling 1 Link to comment
Rightarmfast Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 7 minutes ago, rkt.india said: The reason we say in cricket keep it simple. It is not as complicated as you think but not as simple too as you said in your reply because these are those simple things people do not understand and overlook. I look at what kind of mode of dismissals a bowler brings. the best test bowler is one who brings in most kind of dismissals. Bumrah does not do that currently. His mode of dismissals currently are either LBW or bowled and you cannot be really successful with just these two. The most important mode of dismissal overseas for pacers is outside edge, which Bumrah does not bring into play due to his prominent angle. Thats how you think! To do simple things, you need to do a lot many complicated things to get the simple things right. If bowling close to the stump was the only error, every bowler will start doing that. You kind of have your own fixed notions, and you think the whole cricket revolves around them. Sorry to be a bit blunt. Link to comment
rkt.india Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 1 minute ago, express bowling said: If the ball seams away, it may take the outside edge. problem is it will only happen on an odd ball and you get wickets when you do it consistently. he can do this on pitches like this that have so much for bowlers but wont happen on most pitches Link to comment
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