Sachin=GOD Posted August 8, 2015 Posted August 8, 2015 How Modi fell into Rahul's trap: revival depends on going back to who he was http://m.firstpost.com/politics/modi-fell-rahuls-trap-revival-depends-going-back-2384230.html Really good piece.
Sachin=GOD Posted August 8, 2015 Posted August 8, 2015 Rahul's trap :hysterical: Read the piece at least.
G_B_ Posted August 8, 2015 Posted August 8, 2015 its the firstpost, i think i will skip it. decided not to read that sensationalist rag
G_B_ Posted August 8, 2015 Posted August 8, 2015 No offense but were u depending on that lands for your livelihood? I am not going to lie. No i dont think we were at that time. My grandfather did grow some vegetables. But it was more to keep costs down rather than relying on it. But still 10% is highway robbery. Its much different for a farmer when his actual livelihood is snatched for 1/10 of the real market price that too without his concent.How exactly is he going to start a business or educate himself suddenly when he was a farmer all his life? All that will do is force him into manual labour and increase poverty. But its not. He is going to get twice its value in urban and 4 times in rural areas thats 400%. Not 10%. If it was 10% i would be protesting against the bill. The farmer keep the money in a government bank. Earn interest on the said money and at the same time do a manual job. In most cases the farmer will be financially better off. Most farmers dont just do farming. Apart from sowing and harvesting season they do indeed do manual jobs from painting etc. Most farmers have multiple jobs through the year. For all we know a farmer has 20 acres. He gets 4 times the value for 10 acres and uses the proceeds to move into animal husbandry. In my village we used to grow onions. Now its all water buffellos and the village is much richer. The youth work in nearby Nashik in construction and earn more than what the family makes of the land. I dont want to offend you, but i dont think you know how farming works. Most farmers already have multiple jobs. Outside sowing and harvesting there are period when you have nothing to do so you do another job. And with the modi amendments the agri labours who dont own but still depend on it for livelihood wont even get any compensation . Industries need manual labour to be built. The idea is to get them working in the said factories. Do you think long term it is feasible for manual landless labourers to keep tilling small pieces of land? How much do you think the farmer pays them? With average holdings in India decreasing per year surely the farmer and his family will eventually find it easier to till the land themselves. Especially with the advent of mechanised farming. In that sense a tractor puts more manual labour out of work than the land bill ever will. To go back to my village, with the advent of Buffello farming nobody really needs manual labour. Keep in mind northern maha is probably one of the poorer parts of Maharashtra. Nashik division in general is below average Whats worse is the law allowed the corporate /local Gundas to just procure the lands on flimsy reasons for cheap and keep it without starting any projects and then sell it 2-3 years later for massive profits.Basically offically govt sanctioned real estate business for local gundas. I dont think the current land bill does that nor does its amendment. The problem seems to me a weak judiciary which allows said gundas to believe that they are above the law. There will always be exceptions. I am against the Jaitapur nuclear power plan. The reason is those are very fertile lands and i feel the nation will be best served if its still agricultural. There will always be stories about farmers being hoodwinked. You can make a law which is 100% fullproof.
Sachin=GOD Posted August 8, 2015 Posted August 8, 2015 its the firstpost' date=' i think i will skip it. decided not to read that sensationalist rag[/quote'] As I said earlier, read the piece.....then decide.
sourab10forever Posted August 8, 2015 Posted August 8, 2015 My cousins will grow up thinking the two houses of parliament are "lok sabha adjourned" and "rajya sabha adjourned".
Precambrian Posted August 8, 2015 Posted August 8, 2015 Read the piece at least. I used to ardently follow FP a few years back, when they were really good to read. Of late, its become just a rag. Sensationlist and bullshit.
Number Posted August 8, 2015 Posted August 8, 2015 Firstpoop worried of degarding quality of terrorist sent by Pakistan.
seedhi Posted August 8, 2015 Posted August 8, 2015 Firstpoop worried of degarding quality of terrorist sent by Pakistan.This is like mocking the people killed by these terrorists.
G_B_ Posted August 8, 2015 Posted August 8, 2015 Its sad in a way they probably did not get the hits their thoughtful articles deserved, so they decided to go down the sensationalist route The problem with firstpost is they dont generate their own news content. Most of the time its basically commenting on articles and news generated from proper newspapers. (mostly Indian express). There are tonnes of websites who do that. Scroll.in Niticentral they are like the plague. If i were the Firstpost I would invest in proper journalists on the ground and generate my own news stories. Maybe even do opinion polls. Then they can provide some hard hitting analysis.
BeautifulGame Posted August 9, 2015 Posted August 9, 2015 I am not going to lie. No i dont think we were at that time. My grandfather did grow some vegetables. But it was more to keep costs down rather than relying on it. But still 10% is highway robbery. But its not. He is going to get twice its value in urban and 4 times in rural areas thats 400%. Not 10%. If it was 10% i would be protesting against the bill. The real market value is much higher than the government fixed rates for lands.So no they get much lower prices than the market rates. The farmer keep the money in a government bank. Earn interest on the said money and at the same time do a manual job. In most cases the farmer will be financially better off. Most farmers dont just do farming. Apart from sowing and harvesting season they do indeed do manual jobs from painting etc. Most farmers have multiple jobs through the year. I dont want to offend you, but i dont think you know how farming works. Most farmers already have multiple jobs. Outside sowing and harvesting there are period when you have nothing to do so you do another job. You are only talking about Small and marginal farmers.These are the small and marginal farmers who struggle to make ends meet who venture out for other jobs .But they are always willing to sell their to move on .So why scrap the 80% consensus clause when they are willing to sell in the first place .I grew up in a village and have worked last 3 years in a rural bank.So i think i have decent knowledge of farmer issues Also in most of these S&M farmers tend to lease the land and do agriculture .Now with no SIA they won't get any relief either . Industries need manual labour to be built. The idea is to get them working in the said factories. Do you think long term it is feasible for manual landless labourers to keep tilling small pieces of land? How much do you think the farmer pays them? With average holdings in India decreasing per year surely the farmer and his family will eventually find it easier to till the land themselves. Especially with the advent of mechanised farming. In that sense a tractor puts more manual labour out of work than the land bill ever will. No one asks to stop building industries or create jobs.But do it in a socially responsible way by doing SIA and compensating labors depending on it .Even developed countries USA does SIA yet the govt want to scrap it in a country where nearly 70% depend on agriculture for income Blaming the problems of creating jobs by blaming farmers may help govt hide their incompetence and red tape but thats not the reality.53% lands acquired by Govt projects were laying waste in TN for instance becoz of various issue .Only 8% of projects in India are delayed in due land acquisition problems .So why completely scrap it rather than just reduce it 50% or something? I dont think the current land bill does that nor does its amendment. The problem seems to me a weak judiciary which allows said gundas to believe that they are above the law. No it does .Previously if the land was unsed for 5 years it should be returned to the farmer.Now that clause was scrapped by Modi govt .Now any corporate can just grab fertile farming lands where people refuse to sell but now have no choice and then sell it few years later for massive profits . Basically offically govt sanctioned real estate business for local gundas. There will always be exceptions. I am against the Jaitapur nuclear power plan. The reason is those are very fertile lands and i feel the nation will be best served if its still agricultural. There will always be stories about farmers being hoodwinked. You can make a law which is 100% fullproof. There can be reasonable reforms maybe reduce the consent clause to 50% set a reasonable time frame to complete SIA etc.But these amendments and completely scrapping Consent SIA return of unused land are a joke . And including private collages and hospitals in this seriously?
G_B_ Posted August 9, 2015 Posted August 9, 2015 The real market value is much higher than the government fixed rates for lands.So no they get much lower prices than the market rates. From what i understand government market values are based on previous sales in the area based on private transactions(i think this is the case, not 100% sure). Even if lets assume government sets market value at 50% of the actual value. In rural areas thats like still double of what the market value is. This is exactly why the government is keen to give farmer more than 100% of value of their land. Its to ensure that farmers at the very least get a just value for their land. You are only talking about Small and marginal farmers.These are the small and marginal farmers who struggle to make ends meet who venture out for other jobs .But they are always willing to sell their to move on .So why scrap the 80% consensus clause when they are willing to sell in the first place .I grew up in a village and have worked last 3 years in a rural bank.So i think i have decent knowledge of farmer issues The average holding in India is 4 acres. Majority of Indian farmer are small and marginal farmers. Decreasing land holdings biggest challenge for Indian agriculture: NABARD Our acreage has remained at 140 million hectares since 40 years but the number of farmers has increased from 7 crore to 14 crore. We are adding one crore farmers every five years. With smaller land at disposal, there is a decrease in farmers capacity to invest in land. With average land holding halved, the cost of getting inputs and time consumed has doubled. If these are not tackled now, it will be difficult to maintain agriculture as a feasible profession. http://articles.economictimes.indiatimes.com/2013-08-24/news/41444004_1_indian-agriculture-one-crore-farmers-farmers-capacitye the land and do agriculture They lease the land then they need to pay somebody right? Again just like landless labourers they will benefit from industries coming up. No one asks to stop building industries or create jobs.But do it in a socially responsible way by doing SIA and compensating labors depending on it .Even developed countries USA does SIA yet the govt want to scrap it in a country where nearly 70% depend on agriculture for income USA has abundant land. Also, as posted earlier in this thread, USA also has laws which takes land away via a forced purchase. Blaming the problems of creating jobs by blaming farmers may help govt hide their incompetence and red tape but thats not the reality.53% lands acquired by Govt projects were laying waste in TN for instance becoz of various issue .Only 8% of projects in India are delayed in due land acquisition problems .So why completely scrap it rather than just reduce it 50% or something? Is there something stopping you from passing a land bill and also cutting government incompetence? Its a simple question. Do you think its sustainable, do you think so many people depending on agriculture is sustainable. That 8% is also a misleading figure. What is the value of those projects which are delayed? POSCO for example pulled out of Odisha. That was a multi billion dollar project. Most often the really big ticket projects need 1000s of acres. Its equivalent to saying one university filled 1000 patents. Another filed one patent and the value of that one patent is much more than the 1000. No it does .Previously if the land was unsed for 5 years it should be returned to the farmer.Now that clause was scrapped by Modi govt .Now any corporate can just grab fertile farming lands where people refuse to sell but now have no choice and then sell it few years later for massive profits . Basically offically govt sanctioned real estate business for local gundas. The earlier law was pretty useless as well. Sharad Pawar did this in the 90s. he bought land and then just paid somebody to till it to show it was in use. Its not as if the earlier law cannot be twisted with. "Unused" is a vague term. It was scrapped cause it was unenforceable law. There can be reasonable reforms maybe reduce the consent clause to 50% set a reasonable time frame to complete SIA etc.But these amendments and completely scrapping Consent SIA return of unused land are a joke . And including private collages and hospitals in this seriously? The problem with the consent cause is , NGOs often take the issues to court. It is yet another scope for red tape. Why are you so against private collages? They too generate jobs. A farmer can for example get a job as a compounder cleaner etc in a well run private college or even hospital and end up making more than working the land. Anything that genrates jobs in rural area much be welcome.
asterix Posted August 10, 2015 Posted August 10, 2015 RaGa has levelled some serious corruption charges on Suhma Swaraj and her family... I hope the gloves should be off now and BJP should retaliate... Get CBI on the case of Gandhi family corruption.... :hitler:
G_B_ Posted August 10, 2015 Posted August 10, 2015 Mulayam breaks away from opposition lobby. has mulayam toed any line? Its odd Nitish is blocking parliament. But Mulayam wants "debate" I was reading about how Kalam became president. BJP did not have numbers. ABV called Mulayam and that was the end of that. Mulayams ego was stroked and the other to whom he had given his word bit the dust. I dont know why people keep talking about a third front with MSY. Slippery M Fecker. If Modi gives MSY bharat ratna i think netaji will even vote for uniform civil code.
Sachin=GOD Posted August 11, 2015 Posted August 11, 2015 @Minhaz Merchant For a decade Sonia pulled a corrupt UPA govt's strings behind MMS' shadow. It's taken this session to remove the veil. I must say that in this matter it has not been a wasted session.
Khalpat Posted August 11, 2015 Posted August 11, 2015 @Minhaz Merchant For a decade Sonia pulled a corrupt UPA govt's strings behind MMS' shadow. It's taken this session to remove the veil. I must say that in this matter it has not been a wasted session. So we can say it was not Modi who fell into Rahul's trap but it was opposite. Some of the Congress strategist will have to be more present on Social Media, not only to tweet but also to get a feel as to what is the real issue, what should be raised and how much an issue needs to be shouted upon. Lalit Modi was never an Ajmal Kasab means he is not a very unpopular person in India, so they should have realized long back that public sentiment would not be so much against Sushma Swaraj or the government on this matter. This whole saga of disruption has given a brilliant opportunity for government to showcase Congress in more bad light, this also showed JDU poorer. they should have not been so visible on TV screen for this issue. TMC, BJD, AIADMK and even SP have come out as winner in this whole drama. Now this has made sure that on any next such issue which obviously will be provided by government , BJP will be able to play victim card.
Sachin=GOD Posted August 11, 2015 Posted August 11, 2015 So we can say it was not Modi who fell into Rahul's trap but it was opposite. Some of the Congress strategist will have to be more present on Social Media, not only to tweet but also to get a feel as to what is the real issue, what should be raised and how much an issue needs to be shouted upon. Lalit Modi was never an Ajmal Kasab means he is not a very unpopular person in India, so they should have realized long back that public sentiment would not be so much against Sushma Swaraj or the government on this matter. This whole saga of disruption has given a brilliant opportunity for government to showcase Congress in more bad light, this also showed JDU poorer. they should have not been so visible on TV screen for this issue. TMC, BJD, AIADMK and even SP have come out as winner in this whole drama. Now this has made sure that on any next such issue which obviously will be provided by government , BJP will be able to play victim card. BJP is the one at fault here. Cong is corrupt, shameless and does not care for the country so it is expected that they will play politics over any and all schemes that could benefit the country (and with that, also benefit BJP). It is BJP which is letting a party with 44 seats get away with all this bullsh!t. BJP, and not Cong, should go and tell people all over the country how Cong has hijacked the Govt's development efforts by not letting parliament function. Modi, supposedly the greatest communicator in the country, has been sitting quietly without uttering a word and letting fools like Sambit Patra defend the party in the media. That is just inexplicable. BJP used social media so brilliantly in the campaign - why the hell are they not using the same to inform the public that Cong is not letting them pass bills.
Khalpat Posted August 11, 2015 Posted August 11, 2015 BJP is the one at fault here. Cong is corrupt, shameless and does not care for the country so it is expected that they will play politics over any and all schemes that could benefit the country (and with that, also benefit BJP). It is BJP which is letting a party with 44 seats get away with all this bullsh!t. BJP, and not Cong, should go and tell people all over the country how Cong has hijacked the Govt's development efforts by not letting parliament function. Modi, supposedly the greatest communicator in the country, has been sitting quietly without uttering a word and letting fools like Sambit Patra defend the party in the media. That is just inexplicable. BJP used social media so brilliantly in the campaign - why the hell are they not using the same to inform the public that Cong is not letting them pass bills. They are using the platform but yes you are correct they are not using it as aggressivley as they should and the reason I think is till the time session is in progress they do not want to be too much critical of opposition. If they will not be able to get the GST pass in this session then I think PM will make a speech the last day on floor of the house and then they will all start in full flow. I still have the feeling that something good will happen in next two days. Congress would not want to take the blame and let government play victim card. It is still 4 years for the next election.
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